PBP: Xavi Vs Pirlo

Lol! You are a little too harsh on Ronaldinho, it may be true that his peak was relatively short but at his peak he was arguably better than all the players mentioned above. Even the best in the last 20 years. Could have been better for Brazil though.

 

Please ... you know not much about Brazil football .. to say the LEAST
at least acording to what you said ...

Let me tell you the FACT:
1- NT": Ronaldinho was best player and top scorer at Confed 1999 , and he was easily the best playmaker (young) at WC2002. His WC2006 was disappointed but if one saw him before that would NEVER say like you did PERIOD

2- Club? Ronaldinho top form put Kaka top form in the dirt .. and he won 2 WPOY for that ... Kaka was LUCKY to win ballon dor and WPOY at 2007 for 4 great games of UCL2007 ...
Ronnie brought Barca back to the best in mid 2000's

 

The Confed is a lower competition, i talk about WC/AC/EC.
The best playmaker of wc 2002?
he has just a great game against England an nothing more, Pirlo, Xavi, Iniesta proved in Nt a lot more than him, to said the truth even in clubs.
In Wc of 2006, when it had to be decisive for the National Team he was very very poor, probably the worst player of the Brazilian team.


Kakà was the man of Cl of 2007 he is a fact

Ronaldhinio never had a tournament like this, is a fact.

Ronaldhinio was avarage in the Cl of 2006 very inconsistent, very poor in the final and he also had a better team than Kakà.


The Cl of Kakà in 2007 was in same level with that of Messi in 2011

 

Confed is a low competition? ust becuase Xavi and his co LOST it (even after won Euro and WC)? Pleeeeez

Now, for your info: Ronaldinho won MVP of UCL2006, like it or not ... but do not say something nonesense!

 

Yes, Xavi was significantly better (and stronger) than Pirlo in tight spaces, which is why Xavi could do things that Pirlo could never do. Xavi could boss the midfield not only with intelligent passing, but with his physical presence. Pirlo never had the physical presence of Xavi, and, again, Xavi at the Euro 2008 was far better than Pirlo at the 2012 Euro.

It is clear to me that the opinions of most people are very fickle indeed. The great performance by Pirlo vs England at the 2012 Euro, is rather recent and I think has significantly influenced the votes. But again, Xavi at the 2008 Euro was better, and had more than just one or two great performances to show for himself.

Pirlo beats Xavi, I would argue, in long shots, long air passes, and free kicks. On the other hand, I would argue that Xavi being significantly better (and stronger) at shielding the ball in tight spaces, is a better and more consistent skill-set than what Pirlo has to offer. Xavi's shielding was always great, against every opponent, when Xavi was at his best. Pirlo, even at his best, often had games in which he really could not make such a great use of his amazing long passing ability -- this is because "long ball passing" does not work against every opponent, it would rarely work against a Mourinho "park-the-buss" team; on the other hand, Xavi's main qualities always worked against all opponents.

Essentially, I think the key difference between Xavi and Pirlo is that, Pirlo at his best often depends on the tactical formation of the opponent (Pirlo will look much better against a team such as England, which plays the EPL type of football with a high defensive line, therefore allowing Pirlo to use his long ball ability to full effect); on the other hand, Xavi can deliver his best form against any opponent, be that Mourinho's Real Madrid, or Alex Ferguson's Manchester United, or Arsene Wenger's Arsenal, it doesn't matter, Xavi can deliver his best form against any type of opponent. This is why I think that Xavi at his best was clearly better than any version of Pirlo, even if Pirlo was better than Xavi at a couple of skills.

 

I do not know where you got that idea? Pirlo was WELL PROVEN from Milan to Juve (two different team clubs) and from Italy WC06 to Italy Eruo2012 = two different teams.

1- Xavi in other hand NEVER been proven outside of the likes Villa/Torres Iniesta/Fabregas Pedro Puyol /Busquets/Pique .... OK?

2- Xavi was struggling against strong MF teams (MF dominant + pressing) of Bayern, Chelsea Aletico, Brazil , Chile, Argentina .... = FACT

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I do not mind many rated Xavi as betetr player, and I can even agree (because he won many more) but to say something off the chart is not helpful in argument

 

Yeah, we all watched how Pirlo "proved" himself when he was completely average against Spain in the Euro 2012 Final. What happened to him that day? Definitely wasn't the same Pirlo who was taking advantage of England's high defensive line, that's for sure.

