Kochen is much more of a speculative notion given he's only 17 and will be 20 come the 2026 World Cup. He'd have to be really really talented and make a major leap to be the guy come the World Cup. It's very unlikely. Slonina would have to take a big jump to pass Turner but it's less speculative. I think the path would be that he continues his good recent play in Belgium, spends the next season with Strasbourg and looks really good, and breaks through with Chelsea the following year. It's still pretty unlikely but he's at least playing first team soccer for time being.
It’s not as much of a jump if Turner (unfortunately) stumbles or tumbles further. He’s still the clear favorite, but we really need at least a couple of our other GKs to flow upward, and sooner rather than later.
Turner needs his "Guzan" just like Howard did. Someone who can challenge him and keep him on his toes and be a fine stand-in when called upon which is what Brad Guzan did in the years where Howard was our no.1 Horvath and Johnson aren't getting that done and Steffen looks a million miles from the NT.
I think with Turner the Trinidad goal was really the only bad goal he’s given up for the national team for a long time. It’s not likely he’ll do so again in the near future. But if he consistently starts giving up goals like that it would represent a very clear drop in his level and would open the door for Steffen, Horvath, Callendar etc. But none of those guys are as good as Turner when he is average level of form.
turner isnt howard, and frankly hes not even guzan. the refusal to factor in playing time is going to cost us.
It depends what we mean. Based on our current keeper pool, Steffen should still be under consideration when healthy. In terms of STARTING, he's got a lot of catching up to do. He's first got to prove that he's healthy. I'm not sure the last time was that Steffen has really been healthy. Our pool isn't deep enough to throw anyone away, though. He started many of our important WCQers this past cycle. It was Steffen in the nets for our critical victories over Mexico, Costa Rica, and Panama. Actually, he was also in the nets for our critical road draw at the Azteca. That wasn't ancient history. That was late 2021/early 2022. Matt Turner ain't lighting the world on fire. People gleefully dumped Steffen on the side of the road, and went "all in" with Turner. Now they're realizing Turner is just that same level as Steffen. They're all in that same band in terms of talent. Turner, Horvath, and Steffen. Keeper's a weird beast. It's hard to get a good gig. There are only so many. Really, the guy in the driver's seat for this job come 2026 is the guy who has the best job in the 2025-2026 club season. Could it be Slonina? I guess so. Or Slonina could be sitting there as a backup somewhere not getting any games. He could be Horvath'd. Just look at Horvath's club resume. One year at Molde he was the starter as they finished first in a Europa League group of Ajax, Celtic, and Fenerbahce. So he moved to Belgium. Won a League title as the starter. In the Champions League with Brugge he was the starter for successive wins against Dortmund, Monaco, and Athletico Madrid. He's won a Norwegian title as a starter, and a Belgian title as a starter (plus two more Belgian titles as the #2). He just was really good for Luton in the Championship for their promotion campaign. That guy is 4th string and unregistered for friggin' Nottingham Forest. In his prime. Can't get a game. So with keeper we just have to keep churning them out and developing them. Keep building the pool. The guy in the best form gets the games. Who the hell knows the identity of that person in 2026? Could it be Zack Steffen? I guess so. Zack Steffen is only 28. He'll be "in his prime" for WC2026. He's younger than Matt Turner. He certainly has a lot of work to do, though. As does Horvath. And ya know, Matt Turner could be sitting there as a backup at Forest for years now.
Turner is certainly the guy, the clear #1, but … (1) We need a clear, competent #2 even if Turner starts playing again and returns to fine form. Injuries can/do happen, often at inopportune moments. (2) There’s a moderate chance (not great but not small) that Turner will remain as a backup this season. He might get an FA Cup match or two, and again injuries (and suspensions) happen, plus the chance of poor performance by the current Forest #1 leading to Turner’s return to #1. Of further concern, it’s hard to imagine a mid-season loan or transfer. So there’s definitely a significant risk that Turner will lack substantial playing time and therefore lack game sharpness - for who knows how long.
