Official 2012 Nadeshiko Japan Thread [R] - part I

Discussion in 'Japan' started by Micol, Jan 3, 2012.

  1. unepomme

    unepomme Member+

    Jan 21, 2010
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
  2. hirohiro

    hirohiro Member+

    Dec 29, 2011
    Brighton, UK
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    England
  3. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    :D:D:D Thanks very much, Micol & Virany! Now, all I have to do is buying the ticket. :cool:

    (By the way, I guess that the fact that they say that "FFF recommends buying the tickets at Carrefour" doesn't mean that they are sold also in carrefours here in Italy, does it? :confused: I can try, but I doubt it... :unsure:)

    Edit: oh, by the way, Virany: you will be there too? And if yes, who will you be cheering for? France or Japan? :sneaky: (I know it's sneaky question)
     
  4. And G

    And G Member+

    Jan 31, 2010
    Club:
    Okayama Yunogo Belle
    Yaaay, Kawashima! And other people. ^_^


    Hell yeah! The Barca style 4-3-3 is definitely what fits the Nadeshiko the most. I've been hoping for this for years, in fact on several occasions posting about it with a very similar line-up, just with Ando on the right wing and Ohno on the left when Kawasumi wasn't an option yet. With her in the team it makes even more sense now.

    Takase playing right back is interesting, too; especially considering she was playing defensive midfield previously. There must be something Sasaki sees in her I fail to notice. Personally, I would have made Ando the Kinga replacement; she did a good job as a right back some years ago, and with the front three of Kawasumi-Nagasato-Ohno she would not be missed there in case of an injured Kinga if sufficient forward alternatives (Iwabuchi, Maruyama, Yamaguchi) were available. I think it's most important to be able to bring in fresh creative attacking power during matches, so I'm all in favor of recycling forwards as potential backups for wing backs and midfielders.


    You know what's funny? When someone compared one of the goals scored last week to Kaihori's blunder against New Zealand, I thought "wait, that blunder from Kaihori was horrible, but it was a completely different situa— oh, he meant that other NZ game."

    So that's already two blunders that should never happen at this level of play. Since you said you've never seen Kaihori single-handedly throw away a game, I'd like to remind you of her basically giving away the 2010 AFC semifinal to Australia, which, if not for Miyama, might have resulted in Japan not even competing for the World Cup. That's right, the future World Champions on the brink of not qualifying due to what can only be described as horrible goalkeeping. Kaihori has played fewer international matches than Fukumoto and had an incredible back line in front of her during the World Cup, yet we see tons of these blunders. Oh, and did you watch the Algarve Cup final against Germany?

    I fail to see how you can basically say that Fukumoto makes more blunders than Kaihori. Seriously, I don't get it. At all.

    How I see it...
    Shot stopping: Fukumoto > Kaihori
    Positioning: Fukumoto > Kaihori
    Libero play: Fukumoto = Kaihori
    Aerial presence: Fukumoto = Kaihori
    Penalties: Fukumoto < Kaihori
    Height: Fukumoto < Kaihori
    Consistency: Fukumoto > Kaihori

    And as much as I appreciate Kaihori's PK stopping ability in hindsight, especially considering the poor quality of Nagasato's and Sakaguchi's kicks, it's still not something I would want to be basing my future GK selection on if I were Sasaki.
     
  5. Virany

    Virany Member

    Nov 6, 2011
    France
    Club:
    Olympique de Marseille
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    I'm torn ;_;. But yeah, I'll be happy for any results (I'll watch it in Stadium too)...
     
  6. Virany

    Virany Member

    Nov 6, 2011
    France
    Club:
    Olympique de Marseille
    Nat'l Team:
    Japan
    She can't be bullied heh ;).
     
  7. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    I think the only reason Sasaki is thinking 4-3-3, is thanks to all the injury problems with his forwards. It actually makes sense for Japan to look at a 4-3-3, given they never actually used a rigid 4-4-2 system anyway.

    With Ando around, and Miyama's movement, Sasaki had his team always playing with 3 centre mids, but it's nice to hear that the teams plan B is something a lot of them should be very comfortable with.

    It's funny, but not surprising, that we see Takase regularly brought into the national squad to be anything but a creative force :rolleyes:. Her physique, and technique, all suggest that she's a future defensive mid, but right back.....:alien: Who knows though, she's probably already equal to the other Kinga understudies, so Sasaki could have a real trick up his sleeve, by converting an ordinary attacker, into a brilliant defensive option :sneaky:.

