Re: The anti-spoiler policy Except that results are completely germaine to ANY attendance discussion. The fact that New York has lost 15 games, oops, sorry, has to be open to discussion. Generally 24-48 hours is the statute of limitations on results in other similar forums, but results are routinely mentioned in the MLS attendance discussions.
Yea, 24-48 hours I'm totally fine with a 24-48 hour 'statute of limitations'. I think what I said was "the day of the game or the next day". After that, all bets are off. Of the two results I edited out, one was posted within a few of hours, and the other was just over 24 hours after the game. Those posts are just fine without those results in them. Nothing relevant to attendance was lost. Actually, I only changed a couple of words in each post. I'm asking everyone, out of consideration for others, not to post spoilers the day of any game, or the next day. After 48 hours, you can post any results you want.
8/7/2002 San Diego @ Atlanta, Herndon Stadium: 5,814 San Jose @ Philly, Villanova Stadium: 6,402 Carolina @ New York, Mitchel Athletic Complex: TBD (doubleheader w/ US Open Cup match)
LOL While waiting for the official count, the boxscore at wusa.com reads "Attendance: 0,001" for the NYP-CBL game.
Current average: 6,972. They'd have to average 7,555 for the four remaining games (three Saturday, one Sunday) to finish above 7,000 for the season. Considering San Diego's capacity, I don't think they can do it. Team............G....Total....Average...Growth Washington.....11...102,264...9,297....-35.5% Boston..........9....75,189...8,354......3.1% San Jose.......11....78,836...7,167.....-6.8% Philadelphia...11....76,685...6,971.....-2.6% Atlanta.........9....60,252...6,695....-39.6% Carolina.......10....58,392...5,839.....11.1% San Diego.......9....52,474...5,830......2.1% New York.......10....53,688...5,369.....-6.1% LEAGUE.........80...557,780...6,972....-14.0% Washington and Atlanta have taken the big drops, but the others have kind of almost balanced out. I think the water has found its level, pretty much.
8/10/02 Charge v Beat Herdon 7,590 ---------------------- And if it hasn't been said yet...many thanks to the folks that crunch the numbers...kenntosomach, XYZ, Great Zar, etc. Very much appreciated!
All games April 13 through August 10, 2002 inclusive 2002 League-wide Attendance: 578,018 (83 games) 2002 League-wide Average: 6,964 (24,240H/4,002L) 2002 League-wide Median: 6,211 Washington Freedom (RFK Stadium) 24,240: Sat Jul 27: vs SD (g10) 20,105: Sat May 18: vs Car (g3) 10,357: Sun Aug 4: vs Atl (g11) 8,206: Sat Apr 13: vs NY (g1) 6,578: Wed Jul 3: vs Atl (g7) 6,090: Sat Jun 15: vs SD (g5) 5,968: Sun Jul 14: vs Phi (g8) 5,847: Wed Jul 24: vs Bos (g9) 5,761: Sat Jun 22: vs Car (g6) 4,713: Sun Apr 21: vs SJ (g2) 4,399: Wed Jun 12: vs Bos (g4) --------------------------------------- 102,264 (9,297/game: 11 games) Boston Breakers (Nickerson Field) 21,539: Sat Jun 1: vs Was (g3) 9,107: Sat Jun 8: vs Car (g4) 7,014: Sat Jun 29: vs SJ (g6) 6,747: Sat Apr 27: vs SD (g2) 6,548: Sat Jun 22: vs NY (g5) 6,462: Sun Aug 4: vs NY (g9) 6,305: Sat Apr 20: vs Atl (g1) 6,017: Sat