Time will tell what the ultimate alignment and schedule end up. My thoughts are that we end up with 3 conferences with 10 clubs each for 30 clubs. This would allow of regional competition, and controlling travel costs. All clubs would play everyone within the conference twice for 18 matches and all clubs in the other two conferences once for 20 matches and a total of 38 games per season. An 38 game season should not be out of the question considering that the EFL Championship plays a 46 game season plus playoffs. The conference champions would be awarded for regular season performance rather than thru a playoff. Along with the Supporters Shield being awarded to the single club with the best overall record. The MLS Cup playoffs would consists of 13 clubs (top three clubs in each conference plus the next four regardless of conference) playing in a single game elimination tournament. The three conference champions would receive a first round bye. The brackets would be divided into a 6 club bracket which includes the two conference champions with second and third best records. Along with a bracket consisting of 7 clubs which includes the Supporter Shield winner. (By theory giving the SS winner the easiest path to the MLS Cup). By doing this the Conference champions would be rewarded for regular season play.
Under my proposed playoffs, here is an example, if MLS has 3 conference today: East - NYC, Phil, DC, NYRB, Tor, NE, Mon, Orl Central - Atl, Minn, Dal, Chi, Hou, SKC, Cbs, Cin West - LAFC, LAG, Sea, RSL, Port, SJ, Col, Van
I’d rather the league split into four conferences than 3. Nonetheless, I believe we’ll just see two conferences and less out of conference games, making the MLS Cup more important.
29 & 30. Sacramento & Charlotte 31 & 32. Las Vegas & Indianapolis 33 & 34. Phoenix & Detroit 35 & 36. TBD & TBD West TBD San Diego (frontrunner) Oklahoma City (contender) Albuquerque (contender) San Antonio (contender) El Paso (dark horse) Tulsa (pretender) Omaha (pretender) Riverside (pretender) Either West/East TBD Milwaukee (dark horse) Memphis (pretender) New Orleans (pretender) East TBD Tampa Bay (contender) Louisville (contender) Baltimore (dark horse) Birmingham (dark horse) Pittsburgh (dark horse) Cleveland (dark horse) Raleigh (pretender, if Charlotte gets in) Jacksonville (pretender) Hartford (pretender) Virginia Beach (pretender) Greensboro (pretender)
Bottom line, we shouldn't need a math degree for a league set up But we got ourselves into this when we went past 16-18-20 teams traditional league sizes around the world and still insist on the MLS Playoffs when the fight for the Shield and the national championship (US Open Cup) should have been enough. I think all these various combos, divisions, conferences dilute the regular season and too many teams, when some are weak, hurt the quality of your first division. Oh well.
I think they stop at 32. Four, 8-team divisions. ATLANTIC New England NYCFC Red Bulls Philadelphia DC United Raleigh Orlando Miami CENTRAL Toronto Montreal Cincinnati Columbus Indy Chicago Nashville Atlanta MIDWEST Salt Lake Colorado Houston Dallas Austin Kansas City St. Louis Minnesota PACIFIC Vancouver Seattle Portland San Jose Sacramento LA Galaxy LAFC Las Vegas
Division A 1. Los Angeles Galaxy 2. Austin FC 3. Minnesota United 4. Orlando City 5. New York Red Bulls Division B 1. Los Angeles FC 2. FC Dallas 3. Saint Louis 4. Atlanta United 5. New York City FC Division C 1. San Jose Earthquakes 2. Houston Dynamo 3. Chicago Fire 4. Inter Miami CF 5. New England Revolution Division D 1. Sacramento Republic 2. Vancouver Whitecaps 3. Sporting Kansas City 4. Charlotte 5. DC United Division E 1. Colorado Rapids 2. Portland Timbers 3. FC Cincinnati 4. Nashville SC 5. Philadelphia Union Division F 1. Real Salt Lake 2. Seattle Sounders 3. Columbus Crew 4. Toronto FC 5. Montreal Impact A team plays everyone in it's own division twice (i.e., A1 plays A2, A3, A4 and A5). A team also plays everyone in the other divisions with the same number twice (A1 plays B1, C1, D1, E1, and F1). In summary, you play 9 teams twice, and 20 teams once for 38 games. Since the divisions are not geographic, the playoffs would just be seeded 1-15 (first round bye to the Supporters' Shield winner).
