Lol you realize I started this thread with my assertion right? So of course I will discuss and defend that belief in the thread I started. If you think there's nothing else to say, why do you keep responding to every one of my posts, many of which aren't even in response to you, by rushing in and defending the honor of Omar? So you're saying you can post 16 plays covering almost three years, and that negates my 8 clips of his mistakes this year that I posted supporting my contention that he's worse this specific year? Eight clips by the way that you haven't even tried to assess (curious, that), instead simply piggybacking on someone else who only looked at three, and who I strongly disagreed with. How can you say he picked it apart when it appears you don't know enough to judge them for yourself? I claim he's worse in 2015. I was going to say go ahead and include all of 2013 and 2014 post DP contract, but it seems (I hope?) you recognize the lack of logic in using 2013 and 2014 as evidence against that. So do it-- present 16 clips from the 2015 season of *game saving plays* by Omar (where he prevents a likely goal that could cost us points, ala AJ in last years Cup Final). Contrary to what I said before, I'll be happy to see them and will change my mind if you succeed. Wake me when you actually have done it.
This is the problem. Based on your early posts in this thread, despite what I and others wrote, you clearly did not understand the issue with keeping Omar on for next year. At this point, we absolutely need allocation money to do it, as we used all of the Garber bucks we were gifted as TAM for a multiple year period all last year for just half of Omar's salary. Your ideas included dumping several squad players and using their salary space to pay Omar. Sorry, doesn't work that way. Another one of your ideas was Gerrard retiring and using that money to get a slightly cheaper DP, and then use the leftover to keep Omar. Sorry, doesn't work that way. So because you didn't understand the issue, you thought it was a simple issue of whether we choose to pay him his salary or not. So you of course said, Pay him! Except, sorry, doesn't work that way. But once you took that stance, you couldn't go back on it, despite having the situation clarified for you and despite you admitting he's declined this year. Based on what you just wrote above, it looks like you STILL don't understand the issue. Plus, for some reason, you may have a weird allegiance to him. So here we are. I have no other ideas for keeping him beside allocation money because THATS THE RULE. If they change the rules, great, but they haven't done that yet, and we can't expect that to happen. So the rule is currently the rule. And that's why I advocate cutting him loose. Unless he takes a huge pay cut. But you might die if that were to happen, it seems! Lol. I don't criticize Keane the same way because he's better than Omar. Obviously. Still waiting on those clips. In the meantime, continue with the " blargjdjdkdj I love Omar pay him pay him I don't understand the new rule but he's good even though he's not as good this year but I love him and if you criticize him you must criticize Keane because it's the same!" posts. While waiting, I'll continue going to games next year for the 21st year, and you'll....
You really keep making the same arguments: 1) that Omar makes too many mistakes and more than previous seasons, 2) that he is some sort of special case with his salary (which you feel he is not worth and 3) that the only solution to this problem is to acquire "SPECIAL GARBER BUCKS". Lets take the easy one first #2. Omar by salary will be a DP next year. He is not a special case because of anything the Galaxy did in 2015. League rules currently limit a team to 3 DPs and the Galaxy currently will have 4 for 2016. If the league increases the number of DP's there is no issue (or need to get rid of Omar). If the league doesn't change the number of DPs then your correct that some action must be taken. This takes us to point #3 where I believe you can't see the forest for the trees. First, if anyone of the current DPs leave not just Omar, this also elevates the situation. Currently all of the players are on contract through 2016 (Omar and Gerrard) or beyond (Keane and Dos Santos). If the DP rules doesn't change, you assume that the only "solution" is to get Garber bucks. This is not true. MLS rules allow a player to leave when their contract expires, if it is bought out (1 buyout per year including DPs); if they are loaned (either inside or outside the league); if they are traded or transferred (although DP contracts may contain provisions against that) and among other things if the player retires. First, none