Who will be the first super club?

Discussion in 'MLS: Clubs' started by jd6885, Nov 7, 2007.

  1. TheUltra

    TheUltra Member

    Mar 23, 2008
    2.4 Miles from home
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Once the Salary Cap is atleast 10 million then we can talk, I mean if this league is this good with only 2 million well, we can dare to dream. In the mean time it's not about super clubs it's about strong clubs with Super Players.

    though Big market clubs will always have the edge
     
  2. Durian Durian

    Durian Durian New Member

    Jul 10, 2008
    Vancouver
    Their owners are deep pocketed enough, and if a Sounders crowd eventually becomes as intense as a Seahawks game at Qwest (they have the ability to expand their capacity twice as much and draw similar to an AC Milan - not saying that would be common place lol). Wasn't Garber concerned with the Sounders name hurting their International brand marketability, perhaps they're laying the groundwork for Western USA's superclub.

    DC United has the best pedigree to be considered USA's superclub currently though. I still prefer watching Houston to a lot of other clubs though.

    Attractive football is a strange debate, but I'd have to go for any club that attempts playing creative and interesting football away from stale anti-football systems. You won't get fans coming back (Apart from the Canadian MNT sucking ass for the past 20 years, it didn't help that they didn't start playing an attacking style until the past couple years, so imagine how exciting it is going to 0-0 draws with small Carribean islands).

    TFC leads in voting here, because I do think they have the potential to be a strong club in the next 10-20 years. Premier club in Canada, plus unquestionable fan support, the closest thing to an Ultra situation in the entire league.
     
  3. TrueCrew

    TrueCrew Member+

    Dec 22, 2003
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    DC finished bottom three straight years (2000, 2001, 2002). OK, bottom of league in '00 and '02 and bottom of the Division in '01, but missed the playoffs all three years.

    By the way, DC is clearly the first Super-Club, any way one slices it.

    If you want to count trophies, DC leads the way.

    Number of Trophies by By MLS Clubs:
    1. DC United - 11. 4 MLS Cups, 4 Supporter's Shields, 1 USOC, 1 CCCC, 1 InterAmerica Cup
    2. Los Angeles - 7. 2 MLS Cups, 2 Supporter's Shields, 2 USOC's, 1 CCCC.
    3. Chicago - 6. 1 MLS Cup, 1 SS, 4 USOCs.
    T4. San Jose - 3. 2 MLS Cups, 1 SS.
    T4. Kansas City - 3. 1 MLS Cup, 1 SS, 1 USOC.
    6. Houston - 2. 2 MLS Cups.
    7. Columbus - 2. 1 SS, 1 USOC
    ---------------------------------------
    T8. Tampa Bay - 1. 1 SS.
    T8. Miami - 1. 1 SS
    T8. New England - 1. 1 USOC.
    T8. Dallas - 1. 1 USOC.
    T8. Rochester - 1 USOC.
    ------------------------------------------
    T13. New York, Colorado, Chivas USA, Real Salt Lake, TFC = 0. (All less than Rochester).

    The list shrinks further if one considers teams who have won all three domestic trophies (MLS, SS, USOC). The list is: DC (4,4,1), LA (2,2,2), Chicago (1,1,4), and Kansas City (1,1,1).

    It shrinks to two (DC and LA) if one feels an international title is a must.

    In terms of the MLS Cup, there have been 4 multiple winners. DC's four; LA, SJ, and Houston all have two. KC and the Fire are the other winners.

    Only two teams have won the Supporter's Shield more than once: DC (four) and LA (twice).

    Only two teams have won the USOC more than once: Chicago (four) and LA (twice).

    LA is the only team to win each trophy more than once, though DC could change that by winning the USOC this year.

    Even compbined, the HOU/SJ "franchise" still has less trophies than Chicago, LA, and DC, and have only SJ's SS in '05 other than the 4 MLS Cups, and no international glory. Though the MLS Titles are clearly more weighty than the Fire's 4 USOC's.

    Still, Houston has to win something else for me to consider them in the same league as DC and LA, the only two candidates in my book. I just don't give HOU credit for the accomplishments of San Jose, those rightly remain in California, some guy named Donovan was instrumental, if I recall.
     
  4. vividox

    vividox Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 10, 2005
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Not that it drastically changes any figures, but you could also count appearances to MLS cup.

    DC 5
    LA 5
    NE 4
    CHI 3
    KC 2
    SJ 2
    HOU 2
    COL 1
     
  5. TrueCrew

    TrueCrew Member+

    Dec 22, 2003
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'm sure it would be popular in NE. :)

    But for me, no points for second place, well, in an 8 team tourney anyway.

    Besides the obvious bump for the Revs/Bills/Vikings who have lost 4 times in the final, LA gets a boost (2 wins, 3 losses), Chicago shows some power (1 win, 2 losses), KC a slight boost (1 win, 1 loss), and the Colorado luckout year.
     
  6. vividox

    vividox Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 10, 2005
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Yeah, take or leave it as you will. However, some of those years involved a "Western/Eastern Conference Champion" trophy, so it still technically adds to the trophy case.
     
  7. vflkirwan

    vflkirwan Member

    Mar 28, 2000
    North Jersey
    Club:
    New Jersey
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Once again, the La Manga Cup getting no love in the trophy count....
     
  8. TrepX

    TrepX New Member

    Aug 10, 2007
    Redwood City
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    where are the earthquakes, they are the first super club.
     