I can't help but play with your scenario a bit East: 1. DC United 2. Philadelphia Union 3. New York City FC 4. New York Red Bulls 5. New England Revolution 6. Toronto FC 7. Montreal Impact 8. Detroit 9. Carolina Contenders: Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Rochester South: 1. Atlanta United 2. Nashville SC 3. Inter Miami CF 4. Orlando City SC 5. FC Dallas 6. Houston Dynamo 7. Austin FC 8. Tampa Bay Rowdies 9. San Antonio FC Contenders: Birmingham, Jacksonville, New Orleans North: 1. FC Cincinnati 2. Columbus Crew 3. Chicago Fire 4. Minnesota United 5. Sporting Kansas City 6. Tulsa Roughnecks 7. OKC Energy 8. Saint Louis FC 9. Indy XI Contenders: Omaha, Milwaukee, Cleveland, Louisville West: 1. LA Galaxy 2. Los Angeles FC 3. Seattle Sounders 4. Portland Timbers 5. Vancouver Whitecaps 6. San Jose Earthquakes 7. Sacramento Republic 8. Colorado Rapids 9. Real Salt Lake Contenders: Albuquerque, Phoenix, San Diego, Riverside, San Francisco, Las Vegas
MLS West 1. Los Angeles FC - 2. LA Galaxy 3. Seattle Sounders 4. FC Dallas - 5. Sporting Kansas City 6. Houston Dynamo 7. Portland Timbers - 8. Minnesota United 9. San Jose Earthquakes 10. Real Salt Lake - 11. Colorado Rapids 12. Saint Louis 13. Austin FC 14. Vancouver Whitecaps 15. Sacramento Republic 16. Las Vegas Lights* 17. Phoenix Rising* 18. TBD Expansion Contenders/USL Championship: San Diego, Omaha, Albuquerque, El Paso, San Antonio, Riverside, East Bay, Fresno, Tulsa, Oklahoma City, MLS East 1. Atlanta United - 2. New York Red Bulls 3. New York City FC 4. Inter Miami CF - 5. Philadelphia Union 6. DC United 7. Toronto FC - 8. Nashville SC 9. Orlando City SC 10. Chicago Fire - 11. Columbus Crew 12. FC Cincinnati 13. New England Revolution 14. Montreal Impact 15. Charlotte* 16. Indy Eleven* 17. TBD 18. TBD Expansion contenders/USL Championship stand alone teams: Pittsburgh, Detroit, Tampa Bay, Jacksonville, Raleigh, Birmingham, Virginia Beach, Baltimore, Cleveland, Louisville, Rochester, Buffalo, Hartford, Milwaukee, Charleston, New Orleans, Memphis positions: 1st place - conference champion, supporters shield, Playoffs home/bye, Super League 2nd - 4th place - playoffs home, Super League 5th - 7th place - playoffs away, Super League 8th - 10th place - no playoffs, Super League 11th - 18th place - nothing Super League 40 team tournament between MLS and Mexico. 8 groups of 5 teams, home/away. Replaces CCL.
30 Team League - 2Conferences / 3 Divisions (The west split is ugly) East Northeast Red Bull NYCFC New England Philadelphia Montreal Southeast DCU Orlando Miami Atlanta Charlotte Central Cincinnati Columbus Toronto Nashville Chicago West Northwest Seattle Vancouver Portland San Jose Sacramento Southwest Galaxy LAFC RSL Colorado Dallas Midwest Houston Austin SKC St. Louis Minnesota
I assume at least 32 is the goal though. In that case, I'm guessing 2 Conferences with 4 divisions with 4 teams each (similar to the NFL) East Metro Red Bull NYCFC New England Montreal Central Philadelphia DCU Cincinnati Columbus Southeast Orlando Miami Atlanta Charlotte Rust Belt Toronto Nashville Chicago Detroit/Indy/Milwaukee West North Seattle Vancouver Portland Minnesota California San Jose Sacramento Galaxy LAFC Gateway RSL Colorado SKC St. Louis Southwest Dallas Houston Austin Vegas/Phoenix/San Diego Plays division teams 3 times = 9 games Conference opponents 1 time = 12 games Home-and-home series with a division from the opposite conference = 8 games 1 game vs 1 team from remaining divisions = 3 games Total: 32 game regular season
Way too many divisions. I don't like the NFL model at all. It makes standings pretty much meaningless.