of us on this board know what provisions any of those DP contracts contain. Specifically, there could be provisions to let a player walk by requesting a transfer to certain clubs or possibly not resign a player or perhaps have a mid year exit point (e.g. Dos Santos could have a clause that would require the Galaxy to accept a contract offer greater than his current salary from Barca). As a second option, if one considers a DP's guaranteed contract value a sunk cost at the time of signing, then it would also be rational for the Galaxy to consider which of the 4 DP's provides the least value to the team in 2016 and to potentially buy out that players contract. This would also return the DP minimum of salary cap space. Third, as a regular DP nothing prevents the Galaxy from using regular allocation dollars to buy down a DP's salary. We can agree that the cost of buying down Omar's salary could reach approximately 1 million dollars but its not guaranteed. If for example a DP player decides to "retire" at mid year to take a coaching position in preparation for the 2016-2017 European season, then I believe (but am not positive) that would free up a DP position for the 2nd half of the season and the buyout would be reduced in half. This is the opposite of a mid-season acquisition (which we saw when the Galaxy signed Dos Santos) You seem to think that getting the allocation money (either regular or targeted) will be prohibitively expensive, yet no one outside of MLS knows how much of this money the Galaxy have now or may have in 2016. Furthermore, I am not sure that is your's is a rational conclusion on the face of it. There were 47 DPs in MLS in 2015, or an average of 2.35 per club. Eleven teams had fewer than 3 DPs in 2015 which meant that they could not use these funds in 2015. To use these funds in 2016, these teams (several of which are historically cheap) would need to sign at least 14 to get to 3 DPs where they can utilize these funds. They would then need to be willing to sign a 4th player to at least the DP minimum to utilize them Note it is unclear if a team could use Targeted funds as part of a transfer fee (with the combined total of salary and transfer fee being over the DP minimum) if they do not currently have 3 DPs. If they can, then I can see some of these teams potentially using their targeted funds. Given the uncertainties, along with the possibility that there could be rule changes (including an increase in Targeted Allocation Funds), it is way to early to conclude that the Galaxy need to do anything with regard to Omar, which also makes your first point relatively unimportant.
What I realize is you are asking questions you don't want to hear the answer to unless it lines up with your assertions. The footage I showed should speak for itself. The point of it is that what you are seeing is what he is Still doing over the period stated. (Though admittedly not at the level of prior years when considering this year.) The contention is that you do not agree that he is doing what is being shown. That is fine as that is your opinion. As I already said I can't change your mind and making a special video just for you is pointless. Especially when you can barely remember the good things he did in the last few games and have summarily dismissed anything else to defend the idea of retaining the player. I also find it unnecessary to have commentary of each video I posted or to repeat what someone else so eloquently spoke just ahead of me to make the same argument. After all if you didn't want to have this very debate (should LA keep Omar and is he worth what it would take to keep him) why start the thread? I understand the issue. You were the one who briefly believed he was still an actual DP. I am the one who put how TAM works in the thread. And yes I get that he gets paid DP money without the title. You are also making assumptions when it comes to what I think should be done to keep him. First you can trade players for more allocation moneys. That's a sucky option and I have said sad decisions would be made if LA went that route. He could reclaim his DP tag if Gerrard is traded or retires. If his contract expires this year then he can sign a lesser deal or he could sign a long term deal that pays out what he would have gotten short term in the long term. This depends on the length of his current deal. But players sign new deals mid-contract all the time, so it is safe to assume this is a viable option. Again what ideas do you have? How would you keep him knowing what you know of allocation funds both TAM and otherwise? If the dude is truly one of your favorites on this team you would at least present something other than just let him go for crying out loud.