James, do you have any idea why AC Milan sold Pirlo? I will give you a hint, it was not, not, not, because Pirlo was playing great, I can guarantee you that. One person who I know from a long time who is a ridiculously faithful AC Milan fan, gave up on Pirlo, because Pirlo's last two seasons with AC Milan were not good. I guess AC Milan also gave up on Pirlo for the same reasons, and it worked out for the best as the change of environment has been good for Pirlo's career.

Xavi is now clearly past it, but at his best he proved himself against all teams. Xavi has proven himself at the Euro, La Liga, Champions League, and the World Cup -- can you please explain to me what else he needs to do to "prove" himself? And may I ask, did Pele ever proved anything outside of Brazil/Santos? Pele is similar to Xavi, Pele played with a great Santos team, Pele also played with a great Brazil team, and yet, why do you criticize Xavi for something that Pele himself was also guilty of? I don't get it?

By the way, Xavi struggling against Bayern, is old Xavi, that isn't Xavi at his best. Do you remember Pirlo against that very same Bayern Munich team? In the same Champions League season, Pirlo gave an (unintentional) assist to a Bayern player -- Xavi has never made such a glaring mistake, not ever, in his entire career (let alone in such an important Champions League game).



Above you can appreciate one of Pirlo's worst ever performances, against -- Bayern Munich in season 2013/2014, the very same season that Xavi struggled against that same Bayern Munich team. Though, it has to be said that Pirlo's performance was worst than Xavi's performance, Pirlo even gave an assist for the first Bayern goal.

James, all your arguments against Xavi are ridiculous. Honestly, your bias against all players from Barcelona, is just so obvious it really doesn't merit an argument.

 

no actually the other way around, many Barca fans or younger fans are BIASED to overrated Xavi ... just becuase he won things with Barca and Spain ...

I do not care hwo Pirlo was sold ... but the fact he was playing great and was KEY player for both teams MIlan and Juve - period
BTW Pirlo was not that young and even older than Xavi so?

Every player has some bad games... Pirlo or Xavi ...
I just named a few bad games to against your claim: Xavi deliver great performance against any opponents ... = NOT TRUE

He is not PELE and only Pele could claim that (not even Maradona Cruijff)

 

James I'm sorry but that doesn't make sense, honestly. Of course Xavi performed to the limits of his capacity against all the opponents that he faced when he was at his best. That doesn't make him better than Pele, it just means that Xavi could produce his best form against any type of opponent.

I don't know why you think that every conceivable thing has something to do with Pele, but Xavi most certainly delivered great performances against most top opponents, it's a shame that you somehow missed Xavi in your obsession with all things Pele/Brazil. You do understand, that a great performance by Xavi, and a great performance by Pele, are different things, right?

 

No mate, I am sorry for you ... too /// he struggled many times vs many teams
Xavi could NOT perform TWICE at Confederation Cup vs USA 2009, and then Brazil 2013, vs Portugal 2010, vs Argentina 2011, ....

Xavi could not perform in 8games vs Chelsea, 3games vs Bayern and 3games vs Aletico this season ...

and those were just so obvious to my short memory. Now did those games take away any credits from his greatness? NO, or not much ... but fact said he did have difficult moment period

Please never mention Xavi next to Pele ... 2 level higher ...

 

James, your short memory apparently is not only short, but also very inconsistent, a very bad combination in my opinion. Xavi is now past it -- does your short memory go back to the 2009/2010 and 2010/2011 seasons? Because that's when Xavi was at his best. At his best, Xavi delivered his best form against all type of teams, he was easily the most consistent midfielder we have seen in who knows how many years. Xavi at his best was two times more consistent than Zinedine Zidane ever was.

As for Pele -- Pele did not produce a good performance against England in 1970, his performance against Italy in 1970 was also not a good performance (scoring one goal and giving one assist does not change the fact that his dribbling and general play was just very average against Italy). Instead, Pele's best performance came against the Czech Republic, in comparison, Xavi delivered his best world cup performance against a top class opponent such as Germany (this after Germany comfortably defeated Argentina by a 4-0 margin; and after Germany also defeated England by a 4-1 margin).

James, you are applying double standards, you are crucifying Xavi for every friendly game in which he did not produced anything near his best form, you are crucifying Xavi because he was surrounded by quality players, and yet, you fail to do the same thing with Pele. Xavi and Pele play different positions, you do understand that, right? I only compared Pele's circumstances (played with great teams throughout his career, and Brazil did in fact win a world cup without Pele's help in 1962) with Xavi's circumstances, and now, you are trying to act as if Pele and Xavi are not comparable when the fact is that I never compared Pele and Xavi in terms of their actual value as players. As usual, your arguments against Xavi are based on fiction.