    Seriously o_O, your going to tell me that 2 huge mistakes, seen by the whole world in the same game, still go unnoticed, next to a GK who makes one or two errors her defenders can deal with? :confused:

    Kaihori's WWC qualifier mistake was actually very redeemable, if not for her defenders also going through the Keystone Cops routine of defending :rolleyes:. Once in a while, she's likely to make those kinds of errors, but what young GK isn't? Since then, at her worst, she's never made a mistake as obviously bad, or as significant, as that WWC qualifier vs Australia, and she's never committed the sin of repeating such mistakes twice in the same game either.

    Yeah, Fukumoto has her pro's over Kaihori, but I have never seen Fukumoto look as composed as Kaihori looked during the monster tussles vs Germany, and USA, in last years WC either. I mean mentioning the Algarve cup final:giggle: as a reason for Kaihori's fall from grace is pretty weak, when you consider just how unnaturally open and enjoyable that game was for both teams, with the German keeper actually committing the biggest error of the Game too, allowing Nagasato to equalise off a gift in the closing stages :rolleyes:.

    If Kaihori ever gets beat by multiple hit and hope goofy shots/crosses/miss hits, in the same game, at hugely important moment's of hugely important games, without allowing her defenders to help rectify the blunders too, then we can talk about Fukumoto being a real #1 candidate again. Until that time, you have to understand that Fukumoto blew her big moment, and dashed the then emerging Nadeshiko chances, at producing a major stun the world run 3 years before the WWC, while it was Kaihori who stayed calm and error free when it mattered most, in a far tougher set of circumstances, during the worlds biggest women's sport event ;).
     
  8. And G

    And G Member+

    Jan 31, 2010
    Club:
    Okayama Yunogo Belle
    Right, because blunders only count if they happen in the same game, unless defenders save the day or the GK on the other side is playing even worse, in which case they don't count at all.

    ... wait, what?
     
  9. Batfink

    Batfink Member+

    May 23, 2010
    Attilan
    Club:
    Manchester United FC
    Japan were 1-2 down, but playing really well, when all of a sudden Fukumoto gets beat with two efforts that wouldn't have looked out of place in a school playground :rolleyes:, not an Olympic semi final :speechless:.

    Kaihori dropping the ball, leading to her two defenders kicking the air instead of the ball, was horrible for everybody concerned in that sequence of events, but it was also a mistake that could have been rectified with actions every player would expect to make on 9 out of 10 occasions too.

    So as bad as you think Kaihori is, she's never been the single culprit for events that conspired to lose Japan an important match, but she has been at the centre of one very major event, where she helped Japan win more than one important match along the way too. Where are those games or moments with Fukumoto in goal?
     
  10. unepomme

    unepomme Member+

    Jan 21, 2010
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
    In fact, you sound ugly when you pick out past failures of both GKs.

    Fukumoto improved after the last Olympics, realizing her short points.
    Kaihori has made some critical mistakes, but it was not critical in a true sense.

    She was great when the greatness was most required.
     
  11. And G

    And G Member+

    Jan 31, 2010
    Club:
    Okayama Yunogo Belle
    It seems pretty obvious we're just not going to agree on this, mostly because we're assigning different weight to different things. Let me just make the closing statement that after the World Cup, I was actually considering the possibility that Kaihori had gotten somewhat consistent, which I also stated once or twice in this thread, but the Algarve Cup made me rethink that position. That Kaihori's blunders seldomly proved ultimately critical seems to be more a matter of luck rather than skill to me, and against Germany that luck apparently had run out.

    Maybe I'm just being pessimistic, but I don't see this ending well. Either way, I don't see any meaning in continuing this.
     
  12. TabascoT

    TabascoT Member

    Dec 1, 2011
    San Francisco, California
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  13. zaku_II

    zaku_II Member+

    Jan 29, 2012
    Club:
    CD Colo Colo
    Quoted for truth.

    For me, at the NT Kaihori has an asset that Fukumoto lacks:

    [​IMG]

    More phisical presence. At L-league Fukumoto can be arguably better, but at a highern level Kaihori has more qualities to offer.

    ...and I 'm not a fan of Kaihori.

    I am confident that Sasaki will pick at wich is in better shape
     
  14. unepomme

    unepomme Member+

    Jan 21, 2010
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
  15. mumf

    mumf Member+

    Nov 7, 2008
    Also on YT here (includes 2 x Nao)
    But I prefer - may I ask what does Sasaki say here about the squad ?