Thank you seriously a million times over for accurately stating my claims and responding with intelligent discussion of my intended topic. To add/clarify, yes I am making assumptions that the club will keep all of Keane Gio and Gerrard for at least the start of 2016, which is when I assume they will have to make a decision on Omar by. I am not necessarily supporting or condemning this idea of keeping all of those three. I don't believe Gerrard or Gio will leave/be allowed to leave midseason, and even if they were to do so, I'm not sure how the club could work with the league at the beginning of the year to account for that future event (unless they had definite foreknowledge) and get Omar registered with us again at his current salary to start 2016. Thus I think, barring a rule change allowing more DPs or something similar, I think it will come down to getting the allocation money. And I think that is in fact prohibitively expensive based on Omar's current form, and would prefer that we use the allocation money we get instead on other acquisitions or current players and prefer also to not trade a number of players to acquire more allocation money specifically for the purpose of paying down Omar's salary. Yes a big variable is how much allocation money would be available to us for various reasons. If we see significant inflation next year, then maybe it's not a big deal to keep him. I don't see a rule change allowing 4 DPs because at this point I think the league wants to raise the level of the mid table teams rather than further assist the big monied clubs like us primarily. We already have 5 cups. The league has no interest in us winning this year or even next. If it has to be another rich club then they would likely prefer Seattle or Toronto. Yes Omar is still by all means a good MLS defender. But given the conditions that existed this year and that I expect will still be in place next year, his salary is now more than the 1.45 million. It's more like effectively 2.45 million now. It's hard to say he's worth this new amount any of his years here, but especially this year. I think the club, based on Klein's comments, are actually well aware they need to make a hard decision. The evidence for this will be what happens in the offseason. If I'm right, Omar will be gone. I could be wrong, but I hope it's because of a rule change rather than using all that allocation money on him. I should also add that I'm less for dumping him than if we needed to use only TAM to keep him.
The four mundane plays from 2014? Or the few natl team highlights? Ok those are comprehensive and relevant to the 8 plays I posted from 2015. Good work. And am I supposed to just fold when someone argues against me and say, "sorry guys, Omar's great this year, what was I thinking?" Are all discussions supposed to end in support of cheerleading? Then why all the abuse on certain other players? Unfortunately, based on what you've written, despite you looking up what TAM is mid-thread, you still don't understand. Your suggestions didn't make sense, which is why I dismiss them. And yes he's a 4th DP who needs to be paid down to non-DP levels. Calling him a DP or not doesn't change his contract. He is one of my favorites. The club has stupidly put itself in this position. However, I contend his form this year might just make their decision a lot easier.
Frankly, I think that if the conditions you outline are correct, the proper solution for the Galaxy is to buy out Gerrard's contract. My rational is as follows: 1) Gerrard stank up the boat in 2015 especially on defense. 2) I don't see any reason to project that Gerrard at 36 will be any better than he was at 35. His half season stats of 2 goals and 3 assists pan out to perhaps 6 goals and 8 assists if he doesn't deteriorate any further. Frankly I find 4 goals and 6 assists a more likely top line projection given his added age. That isn't all that different from Marco Pappa who makes $75,000 with Seattle. 3) If Gerrard is gone, the Galaxy get back almost $500K in salary cap. They can use it along with any of the targeted money they have left or may acquire to sign a low-end DP level player (a young DP would be especially interesting). Finally, you are double counting the money on Omar's salary. It is what it is. If the Galaxy uses targeted funds to pay the amount above the DP minimum (which can't be readily used for other purposes), it doesn't make it more that it is or cost them any more of the team salary cap than a normal DP salary does. By the way, there is nothing that prevents the Galaxy from trading pure cash for targeted funds. If the Galaxy traded $3 million cash for $1 million in targeted funds, it would not have an impact on the Galaxy roster.
SMH,... and your 8 plays are just sooo comprehensive. See I can be dismissive also. The TAM definition came on page 2 not mid-thread. And some of the suggestions I listed are the same as what 73Bruin listed but I guess because I said it makes no sense right,... SMH Alright dude. At first I was content to try not to change your mind but we don't even need to speak if you wanna play these kind of games. You can consider our conversation over.