James, you can continue living in your own fantasy world in which your short memory apparently only registered the recent bad performances by Xavi -- suit yourself, I don't care, I for one feel satisfied by the fact that you have proven beyond any doubt that your opinion about anything concerning Xavi Hernandez is completely worthless on the basis that you clearly know nothing about Xavi.

 

First at least I got my "short Memory" while some of you are totally delusional

Pele had a poor performance vs England? LOL did you really watch that game or only look for who scored?
Pele's header alone has MADE BANKS so famous ... (as one of the best save ever) OK? Who assisted Jaizinho in the winner goal in that game? Pele - (it;s been a while but I could be wrong that he also it the post there- but let me recheck)

Like I said NEVER compared Xavi to PELE ... One is among the VERY TOP big games player in history (if not the best) and the otehr won things thanks to his team mates ...as a TEAM.

Let STICK with Xavi vs Pirlo as a legitimate comparison in SAME CLASS OK?

 

Xavi vs Pirlo is perhaps a draw, although, in my opinion: Pirlo is arguably better at long balls, long range shots, free kicks, and style; on the other hand, Xavi is arguably almost just as good as Pirlo is at long balls, but in addition Xavi is significantly better than Pirlo in terms of shielding or, in other words, Xavi's value as a "stationary" technician is significantly superior when compared to Pirlo's value at the same skill. So I think, overall, that Xavi does have a very slight advantage over Pirlo.

As a negative to Xavi, because he had better physical presence than Pirlo, his decline has been more "visible" than Pirlo -- Xavi can no longer dominate the way used to, he no longer has the physical power to do what made him such a great midfielder. On the other hand, Pirlo with his game of positioning and passing, his decline hasn't been as obvious as Xavi's, and some would even argue that Pirlo is still just as good as he was two or three years ago. In any case, I hope both Xavi and Pirlo can roll back the years at this world cup, both are all-time class midfielders who were underrated for many years.

 

that's fair and I agree

 

VERSUS

Xavi's Characteristics
+ Strengths
Passing = Very Strong
Key passes = Strong
Through balls = Strong
Long shots= Strong
Direct free kicks = Strong
Taking set-pieces= Strong
Concentration= Strong
- Weaknesses
Tackling = Very Weak
Aerial Duels = Weak

 

Pirlo is a genius, Zidane is overrated like Ronaldhinio.

 

The comments you have used to praise Xavi while bashing Pirlo is absolutely absolutely ridiculous. Even though，Pirlo and Xavi have similar roles but they come from different environments and hence play different styles of football. The video you showed of Pirlo was a 2012-13 CL Quarter final match against Bayern，a time that Pirlo has far passed his prime. It is not your fault for not watching enough of Pirlo while he was at his prime. Please remember, Pirlo was by far a better player at his prime 2004-2007 than in 2012-13. Pirlo has been the sole playmaker for Italy and Juventus for almost ten years following the aging of Gattuso and the retirement of Totti. Whereas Xavi was surrounded by the likes of Alonso, Busquets, Fabregas, Silva, Iniesta at NT and Messi, Henry, Eto'o at Barca, so it was not surprising that Xavi has been very dominant in possession. Back when Pirlo was surrounded by the likes of Kaka, Seedorf, Gattuso, Camorensi, Perrotta, TOTTI which are not at the level of Xavi's teammates, Pirlo was in every way as dominant as Xavi. Although, the styles exhibited by both players were very different.

Spain 4-0 Italy? Vs a Pirlo that has far passed his prime and surrounded by the likes of De Rossi and Marchiso. So what? While I admit Xavi was phenomenal in that match, but against the likes of De Rossi and Marchiso surrounding Pirlo while you are surrounded by your quality teammates of Alonso, Busquets, Fabregas, Silva, Iniesta isn't worthy Something to brag about. Even Zidane can't do anything in that situation. If you are using the same argument, I can easily say Schweinsteiger 7-0 Xavi, Sneijder 5-1 Xavi, Sneijder 3-1 Xavi as examples. Where was Xavi's dominace in those matches against Schweinsteiger, Sneijder or a against a 34-Year Old Zidane in WC 2006 besides passing the ball sideways to forge a "beautiful" stats on possession? Even when he was surrounded by his world-class teammates as usual.

Remember, Possession of the ball doesn't = Possession of the match, it ultimately lies on how you transform this possession advantage to create chances.

I'm not bashing Xavi in this post, he is certainly one of the best midfielders of this generation, but I'm just so annoyed by the ones that bash Pirlo to brag Xavi.

