Re: Re: WUSA shuts down Mike, I agree with your post, but the problem is you are distorting what Spartacus is saying, because he's saying almost exactly the same thing you are. He ain't on no cross, dude.
Ultimately, what did in WUSA (though I still hold out hope for a last second reprieve or a second coming in 2005) is the same thing that did in the USA/NPSL, the NASL, several of the indoor leagues and almost did in MLS. Namely, some people see an event (1966 & 1994 World Cups, 1999 WWC and Pele Mania) and draw the wrong conclusions. They think that all they need to do is put a team on a field and they will get rich. Unfortunately, it is not that easy. It is the same wrong lesson I worry that people took away from the Champion's World Tour. Hopefully, the WWC this year will pique the interest of a few new sponsors, who are not t.v. types, who may be interested in a long term project.
I bet we could sneak Abby Wambach on the MetroStars and nobody would notice -- till Shepp Messing started commenting on the sudden increase in goal scoring.
I think the solution is go with the W-league. Build this league from the ground up. Sure, you're gonna have to start out as a semi-pro league, but it's a start. I think building the fan base up at the grass roots level is the way to go. It's paying off for the A-league. Out of curiousity, how many ex WUSA players will opt for the W-league? It would suck if a lot of these women quit the game. As of now they aren't any full time professional women's leagues so I don't think our national team will be hurt too much. Does anyone know of any full time pro women's teams? I know Fulham used to have one, but I think it's semi-pro now. I don't think a WMLS is the solution. MLS isn't in a position to fund it and I don't think they will for the forseeable future. I know what it's like to lose a team. WUSA fans, you have my deepest sympathy.
In the month of September in the United States there have been sadder events of late. Soccer is a sport, a recreational pastime, a way to kick frustration out of one's system and a way to make friends. I have learned much from many of you, and savoured your deep love and appreciation of the game and for its many players of all abilities. Gnash your teeth, vent your anger, but rest assured that your sport shall prevail.
"The reason many claim that the WUSA was male-bashing all through its existance was because they did nothing for the male demographic. They didn't reach out to the male fans. Yes, they had doubleheaders, occasionally, at MLS games. But even then, that wasn't an attempt to reach out to the male fan so much as it was hoping people got there early and wanted to watch a whole day of soccer..." I felt that they did a good job in the Philadelphia area in getting out fans. We had the second highest attendance this season. Certainly a lot of men came to the games. Even those without families or whatever. "Japanese L League no longer is a power. Top-level W-League and WPSL is much stronger. The best leagues, aside from the WUSA, are the German Frauen-Bundesliga and the Swedish Damallsvenskan" True. I would rate the Toppserien in Norway up there with the German and Swedish leagues but those 3 are pretty close.
Heather Mitts posted tonight on the message board at her site. http://pub78.ezboard.com/fheathermittsonline1758frm2.showMessage?topicID=266.topic
Re: Re: Re: It is not a soccer thing but a women's thing       Still bitter?      
Marlene Bjornsrud, GM (former?) of the CyberRays was just interviewed on KTVU-2 here in the Bay Area and she was lamenting the fact that women would not come out to see and support women's sports, i.e., that they were unable to sell the amount of tickets to women that was even close to what was expected. One of the major failings of both men's and women's professional soccer leagues in this country (especially in the Bay Area, but I think this applies to the entire country as well) is to get the people who play the game out to see it played on a higher level. If everyone who played recreationally on whatever level were to become fans of the professional game there would be no attendance problems and you'd still have a WUSA.
That article is a load of manure. When Nike, et al start receiving their not-for-profit tax breaks from Uncle Sam, then they can start donating money to the WUSA for no apparent reason. I'm sure Nike and other companies mentioned approached the WUSA about various sponsorship opportunities and I'm just as sure they didn't like the deals they felt they could get from the league. I feel bad for the WUSA, its players and fans, I really do, but laying this at the feet of a bunch of random corporations who chose not to invest in the league seems like a big stretch. Trying to sustain the kind of costs the WUSA ran up with the kind of attendance numbers they pulled in is a long term impossibility. They needed to cut costs or increase attendance, and since it was too late for the former to make any difference and the latter wasn't happening any time soon... I'd like to see women's professional soccer to succeed if for no other reason than there probably would be a significant amount of crossover in popularity to the men's game when all is said and done. But I don't like blaming various random bogeymen instead of taking a sober look at what mistakes were made and a longer look at what the real obstacles are to a project like this. Next time they try this, they better have a better idea of what their base revenues are and work from there. They may very well have to work from an equal pay scale and rely on endorsements for the "stars" to make the extra money. The league needs to come up with ways of reducing what turned out to be crippling travel costs. But to sit around and expect corporate America to cough up 50 million dollars because "think of the poor little girls who want to grow up and play soccer for a living" is not behaving like a business venture and is not going to help you run a successful league. Corporate America doesn't do that sort of thing unless they think there's a lot more than 50 million dollars in it for them.
