Unless L1 starts paying 5he same expansion fees as C AND is in comparable markets, I doubt pro/rel will happen. USLC is hitting the not quite MLS markets and L1 is hitting the markets below that. I don't believe that the league will be willing to alter that for some deluded notion of "purity" any more than MLS would.
That's possible, but I think USL as a league is willing to try it to differentiate itself with the rest of the US Sports landscape. I think the gap between the bottom of USLC and the top of L1 when that time comes will be a lot smaller than you think. I also think the expansion fee's will be a dead issue because USL has said USLC expansion will at some point stop ... there will be no "delta" between USLC and L1 expansion fee's. L1 will be the entry fee across the board (and it will go up when ULSC closes). The price of getting into USLC will be L1+promotion. I also think market size will be negligible ... there are currently markets in L1 that are larger than USLC (Madison, WI larger than Birmingham, AL ... Omaha, NE is larger than plenty of USLC markets). I think MLS2 teams will be encouraged to sell their spot in USLC to people wanting to get into ULSC and that's how they'll "nudge" MLS2 teams down to L1. But this is all speculation/personal preference.
Except Jake Edwards has been very open about pro/rel between League 1 and the Championship being under consideration. Granted, they're just words until there's an actual plan, and he's never gone into specifics, but the very fact that they're entertaining the idea (unlike Garber) means they're at least prepping the existing franchises for the possibility of it.
? Birmingham is twice the size of Madison. Madison is about the same size as Chattanooga. I do think that USL would have to challenge some aspects of the PLS to implement pro/rel, though.
My bad ... I looked at a city population and not market size. The population of Madison is like 260k per the list I was looking at and Birmingham at 210k or so ... but that's not the right way to look at it anyways, my bad. Still, there are some cross overs I believe. I agree, the PLS could eventually be an issue, but only if a high enough percentage of cities with smaller populations enter USLC ... or if net worth of ownership groups becomes an issue. I think USL will work with USSF to get something of a working solution if pro/rel is implimented in a 50+ team 2 division setup.
Yeah, your general point is correct: Reno and Colorado Springs are under the population limit and if Monterey actually ever happens, it will be way under. Meanwhile, Richmond, Omaha, and Greenville are all over the minimum for D2.
D'oh. As a KCitian, I thought you wouldn't make that mistake as Kansas City has been "larger" than Saint Louis for, what, twenty years now, despite Saint Louis metro being far larger than KC metro (in population, that is). Oh well, can't win'em all.
I don't know this Saint Louis you speak of, if he's a "saint" I'm sure he's a fine person, but currently that name means nothing to me.
And Saint Louis is going away. Some more news out of St. Louis....https://t.co/bWjlNpUfbJ— Brian Straus (@BrianStraus) August 25, 2020
Not surprising, but it's a shame that they couldn't have simply relocated to another market in the region.
I don't get the outrage coming out of this. The team was owned by an nonprofit local soccer academy and its CEO decided to join St Louis City MLS ownership group instead. The team wouldn't survived COVID-19 regardless if it was continued for another year or two until St Louis City starts. Bring the brand from USL to MLS would lead to legal issues, unlike FC Cincinnati for example. Apparently that didn't stop the SUM/MLS and US Soccer conspiracies on Twitter, really bad, awful takes and fan shaming from folks whose time in American soccer was 2 years ago.
Now to find out about the Austin and Charlotte franchises in USL. Sacramento Republic is moving up to MLS.
I think there is a dwindling market for this, with many of USL's target markets already having someone sitting on the territorial rights. It would also require a team ready to make the jump immediately, which narrows the pool even more. Somewhere like New Orleans or Fort Worth, maybe. Or the Cosmos
Interesting that Sacramento USL-C makes the jump , St Louis won't be and although I have no proof what so ever, I don't think Austin and Charlotte USL-C will survive in their current forms. THUS, this is where as I posted elsewhere, a chat between MLS and USL and their relationship would be key. To me, all 3 of teams would ideally move over to USL-1 and be the reserve team. They could keep playing in current stadiums (although I think Charlotte is better moved to Memorial) & keep the same local ownership. The current owners would not have to fund players salaries, a big expense. Of course, this puts the reserves in USL-1. These teams if they want a relationship with a USL-C team for maybe the purposes of putting a few players on a higher level of play, could have a relationship with a nearby USL-C team. Austin with San Antonio, Charlotte with Raleigh, St Louis with Indy. Yes I know, requires a lot cooperation, lowered egos, rules and regs to properly work etc., (thus it won't probably happen) - So then another thought is, lets say Sac jumps and the other 3 disappear. Then in theory, USL-C could accept new teams in 4 more new markets. Are we going to run out of quality markets for a solid 2nd division? We have to consider that down the road MLS could add at least 2 more & some MLS-2 teams may drop down from USL-C. 32 is a nice size league, MLS hopefully stops there and USL-C can get there and stay there with the changes coming to its league. Lets face it, 64 professional level teams is pretty good, better than anything I have ever seen in my lifetime and if USL-1 fills out, it could be even more. Pretty amazing stuff.
---------------------- I have always wondered what MLS would have been like with the Cosmos on board. Truthfully, it would really have just been a famous name, I doubt that would be playing to 60,000 in the Meadowlands. However, a 3rd soccer team in the NY market would have been interesting. Cosmos should have swallowed their pride once the MLS ship sailed and gone USL-C along with Jacksonville. Odd Miami joined USL-C, although will be interesting to see what happens their if Beckhams team really takes off and captures the local market. I can see LA & NY markets having multiple pro markets, Miami, not so sure. (Yes, I know it probably would have never happened) But if they believed in soccer and just wanted to keep playing, they would have had plenty of teams on the east coast to keep travel down ) Jacksonville- Tampa/Charleston/ATL2, NYCosmos =Hartford/NYRB2/Phil Union As it is, the name Cosmos is simply "relegated" to the dustbin of soccer history. Pun intended.
Maybe Cosmos didn't want to pay the $10 million USL-C expansion fee (plus they have a delusional owner). One thing to remember about the classic Cosmos is that their average attendances were not much different to the Red Bulls and NYCFC combined. 1977 Cosmos - 34k 2014 New York Red Bulls - 19k 1978 Cosmos - 47k 2015 New York MLS - 48k 1979 Cosmos - 46k 2016 New York MLS - 48k 1980 Cosmos - 42k 2017 New York MLS - 43k 1981 Cosmos - 35k 2018 New York MLS - 42k 1982 Cosmos - 28k 2019 New York MLS - 37k
There are 34 USL-C teams after this season with St Louis shutting down. There are supposedly up to 6 more markets that USL-C are looking at according to a recent interview with the commish. He stated he was hoping for mid to upper 30s as the league team total. There are currently 5 franchises/groups looking to start sometime. Queensboro FC and a Rhode Island team in 2022, East Bay which can't seem to get a stadium going, Des Moines and Buffalo. The last two have not founded their teams yet. Don't know if the markets mention include these or in addition to. I would not be surprised that USL-C ends up in the 32 to 40 team range with the lower half being more likely to me.
===================== Right, because all of this info is regarding potential teams to add. We have no clue on who we will loose (like Rochester and Penn ) or who might drop. I got the impression that some of these cities, plus DMB's Fort Wayne team were looking at USL-1, not necessarily USL-C.
Exactly, it is a crazy situation with teams having several options for how they want to go if they field a team and even established teams being able to move. We will just have to wait for the expansion fever and shake out to end or at least slow down greatly.
USL will soon be getting a team that is run how all should be ran. By someone who is so fully in love with the game. Their gonna flip the script.