I would like to see how Xavi could perform against Pirlo in the Euro 2012 Final if he and Pirlo switch teams or when Pirlo is surrounded by a group of teammates that are close in qualities to those that surrounded Xavi. Let say it would be certainly interesting and fair to see how a 2006 Italy team consists of Prime Pirlo(a significantly better version than the Euro 2012)with TOTTI, Zambrotta, Gattuso, Camorensi, Perrotta, Cannavaro, Del PIERO, Toni would match up against a 2010 Spain team consists of Prime Xavi with Iniesta, Alonso, Fabregas, Busquets, Silva, Torres, Villa

 

Pirlo vs Liverpool at the CL Final in 2005 (that Liverpool won) was not great, certainly not as great as Xavi was in the CL Finals of 2009 and 2011. And Pirlo (vs Liverpool) was in fact surrounded by the superior teammates: Kaka, Sheva, Crespo, Seedorf, Nesta -- by all means a dream team... but Pirlo wasn't very good, and AC Milan was beaten by the underdog (i.e. Steven Gerrard's Liverpool).

Say what you will about Xavi, but Xavi never lost a Final the way Pirlo lost that CL Final in 2005.

 

Xavi did however lose a semi final in the most ridiculous way against Chelsea in 2012. He too was surrounded by superior teammates, and Chelsea were fairly weak.

Meanwhile, Xavi got benched in Barcelona's 2006 final against Arsenal. That's right, he didn't even get subbed on. Rijkaard started Edmilson ahead of him.

At a similar age (26), Pirlo was almost always a regular starter for AC Milan unless he got injured or suspended, and Milan were just as strong as Barcelona 10 years ago.

Xavi's prime was short. Between 2008 and 2012, he did win a ridiculous amount of accolades in that four year span, but declined rather rapidly after that.

Pirlo was better between 2003 to 2007. He won two Champions Leagues and a World Cup in this period of time. Then Xavi was better from 2008 to 2012, where he won two Champions Leagues, Euro Cups, and a World Cup.

They peaked differently, Pirlo at the age of about 27 (2006) and Xavi at the age of 30 (2010). However, Pirlo still looked great at the age of 35, while Xavi had lost it by then.

Pirlo was better and more influential for Juventus in the twilight of his career than Xavi was for Barcelona, Pirlo aged better.

 

Pirlo has never suffered a defeat of 7-0 or 5-1 when surrounded by the quality of teammates equivalent to that of Villa, Messi, Buquests, Iniesta and/or Alonso, Silva, Fabregas.

No doubt about Xavi's technical ability and dominace in possession, but to say he is better than the 2003-07 version of Pirlo on individual level, no! Hell no!

 

That's fair enough but, obviously, I disagree. Xavi 2012-13 was clearly better than Pirlo 2012-13; Xavi 2013-14 was also clearly better than Pirlo 2013-14. I think 2011-12 was Pirlo's last hurrah, with the Euro'12 being the very final point of it. By 2012-13 it was clear that Pirlo was well past it, one or two good long balls didn't do enough to hide the fact that Pirlo could no longer cover the required miles.

As for Pirlo being "more influential for Juve" is as misleading as it is entirely redundant... If "twilight of his career" Pirlo played in the same team as Messi and Iniesta, said version of Pirlo would be less influential. Similarly, had Xavi played for Juventus, you can rest assured that Xavi would've been "more influential" as well.

At the end of the day, it's pretty obvious that Pirlo never dominated club football like Xavi did. Pirlo never was as consistent as prime Xavi was. And that's why Xavi will probably be ranked above Pirlo in most of them all-time lists. Fans like you, of course, will hype Pirlo into a player Pirlo never actually was. But again: I won't be surprised in the slightest when Xavi ends up above Pirlo in the all-time lists.

 

Fanboys like you will elevate Xavi to the level of Zidane, when in fact a prime Xavi was beaten helplessly by a 34-year old Zidane. Fans like you will elevate Xavi to the level of Zidane when surrounded by the likes of Messi, Villa, Busquets, Iniesta was beaten 7-0 by Schweinsteiger. Fans like you will elevate Xavi by bashing Pirlo with nonsense. Fans like you are just too young, too simple and too naive.

 

Them fightin' words!! Are you @carlito86 in disguise?

 

Xavi just makes top 50 all time(luckily)
It wouldn't be right if not a single player from the greatest European national team ever wasn't in the list.
Zidane was a cut above xavi (or several)
Big goals in big moments
technically/entertainment value
his peak level performance was incomparable to anything xavi showed in his career.imo
@Pipiolo