I have a friend in DC that has been a season ticket holder of the Freedom for the past three seasons as well as a rec player in several different leagues over there...and we were discussing this a while back...the Freedom did didly squat on reaching out to the adult rec league players in the area. I do not know if this is true for other WUSA cities.
Well, unfortunately, I think there's a lot of people like me who just don't give a rip about men's soccer. Of course the same holds true (which is painfully even more apparent today) for MLS fans liking women's soccer. Soccer is soccer to a lot of people, but honestly, I've got nothing invested into MLS and living in So. Ga., I can't see me changing my ways. And I'd bet top dollar MLS won't receive that much more support in the wake of WUSA's failing.
You are right to point. I honestly don't see how the WUSA folding will help MLS gain more fans. I don't think it will see an increase in attendence or T.V. viewership. As to your point about "lots of people not giving a rip about men's soccer", well every day when I walk down the street I see people wearing various Mexican, European, and even the occasional MLS jersey. I've never seen anyone wearing a WUSA jersey. Outside the net I've never met a WUSA fan. Without bigsoccer I probably wouldn't know about it. I suppose therein lies the problem.
When you have read "Soccer and American Exceptionalism", and are prepared to debate your perspective at an Academic Level, I will happily engage. For what it's worth, I'm probably much much farther to the "left" of you on the entire Socio-Political spectrum of opinion. On any subject you can imagine. I just happen to be an Economic Fascist, and an Ephemeralization Patriot. And thus, I don't believe the Women's Game holds any promise for my Prime Directive, which is to bring the United States in to the Community of Nations (we exited at Bretton Woods in 1943) via integration with the International Football Economy. The fact of the matter is, the Women's Game, and it's "1999-era" glory, is a Red Herring, akin to naming the NFL Superbowl Winners "World Champions" when in fact no other nation on the planet was involved in the contest. Women's Soccer is almost universally ignored outside this country, and my support of the Men's Game and MLS is beyond the sport itself, and much more in the realm of Foreign Policy and Design Science Revolution. But i digress. I also invite you to critique your characterization of me by testing it against the classic maxim, "post hoc, ergo propter hoc." I.E., the fallacy of false association. I attack what is holy to you, therefore I am X, Y, or Z, when in fact you have zero ability to prove your postulate. You are in flatland, enraged at the appearance of my Cube on your Horizon, and thus lash out with your Reptilian core. Unfazed I am. And unimpressed. I doubt you've read much Buckminster Fuller, or any Neal Stephenson, or Robert Anton Wilson for that matter. So I can't expect you to differentiate "dark cellars" from Enlightened Pursuits. As far as the motivation for your characterization of me, Occam's Razor probably holds. Praise Bob. -bs
I'm sorry. I should have clarified. I meant alot of WUSA fans probably don't care for men's soccer. But then again, with places like Atlanta and Carolina that do not have a MLS team, they're not exactly given a choice either. And I don't want to be lumped into the men hating category in all of this (I'm stumbling through those posts now). I've tried watching men's soccer, in person and on TV, etc., but it's just not the same for me. (God knows I lived in a house full of every kind of soccer you could imagine for a year and it still didn't rub off on me)
There is some good discussion going on here. But... MOD NOTE: Posts containing name-calling or flame-baiting will be removed, as some have already been.
Re: Re: Other leagues A tragedy? Did you really say 'a tragedy'? How horrible that these girls will have to go out and get regular jobs like the rest of us...let's keep this in perspective, shall we. A tragedy is ethnic cleansing. A tragedy is mass murder. A tragedy is famine and hunger. These are women/girls who had an opportunity before them, took advantage of it, but it didn't work out because some people didn't do their homework and should have realized that no country is ready to support a women's professional soccer league. If it could have happened anywhere, it would have happened here, but it didn't. Tragedy. That's rich. I wish my life were so tragic that I had the opportunity for a few years to chase the dream of playing a game for a living.
All I know is, the WWC ratings are going to tank because everyone knows it'll be just like the PBS fundraisers we are all accustomed to. The timing of this is just horrible. Why couldn't it have been the WNBA instead?