So you either have to go to more small, regional divisions, which you don't like, or fewer, larger which make scheduling even more difficult? Larger divisions will highlight the size of our country (i.e. travel) even more. Take a look at the divisions above. The "Central" division has the majority of it's teams in the Eastern time zone. The "Northwest" division has 3/5 of its teams in the geographic eastern half of the 48 contiguous states, and 2/5 (KC & STL) are actually in the SE quadrant of the country. The "Southwest" division spans three timezones, and again has most of its team in the central time zone. I think with more NFL connections coming on board, we'll and up with a more NFL like system. I don't know what that league will look like, but i know somebody is going to be pissed about it.
A lot of the terms Americans use to identify regions may have been accurate when the term was coined historically, but have long ceased to be accurate. You have the areas in the Eastern Time Zone referred to as the Midwest. Historically, Memphis was considered the gateway to the Southwest, and the former Southwest Conference in college sports is remembered fondly by people in Texas and Arkansas. The "first bank robbery in the West" happened in Minnesota. The Mississippi River historically has been the dividing line between East and West, although the actual line would be somewhere west of Omaha.
Given I live just outside St. Louis, and cross the Mississippi everyday going to work, i'm well aware of what most people view as the east/west divide, and midwest sports history. Was pointing out (maybe not so clearly) that lots of small divisions are going to break up some so-called "historic" rivalries. Larger divisions such as the aforementioned Northwest & Southwest involve lots of travel. Since the players union seems to want to make this a negotiating point, I'd think it's the more pressing issue currently. I've said elsewhere here in the forums, i don't care where STL ends up division wise. My preference is in a group with Chicago, but MLS has yet to call and ask my opinion
WITH THE DON STATING THAT 32 WILL BE THE END (for now) I AM REVISING MY PLAN Northeast: 1. DC United 2. Philadelphia Union 3. New York City FC 4. New York Red Bulls 5. New England Revolution 6. Toronto FC 7. Montreal Impact 8 Carolinas/Queen City Contenders: Pittsburgh, Baltimore, Rochester, Detroit Southeast: 1. Atlanta United 2. Nashville SC 3. Inter Miami CF 4. Orlando City SC 5. FC Dallas 6. Houston Dynamo 7. Austin FC 8. Tampa Bay Rowdies Contenders: Birmingham, Jacksonville, New Orleans, San Antonio FC Central: 1. FC Cincinnati 2. Columbus Crew 3. Chicago Fire 4. Minnesota United 5. Sporting Kansas City 6. Saint Louis FC 7. Colorado Rapids 8. Real Salt Lake Contenders: Omaha, Milwaukee, Cleveland, Louisville, Indy XI West: 1. LA Galaxy 2. Los Angeles FC 3. Seattle Sounders 4. Portland Timbers 5. Vancouver Whitecaps 6. San Jose Earthquakes 7. Sacramento Republic 8. Las Vegas Lights Contenders: Albuquerque, Phoenix, San Diego, Riverside, San Francisco
Continential Conference: Austin Dallas Houston Nashville Vancouver Seattle Portland Las Vegas Toronto Montreal Detroit New England DC United Philadelphia NY Red Bulls NYCFC American Conference: Atlanta Charlotte Orlando Miami LA Galaxy LAFC Sacramento San Jose Minnesota Chicago Kansas City Saint Louis Columbus Cincinnati Salt Lake Colorado