  9. peabrainedidiot

    peabrainedidiot New Member

    Nov 21, 2005
    wessagussett
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    which version?

    the one that failed and moved to houston? or the one that is going to fail?:D
     
  10. TrepX

    TrepX New Member

    Aug 10, 2007
    Redwood City
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    You better watch yourself Revy your picking a fight with the wrong earthquake. :)
     
  11. eintracht.19

    eintracht.19 New Member

    Jun 23, 2008
    Toms River, NJ
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    lets look at the team with the multi billion dollar owner, and by far the most money at their disposal. this goddamned salary cap is stopping us from being the best team in NA.
     
  12. TheUltra

    TheUltra Member

    Mar 23, 2008
    2.4 Miles from home
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    All the salary cap is doing for RBNY is keeping them from going broke.
    We all play with the Cap, just because your club is a perennial failure has nothing to do with money.
     
  13. peabrainedidiot

    peabrainedidiot New Member

    Nov 21, 2005
    wessagussett
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I'd hardly call them a failure; sales of redbull cans are up in the tri-state area;)
     
  14. TheUltra

    TheUltra Member

    Mar 23, 2008
    2.4 Miles from home
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States

    lol Well I suppose there's always that
     
  15. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    Arsenal
    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    I'd agree with Seattle...they look to have a really solid base there. If not Seattle, I think New York will do well, once the salary cap is raised a bit and we move into RBA.
     
  16. soccermusician

    Oct 20, 2004
    Alexi Lalas seems to think the LAG will be the first super club but he is out and we are sucking lately......
     
  17. TheUltra

    TheUltra Member

    Mar 23, 2008
    2.4 Miles from home
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Lately?
     
  18. Natsoccer

    Natsoccer Member

    Jul 27, 2008
    Valencia, CA
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Its hilarious that Galaxy and Toronto have any votes at all, let alone being two of the leaders... This is probably because of bias from our fanatical fanbase; Beckhamania and whatever they have up in canada...

    But seriously, Houston Dynamo is already on the right track. They can continuously field a good team with enough depth in case of injuries and don't have any players that dominate the salary cap.
     
  19. calean007

    calean007 New Member

    Sep 2, 2008
    LA is a joke of a club honestly. Nothing but plastic fans galore. I have more respect for Chivas USA than that "other" club.

    Perhaps, but honestly 2 MLS cups in their first two seasons as a "new" team doesn't define a super club by any stretch. I would think that DC United or the Revs, who have actually been a club longer than the Dynafaux and have more silver in their cases would be more fitting of that title if we are going to make one up. The Dynamo haven't really impressed me this season, or even a lot of the analysts and whatnot due to their not playing nearly as strong as they have last season and the one before. Win a third one in a row, then we might be heading somewhere with this title, but even at that, I'll wait till they've actually been in MLS for a decade and compare their overall record.
     
  20. TheUltra

    TheUltra Member

    Mar 23, 2008
    2.4 Miles from home
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Revs have only won two trophies in their entire history, and if you consider their constant second place finish super then I guess the Buffalo Bills are the Super Club of the NFL.
     
  21. ArsenalMetro

    ArsenalMetro Member+

    Arsenal
    United States
    Aug 5, 2008
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Even if a franchise wins ten MLS Cups in a row, they aren't a superclub until they win something and perform well consistently on the continental level. I don't see that happening with any MLS franchise in the near future, unless the salary cap is drastically raised and roster sizes are increased. Should that happen, I see the following teams, in order, becoming powers:

    1. Seattle
    2. New York
    3. Los Angeles

    Purely because of their resources and connections.

    Seattle has Paul Allen as a backer, and a very unique set-up for an American sports team, with a marching band (lol) and actual club membership. They also have what looks like a very good fan-base in the Pacific Northwest already. Adding Portland to the league would only accelerate the growth of Seattle into one of the biggest clubs in North America.

    New York has the backing of Red Bull, obviously. As it stands, they play in the cavernous, worthless piece of ****, Giants Stadium. When they move into Red Bull Arena (hopefully at the end of next season), I think you'll see the fan base grow dramatically. Giants Stadium is a complete pain in the ass to get to, but from what I've read, RBA will be easily accesible by public transport, which is crucial to developing a good fan base in American urban areas.

    Los Angeles definitely has the smallest chance of the three to become a superclub, as far as I'm concerned, since they already have many of the things that the other franchises will get soon (great fanbase/attendance/revenue), but arer clearly not doing much with it. Adding Beckham has certainly added to the team's coffers, but I don't know much about their overall finances. I could certainly see LA becoming the Galacticos of MLS if the salary cap or the number of DP spots were raised. Whether that would make them a superclub or not is obviously debatable, but it would continue to make them the most recognized brand in the league.

    And yes, I realize I posted once in this topic already, but I'm stalling on classwork here, and I figured that it would be good to go into more detail about my reasoning. And also, I was getting a little irritated by people claiming that Houston is a superclub, or that DC could be considered one, based on their performance in MLS. If a team wins the Hungarian league 6 years running but bombs out of the Champions League prior to the group stages every year, they aren't a superclub. MLS is not of the caliber for a team that only wins domestically to be considered a superclub.
     
  22. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Vanuatu
    There will be no Super Club in MLS.
     
  23. jd6885

    jd6885 Member

    Jun 30, 2001
    Tacoma
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    interesting. I forgot this thread even existed. Which is strange because I started it.

    Isn't it nice to reminisce about how people thought Houston and DC would be Superclubs. DC and their stadium situation. And Houston playing pretty sub par.

    Good to see Colorado fans are the most level headed here. Zero votes! (if you count only member votes)
     
  24. Ricken

    Ricken Member

    Dec 28, 2005
    Brooklyn
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    RBNY

    You read it here first. :p
    Although i got to admit moving to the new stadium can't come soon enough.
     
  25. TheLostUniversity

    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Feb 4, 2007
    Greater Boston
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    .....ahem......;)
     

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