    I watched the 1st half of INAC v Bereza on Wavester's (Tx again) files again - and so far it is highly entertaining. The 1st 20 minutes belonged to INAC, the rest to Beleza. Things I noticed:

    1. Why were the Kyokawa shirts in Italian or Spanish?
    2. Sawa not so influential, but still plays all over the field. I hope she has not lost speed.
    3. Kiryu + Asano are both good players, and seemed to me to be as influential as Iwabuchi. That long perfect pass to Kiryu we saw in the highlights - that was Asano. I had not seen much of Kiryu before (did she make an u-20 WWC team?) except for some late NT sub-ins, and was surprised how good, fast/aggressive she was coming out of MF, even beating Sawa. Earlier a fantastic cross-pass had given Ito a golden chance. I cant believe Maruyama has what either has to offer.
    4. Very interesting was the 25th and 26th minute, take a look. In 25th, Takase works the ball to top-right corner, turns to face Hara. She tries to beat her, but Hara comes away with the ball. I know everyone is down on Takase, and she is not cute, but I dont think she is a replacement for Kinga. And Hara - she seldom misses a pass.
    5. The 26th minute - is the 1st time Mana breaks into the box, running on goal from the left. But something is wrong, she will not shoot with her left foot, or even use it to touch the ball. Then about 10 minutes later, in the highlight where she goes around Kinga, again she will not touch the ball with her left foot. Now, as far as I could see, its her right foot that gets injured. So the whole thing is bizarre to my eyes - has she problems with both feet?
     
  16. mumf

    mumf Member+

    Nov 7, 2008
    I see there has been another big GK argument - because its the team big problem.. I agree with everything you say, and so would Junko Kai a few weeks ago - here - although for these two games, I expect a 50-50 split, in usual Sasaki fashion.
     
  17. mumf

    mumf Member+

    Nov 7, 2008
    blissett, I did not "label" you, but last week you claimed that you "had said multiple times,...that I think Kaihori should remain the starter" - here
     
  18. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Anyone else will come down in Paris for the match? Micol? ;)
     
  19. And G

    And G Member+

    Jan 31, 2010
    Club:
    Okayama Yunogo Belle
    Because of "Leonessa", I think?
     
  20. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Zaku_II, it was a nice pic the one you found, I hadn't seen it previously... Judging from the jerseys, I suppose it's from the 2011 WWC final, but I don't remember that action, with Kaihori grabbing the ball while Kumagai and Wambach wer jumping for it... At which minute did it happen? o_O

    Can't help you about that, mumf, but I can tell you that Kumagai with wet hair from the rain is very pretty. :p (especially now that she has slightly longer hair :giggle:)

    Yes, but, if you mind, what I said was in the context of praising a Fukumoto's performance, that seems to me a sign that I am unbiased.
    I explained my reasonment behind saying that I don't want to change Kaihori as a starter: since I don't think anyone of the GKs showed a clear edge on the other one, I'd leave the hierarchy as established in the 2011 WWC. But it's not a case of me thinking that Kaihori is definitely better than Fukumoto in any circumstances, nor a case of Kaihori fan-dom: I am open to change, but I don't think there were enough reasons to change at the moment.
     
  21. unepomme

    unepomme Member+

    Jan 21, 2010
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
    Completely good adult's attitude.
    I really appreciate your opinion.

    I think anyone arguing which is better forget if one of them is injured during the competition you have to rely on the other.

    I definitely want to see them win the gold medal, so desperately need both of them.
     
  22. unepomme

    unepomme Member+

    Jan 21, 2010
    Club:
    Sanfrecce Hiroshima FC
    "At the Algarbe, they were unexpectedly good. I had thought I would make them gradually better while scolding them after their bad performance, but they were relatively good."

    "Do you think Japan is superior now?"
    "No, not at all. The US tried more organized defence style in April. They became more accurate in defence, so we have to play more audaciously with faster pass speed to run their blockade. Anyway the most important thing is to improve the quality of our passing football."

    "I can think of 60 % or 70 % of the members now."
     
  23. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    I like the fact that, compared to other National Teams, that have already defined their list, there are still some places in contention in Nadeshiko Japan. The overall quality of japanese players became very high in years, and it's only fair that Sasaki takes all the time he needs to decide about the last pieces in this puzzle.
     
  24. Micol

    Micol Member+

    Sep 16, 2008
    Still thinking about it... but unlikely.
     
  25. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Happy 25th birthday, sweet Ms. Aya Sameshima... :inlove: :inlove: :inlove:

    [​IMG]
     

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