Its a weird one. Ya know.............Brad Friedel was a journeyman until about the age Turner is now. [For a multitude of reasons. One of them being his inability to get a work permit.] He moved to Blackburn when he was ~29, then he just took off. Sometimes its just about finding the right opportunity. Horvath is 28. Steffen is 28. Turner is 29. They all SHOULD be entering their primes. Let's hope all 3 get back on track. One of our challenges in the 2018 cycle was that the guys who were supposed to take over.................didn't. The Bill Hamid generation. [Bill Hamid is still only 33.] You worry a little bit about this current Horvath/Steffen/Turner generation totally stagnating. Then we might have to count on guys who aren't ready like Slonina. [That's not to say Horvath/Steffen/Turne aren't fine for the CONCACAF level. They demonstrably have been.]
I’m less worried about the second case since he was the backup at Arsenal going into the World Cup and it didn’t seem to impact him. But we of course want him to be playing regularly and I agree we need a clear 2 in case he’s hurt (which seems to be Horvath at current).
I don't know what Horvath's role is. To date, Ethan Horvath has started one game that's mattered for the USMNT. A Nations League group stage game against El Salvador. That's it. These boards consistently talk about him like he's challenging for #1, but he never seems to have been in the minds of our coaches.
Are you sure? GB was asked about Horvath between the international breaks, and curiously he replied lyrically. Maybe we didn't start him Quite as often as we could have Maybe we didn't play him Quite as good as we should have If we made him feel, oh, second best (you did, you did) Ethan, I'm sorry we were blind You were always on our minds You were always on our minds
I don’t think he’s challenging to be the number one, but he’s pretty clearly the number 2 at current. His current club situation makes him vulnerable to lose his spot but no one has surpassed him yet.
We definitely need some guys to emerge from amongst the Callender or Celentano types. At least until Brady or Slonina are further along. The guy who might most deserve amongst the MLS guys is maybe Brad Stuver. Except for the fact that he’s already 32.
I like Turner, he’s had one bad game with the US but that game coincides with his club benching him, and I’m in the camp a goalie needs to play. Celentano has a chance because he’s playing for MLS Cup semis, possibly final and then surely the Jan. match. If he plays great and carries it into January he could be the next Matt Turner, rising from MLS simply because he actually plays matches. Or Slonina but I never see him though I’d like to.
My opinion on Slonina comes from Chicago where I thought he was positionally a disaster but of course his size, wingspan, athletic ability were worth investing in. Reminded me of a young Guzan, can get low really quick for a big guy.
how the hell are we ever gonna know if they dont play? same for slonina. how can anyone emerge if turner doesnt break his leg? im asking. the manager makes up his mind on something and the only thing that has consistently changed that is his preferred option being unavailable or drastically falling off. who has actually "won" a position over his tenure(s)? turner didnt get a shot until steffens body starting falling apart and/or he wasnt available. slonina couldnt get a gold cup match cause designated backup johnson was there, and couldnt get the second leg vs trinidad over a benched turner. its absolutely valid to argue if a prem backup (whos never shown to be an inch better than that) is "better" than a belgian league starter (or mls, for that matter)- but thats not an argument we need to have. turner is going to get every minute hes available for. thats based on a dozen cases of the national team doubling as a club career rehab center under this manager. one of brady, celentano, etc will likely get the minutes in jan- unless johnson is fit. and callender has been in camps so you wanna take the odds? but you, me and everyone else know in march its going to be turner- and it doesnt matter if he doesnt play a single minute between now and then. we can argue the depth chart all we want, factor in all nuance, but its not a decision berhalter makes more than once. if turner is available for selection and ambulatory hes gonna play. ill repeat my question- when has that not been the case? whos performance at a club level has won them a spot (on the pitch) over a player who is fit and available? injuries, suspensions, players not being released- those are the factors that determine "chances" in our team. i dont mean to be crass with the "unless turner breaks his leg" comment, but thats what it takes. its takes a late knock to arriola for weah to see the pitch. theres no length of time dest can be inactive that scallys ability and/or club performances can overcome.