Jul 27: vs Phi (g8) 6,013: Sat Aug 10: vs SJ (g10) 5,450: Wed Jul 10: vs SD (g7) --------------------------------------- 81,202 (8,120/game: 10 games) San Jose CyberRays (Spartan Stadium) 11,990: Sat Apr 27: vs Car (g2) 8,384: Sun Jul 21: vs Was (g9) 7,706: Sun May 26: vs Was (g5) 7,183: Sat Jul 27: vs NY (g10) 7,127: Sun Jun 9: vs SD (g6) 6,653: Wed Jul 31: vs Phi (g11) 6,605: Sat Jun 15: vs NY (g7) 6,051: Sat Apr 13: vs Bos (g1) 5,933: Wed Jul 10: vs Atl (g8) 5,624: Sat May 18: vs Atl (g4) 5,580: Sun May 12: vs SD (g3) --------------------------------------- 78,836 (7,167/game: 11 games) Philadelphia Charge (Villanova Stadium) 9,650: Sat Jun 8: vs Was (g4) 8,185: Sat May 11: vs Was (g2) 7,469: Wed Jul 24: vs NY (g9) 6,946: Sat Jul 20: vs Car (g8) 6,889: Sat Aug 3: vs SD (g10) 6,844: Sat Jun 29: vs Atl (g6) 6,629: Sat May 4: vs Bos (g1) 6,303: Sun Jul 7: vs NY (g7) 5,903: Sat Jun 1: vs SJ (g3) 5,465: Sat Jun 15: vs Bos (g5) 5,402: Wed Aug 7: vs SJ (g11) --------------------------------------- 75,685 (6,880/game: 11 games) Atlanta Beat (Herndon Stadium) 10,070: Sat Apr 13: vs Phi (g1) 7,590: Sat Aug 10: vs Phi (g10) 7,233: Sat Apr 27: vs Was (g2) 6,973: Sat May 11: vs NY (g3) 6,810: Sat Jul 27: vs Car (g8) 6,670: Sat Jun 22: vs SJ (g6) 6,114: Sat Jul 20: vs Bos (g7) 5,814: Wed Aug 7: vs SD (g9) 5,651: Sat Jun 15: vs Car (g5) 4,917: Sat May 25: vs Bos (g4) --------------------------------------- 67,842 (6,784/game: 10 games) Carolina Courage (SAS Stadium) 7,214: Wed Jul 31: vs Was (g9) 6,629: Sat Aug 3: vs SJ (g10) 6,281: Sat Jul 13: vs Bos (g8) 6,211: Thr Jul 4: vs SJ (g7) 5,616: Sat May 11: vs Bos (g2) 5,420: Sat May 4: vs Atl (g1) 5,340: Sat Jun 29: vs SD (g6) 5,281: Sat May 25: vs Phi (g3) 5,244: Wed Jun 19: vs Phi (g5) 5,156: Sat Jun 1: vs NY (g4) --------------------------------------- 58,392 (5,839/game: 10 games) San Diego Spirit (Torero Stadium) ?,???: Sun Aug 11: vs Car (g10)*TBD* 6,392: Wed Jul 31: vs Atl (g9) 6,311: Sun May 5: vs Was (g3) 6,149: Sat Jul 6: vs Bos (g7) 6,102: Sun Jul 14: vs SJ (g8) 5,815: Sat Jun 1: vs Atl (g5) 5,779: Sun May 19: vs Phi (g4) 5,545: Sun Jun 23: vs Phi (g6) 5,215: Sat Apr 20: vs NY (g2) 5,166: Sat Apr 13: vs Car (g1) --------------------------------------- 52,474 (5,830/game: 9 games) New York Power (Mitchel Athletic Complex) 8,314: Wed Aug 7: vs Car (g10) 8,052: Sat Jun 29: vs Was (g7) 7,635: Sat Aug 10: vs Was (g11) 5,214: Sun Jun 9: vs Atl (g5) 5,128: Sat Jul 13: vs Atl (g8) 5,048: Sat May 18: vs Bos (g3) 5,022: Wed Jun 26: vs Car (g6) 4,689: Sat May 25: vs SD (g4) 4,203: Sat Apr 27: vs Phi (g1) 4,016: Sun May 5: vs SJ (g2) 4,002: Sat Jul 20: vs SD (g9) --------------------------------------- 61,323 (5,575/game: 11 games)
Interesting that the Freedom excluding the 2 double-headers would average 6,435/gm changing their standing from best attended to 5th best. Similarly, Boston would end up with 6,629/gm without their 1 double dropping them from 2nd best attended to 4th. San Jose would drop to 6,685/gm and stay 3rd leaving Philly the best attended WUSA site.
Duh! As if... Paul (that's still nice to hear - less so is that we may not get to 7,000 average attendance...)