What a surprise, you won't be able to come through. Wrong. Yes I'm sure that's the reason you don't comment on gameplay clips. Yeah, a huge paycut. The 8 defensive mistakes that led to big goals are relevant to my point. Your 4 random plays in 2014 are not. You grew frustrated I wasn't persuaded by your flawed arguments and claimed you would stop trying. So why are you asking me this question? And why do you continue to respond to me?
I don't see the club realizing what you referred to earlier, that Gerrard in 2015 is a sunk cost and it might be best to move on without him. I think the club wants to avoid the stench of failure with him so much that they would do everything they can to see if he comes good. Thus I don't see his contract being released. I can see the point in sticking with him, and would probably agree with that, betting on his professionalism and experience, strictly based on business and reputation/image issues for the club. The risk of course is he doesn't come good and has an outright disaster of a 2016. Given that I think he's staying for sure, I think he would do fine with a formation change, but maybe that's unrealistic. I'm counting an extra million on Omar due to the allocation money that could be used elsewhere, not just for paying him down. The specific targeted allocation money was all used up just his last halfseason. And I think it's even worse business for the club to overpay in cash for allocation money-- now you're paying 3-4 mil for Omar.
I am quite sure that they are aware that Gerrard is a sunk cost. You may or may not be correct about the stench of failure. Especially since they answer to a numbers guy not a soccer guy. Sorry but the first part of this doesn't make any sense. The Galaxy have a great international reputation. Staying with Gerrard when he is over the hill sends the wrong type of message. IMO the only formation that makes sense for Gerrard is as a true #9. Where he doesn't have to track back almost at all on offense and can dish the ball out. And frankly I think the Galaxy already have a better choice. There are two separate issues here, business sense and MLS soccer financial sense. The two are completely unrelated. From a MLS soccer financial sense, a bought down Omar only costs the DP minimum, and not a penny more just like any other DP. If the Galaxy want to and can buy Targeted allocation funds, this has no impact on the field, its a pure business decision. From a soccer perspective, keeping Omar makes more sense than anything you have suggested.
It's not clear how hard it would be to accumulate that much TAF. While every team needs to spend it or lose it, they only need to spend $100k each year. My guess is that most teams will not trade future TAF money because who knows when they might need it. We would need to put together up to 10 small deals to accumulate that much money. What are we going to trade? How many prospects would we need to give up to keep Omar for just one more year? AFAIK, we can't use actual money to purchase allocation money. Allocation money is restricted precisely to keep competitive balance; using real money would undermine that.
Normally when we get this heated about stuff, it's partly because we need a real game to watch. But we've just played---this time I think what we need is a WIN.
I don't agree with your premise that stats and soccer don't mix, and as Wahl reported awhile back, a lot of clubs do have analysts that now use data as a science all based on Opta. The stats show that you are under rating him imo, even with a recent drop in form. Your ask should be that he cleans up his form - which is reasonable - and not that he's a monster compared to 2015 because in 2015 he was still pretty good. Carried by his front of year form in which he was LIGHTS OUT. Imo you are judging him based on two months. Form. Remember - form is temporary, class is permanent. I was mentioning Besler for everyone.
Taking your last point first. You are correct that there isn't a bank that you can exchange cash for Allocation money of either type. However, I am not sure there is a restriction which would prohibit any team from selling their allocation dollars or bundling it with a very low draft choice (e.g. the 3rd round in the supplemental draft) or reserve squad/previously loaned out player. You are likely correct that some number of smaller trades may be required. Of course we don't know how much of each allocation fund type the Galaxy may have. They may be able to trade current year regular allocation funds for a teams current and future targeted funds at a discounted rate. Therefore, they may need 10 deals but potentially they might need only 1 or zero if other options play out.
Based on previous years you'd think the answer is yes. But I don't think it's ever been clear exactly how much. The sum of $100,000 comes to my mind but I honestly can't say from where.
Who do you think we can trade Gerrard to? Did you really think his performance in any games was DP worthy?