The thing is we have their MLS play to compare to Turner. Turner was at a very elite level in MLS and the only goalie in MLS who has been at the level (and was a bit better even) was Petrovic. So when MLS guys start matching the level that Turner showed in MLS that’ll be a good sign that they are ready to compete with him. https://www.americansocceranalysis.com/home/2023/8/28/thomas-bayes-meet-djordje-petrovic Similar situation with Slonina who is in a league roughly comparable to MLS (and in my opinion slightly better). He started the season not great but has played better as of late. These guys have to prove it with their club’s first. The thing with the goalie position is that the shot stopping statistics tell us quite a bit as a starting pointing. Goalkeeping is about more than that of course, but if you’re not really close as a shotstopper it’s not worth looking at the other factors. And Brady, Celentano, Callender, Slonina, etc have to show it with their clubs, during the Olympics, and to the extent they get opportunities in January camp (where we have been told to expect a younger roster). That’s how they show they deserve a chance. Which is the same way Turner fought his way onto the team through his strong play in MLS.
no, we dont. we dont have a sharp turner playing every week to compare anyone too. its comparing an apple to what a three year old apple was. and i still disagree that he "fought his way into the team". everyone was convinced he was "better" than steffen- who at the time was getting every cup match for city (which is a very different thing than every cup match for forest). and as it turns out "everyone" was right for two reasons: injuries to steffen/a gold cup and the fact that we havent seen that same steffen since. how does slonina fight his way into the team (on the pitch) when he doesnt have gold cups (in fact we didnt play him in the one gc he had)? when we wont play him in friendlies? when we wont play him when guys above him are benched?
Turner got his national team chance because of how well he played in MLS. And then he played very well in the Gold Cup. Things were a bit back and forth between him and Steffen from that point until he ultimately won the job. Part of the reason we haven’t seen Steffen anytime recently is because he’s been dealing with a long term injury that caused him to be out for the summer and since then as well. The not playing week to week is a recent thing. Turner wasn’t playing every week in the lead up to the World Cup and it didn’t seem to impact his tournament. And this most recent window was right when he had lost his job and had only been on the bench for a game. It’s hard to say the bad goal he gave up at Trinidad was because he hadn’t been playing regularly as the benching had only just occurred. And I would argue that Turner is a better goalie today than he was three years ago and has improved a lot of aspects of his game outside of shot stopping. Is your argument we should start Slonina in the Nations League finals? Cause we don’t have friendlies till June with the A team (when we should have a game or two prep for Copa America). Slonina’s opportunity will be the Olympics and potentially the 2025 Gold Cup. And if he wants chances with the A team he’s going to have to show he deserves it via his club play. And I’m sure in January we’ll see some combination of Callender, Celentano, and Brady. But I’m not sure how much is going to come out of starting that friendly for all of them. The real value is going to be being in a long camp with the coaching staff. My larger question is what do you think we should be doing? Should a different goalie be starting in March or for the Copa America?
not going back over every date in the last year ill just say he should have started the second t&t match. if turner doesnt play in the interim i would start him in the nl semi- though it would be a lot easier to say if we had seen him a week ago. the copa will depend on if he (slonina) gets a chance in the nl (and how he takes it, obviously), what the mls guys do in jan (we will likely have a second friendly there, dont you think? a garbage el salvador-ish match, but what are you gonna do?) and if turner manages to play more than very possibly 1 fa cup match. it also depends on the timeline though- which i havent look at yet- i think if we have >6ish days in camp we could feasibly get turner up to speed "enough".
It sounds like only one friendly in January which I’m guessing Callender will end up starting. I’d still take Turner over Slonina in March unless Slonina raises his club play. I don’t think Slonina is quite ready yet (which isn’t a knock on him given he’s 19 and in his first season as a starter in Europe). I’d probably take Horvath or the MLS guys as well over Slonina at this exact moment (and Horvath should have a move by then and hopefully will be playing regularly). And Turner could win his job back by March as well.
I haven't given up on Steffen and am interested to see if a lot of his recent trouble was because of a problematic knee. He was quite good in Germany before getting injured but hasn't been the same since. Could he be a reclamation project?