In fact, you can't. Unless San Diego can somehow get 8,982 in the stadium tonight. Anyway, taking out the doubleheaders from both years and the Inaugural Game from last year, WUSA attendance is still off 13% from last year (7,340 last year, 6,390 this year). Only Carolina (at 11.1%) and San Diego (at 2.1%) are up from last year in the non-doubleheader count. Atlanta and Washington (down 39% and 23%, respectively) are the big culprits in the league-wide dropoff. Boston saw a good-sized drop (17%) if you take their doubleheader out. Some if this is Novelty Effect wearing off, it seems. Was Atlanta's venue switch that big a bad move for them? Non-doubleheader/non-Inaugural game average for the first two years of WUSA (not counting tonight's game in San Diego): 6,871.
compare last year Does anyone have the numbers to see how each team fared this year versus last year?
Go back nine posts. The "Growth" part of the table tells you, percentage-wise, how much better (or worse) the teams are from last year's averages.
Well, I was trying to recreate last years numbers but got frustrated. What I found is shown below (from Internet searches for game recaps and box scores since WUSA refuses to let you see game breakdown for 2001). If someone has more energy, perhaps you can finish it (accuracy of below data is a bit in question as well): ---------- Year 2001: Atlanta: 20,170: Sat Apr 21: vs NY (g1) 8,523: Thr Aug 9: vs BA 7,923: Thr Jul 19: vs BA Washington: 34,148: Sat Apr 14: vs BA (g1) 7,210: Thr Jul 12: vs BA Boston: 8,065: Sun Jul 15: vs BA 7,125: Sun Aug 5: vs SD Carolina: 5,041: Sun Jul 29: vs BA Philadelphia: 11,092: Sun May 6: vs BA (g1) 7,065: Thr Aug 9: vs SD Bay Area: 16,174: Sun Jul 22: vs Was (g8) 10,010: Sun Apr 29: vs Bos (g1) 8,001: Sun Jul 8: vs NY (g7) 7,670: Thr Aug 2: vs Phi (g10) 7,293: Sun May 27: vs Atl (g4) 6,610: Wed Jul 25: vs SD (g9) 6,248: Sun Jun 17: vs Car (g5) 5,543: Sun May 13: vs Car (g2) 4,687: Wed Jun 20: vs Phi (g6) 4,686: Wed May 16: vs Bos (g3) --------------------------------------- 76,922 (7,692/game: 10 games) New York: 9,143: Sun Aug 5: vs BA 7,658: Sun Jun 10: vs BA San Diego: 6,155: Sun Apr 22: vs Phi (g1) 6,155: Sun Jul 29: vs Atl (g9) 6,155: Sun Aug 12: vs Car (g10) 6,103: Sun May 5: vs Was (g2) 5,739: Sat Jun 9: vs Bos (g5) 5,739: Sun Jul 8: vs Bos (g8) 5,554: Sun Jun 24: vs BA (g6) 5,529: Sun May 20: vs NY (g3) 5,311: Sat Jun 2: vs BA (g4) 4,506: Sat Jun 30: vs NY (g7) --------------------------------------- 56,946 (5,695/game: 10 games)
The growth post is interesting. In last night's game San Diego v. Courage I thought I heard the announcers say that San Diego was the only team with positive attendance growth from year one to year two, and that did not seem right since I thought the Courage had improved attendance. Thanks
It's not right, and they have. Not that you can always expect TV people to get things right. I have all the WUSA box scores for 2001, BTW. The final numbers can be found here. More detailed analysis to come.
Kenn, I love your site. But it does nothing to show the raw data you use to arrive at your conclusions (and does not have the raw attendance numbers for WUSA 2001).
Ideally, Ken, you'd have a link for every year for WUSA/MLS and list the game dates and attendances for each match (like the way I do it or differently -- doesn't matter). I'd request date, day-of-week, location, visiting team, and attendance.
Matthew 7:7: "Ask and it will be given to you; seek and you will find; knock and the door will be opened to you." 2001 numbers are up. 2002 will be up after I go to lunch.
Well, I'm sure there was some drop off, just from the newness of the team wearing off, but they moved to a rather shady part of town that's not nearly as accessible as Bobby Dodd was. You've got upper-middle class white people who are your core fan base and then you move the stadium to a part of Atlanta that has quite the repuation, on a college campus/neighborhood that was ranked No. 1 out of 1,497 college campuses as being the highest-risk college campus neighborhoods. Here's a link to the 1999 article: http://www.apbnews.com/safetycenter/family/campus/01main.html There's been numerous articles about the stadium and the attendance and fans, etc. I'll see if I can't find a more recent ranking ...