My take (keeping as many rivalries together as possible [oldest to newest] and divisions relatively geographically close, with similar climates also considered): EASTERN CONFERENCE: Mean Streets Division Chicago Charlotte Detroit Philadelphia Hell Classique Division Columbus Cincinnati Toronto Montreal Metropolitan Division DC United New England NY Red Bulls NYCFC Dirty South Division Atlanta Nashville Orlando Miami WESTERN CONFERENCE: HotHotHot Division Austin Dallas Houston Phoenix Mountain to River Division Minnesota Colorado Kansas City Saint Louis Cascadia Division Vancouver Seattle Portland Salt Lake California Division LA Galaxy LAFC Sacramento San Jose Sorry, Rocky Mountain Rivalry, you're the unfortunate victim in this reorg. The Mean Streets also get the east leftovers (unless NHL Rivalries count). Of course, this assumes that Detroit gets a team. If Las Vegas or San Diego gets a team instead, then: altEASTERN CONFERENCE: Hell is Real Division Chicago Cincinnati Minnesota Columbus Armpit Division Philadelphia New England Toronto Montreal Atlantic Division DC United Charlotte NY Red Bulls NYCFC Dirty South Division Atlanta Nashville Orlando Miami altWESTERN CONFERENCE: HotHotHot Division Austin Dallas Houston Phoenix Rockies Division Salt Lake Colorado Kansas City Saint Louis Cascadia Division Vancouver Seattle Portland Las Vegas/Sacramento California Division LA Galaxy LAFC Sacramento/San Diego San Jose
Well since MLS just put Nashville in the west and Miami in the east as we just hit 26, I see no reason MLS will not just keep the 2 conference set up going, right up to 32. I still like the idea of the regular season within conference (30 games if 16 team conf), then if we have to have an MLS Cup, make it an east/west challenge - 4 rounds- highest seed all the way. Teams can also face each other in the Open Cup and conceivably CCL and maybe preseason. Its not like the NFL every team plays every team every year.
Well, this is tricky, especially since we do not know where we are stopping, or where the teams will be. Therefore, it is hard to put particular teams in particular divisions at 32/34/36+ team league (if we get there). So, I will go 28, 30, 32, 34, 36, 38, & 40. 28 teams. 2 conferences of 14. 4 divisions of 7. Play division foes twice (12 games). Conference foes once (7 games). The entire other league once (14 games). Plus play one other team twice (1 game). 34 games. West: Pacific: LAG, LAFC, SJ, Sea, Port, Van, RSL. Midwest: Col, FCD, Hou, Aust, SKC, Min, Chi. * Col/ RSL get each other twice. * Chi/CLBget each other twice. ------------ East: Atlantic: DC, NYRB, NYCFC, NE, Phi, Mia, Orl. Central: CLB, TFC, MTL, FCC, ATL, Nash, Cha. ----------------------------- 30 teams.
MLS : West: 9 Vancouver Seattle Portland RSL Colorado SJ LAG LAFC Sacramento South : 7 Dallas Houston Austin Orlando Miami Atlanta Nashville Midwest/ North : 7 St Louis Minnesota Chicago Columbus Cincinnati Toronto Sporting KC East : 7 New England NYRB NYCFC Philly DC Montréal Charlotte Possible expansion : San Diego San Antonio Las Vegas Oklahoma City Charleston Louisville Indianapolis Detroit Phoneix Raleigh Tampa
I posted this elsewhere, but I read the tea leafs as follows based on MLS keeping 2 conferences: 2020 Nashville in West Miami in East (Nash is temporary, Miami is logical to be in East) 2021 Austin in West Charlotte in East (These are both geographically proper) 2022 STL & SAC geographically proper in the west and NASH then moves to the East to be a bit more logical ------- IF league then wants to go to 32, I see the 2 best overall candidates being in the West- LV & PHX No city in the East really jumps out at me at this moment, maybe TAMPA or INDY, but it could still happen as I wouldn't think MLS would then want to move a team from the West to the East just to take both LV & PHX. You never know with this league !