I was curious to know which U.S. players, past and present, are college graduates. I know that many of them have spent some time in college, but I am talking about the ones who actually hold degrees. Years ago I remember reading that Keller was working on finishing his degree (in sociology, I believe) through correspondence courses while playing in England, although I'm not sure if he finished. Anyone know of any?
Jay DeMerit (Illinois-Chicago) Marcus Hahnemann (Seattle Pacific) Robbie Findley (Oregon State) Brian Ching (Gonzaga) Kerry Zavagnin (UNC-Chapel Hill) Ante Razov (UCLA) ?? Brian McBride (St Louis) Cobi Jones (UCLA) I'm sure there's more, but I was just going from the recognizable names currently available on the US Soccer Wikipedia page. Anyway, I think it's a good sign that more and more of our Nats are only going for two or three years and then becoming professionals.
Here are all the players capped by the US senior team since the start of MLS that played four years of college soccer. You have to figure that unless they were all just total ********-ups that most of them earned their degrees. Code: PLAYER POS CAP/GLS CURRENT TEAM COLLEGE DOB Jeff Agoos D 134/4 RETIRED Virginia 5/2/68 Chris Armas M 66/2 Chicago Fire Adelphi 8/27/72 Wade Barrett D 2/0 Houston Dynamo William & Mary 6/23/76 *Scott Benedetti F 1/0 RETIRED Portland 11/16/66 Nat Borchers D 2/0 Odd Grenland (Norway) Denver 4/13/81 Jonathan Bornstein D 11/1 Chivas USA UCLA 11/7/84 Bobby Boswell D 3/0 DC United Fla. International 3/15/83 Paul Bravo F 4/1 RETIRED Santa Clara 7/19/68 Dario Brose M 4/1 RETIRED NC State 1/27/70 C.J. Brown D 15 Chicago Fire San Jose State 6/15/75 Mike Burns D 75/0 RETIRED Hartwick 9/14/70 Dan Calichman D 3/0 RETIRED Williams 2/21/68 Paul Caligiuri D/M 110/5 RETIRED UCLA 3/9/64 Joe Cannon GK 2 Los Angeles Galaxy Santa Clara 1/1/75 Brian Ching F 25/5 Houston Dynamo Gonzaga 5/24/78 Mark Chung M 24/2 RETIRED South Florida 6/18/70 Jimmy Conrad D 23/1 Kansas City Wizards UCLA 2/12/77 *Mac Cozier F 1/0 RETIRED UNC-Charlotte 10/23/73 Leo Cullen M 3/0 RETIRED Maryland 2/28/76 Jeff Cunningham F 10/0 Toronto FC South Florida 8/21/76 Jay Demerit D 6/0 Watford (England) Illinois-Chicago 12/4/79 Mark Dodd F 15 RETIRED Duke 9/14/65 Todd Dunivant D 2/0 Toronto FC Stanford 12/26/80 *Ted Eck M/F 13/1 RETIRED Western Illinois 7/14/66 Joe Franchino M 1/0 New England Revolution Washington 8/8/76 Robin Fraser D 27/0 RETIRED Fla. International 12/17/66 Cory Gibbs D 18/0 Charlton (England) Brown 1/14/80 Josh Gros M 1/0 DC United Rutgers 6/25/82 Henry Gutierrez M 1/0 RETIRED NC State 8/28/68 Marcus Hahnemann GK 6 Reading (England) Seattle Pacific 6/15/72 *Jean Harbor F 15/0 RETIRED Alabama A&M 9/19/65 Kevin Hartman GK 5 Kansas City Wizards UCLA 5/24/74 *Paul Holocher M 1/0 RETIRED Santa Clara 5/24/69 *Tayt Ianni D 1/0 RETIRED UCLA 12/6/71 Ugo Ihemulu D 1/0 Colorado Rapids Southern Methodist 4/3/83 Cobi Jones M 164/15 Los Angeles Galaxy UCLA 6/16/70 Miles Joseph M 3/0 RETIRED Clemson 5/2/74 Kasey Keller GK 102 Fulham (England) Portland 11/29/69 Chris Klein M 22/5 Los Angeles Galaxy Indiana 1/4/76 Ritchie Kotschau D 1/0 Real Salt Lake George Mason 11/22/75 Jason Kreis F 14/1 Real Salt Lake Duke 12/29/72 Alexi Lalas D 96/9 RETIRED Rutgers 6/1/70 Roy Lassiter F 30/4 RETIRED NC State 3/9/69 *Joey Leonetti F 2/0 RETIRED Portland 5/25/70 Eddie Lewis M 72/8 Derby County (England) UCLA 5/17/74 Brian Maisonneuve M 13/0 RETIRED Indiana 6/28/73 Jesse Marsch M 2/0 Chivas USA Princeton 11/8/73 *Tim Martin D 2/0 RETIRED Fresno State 4/12/67 Pablo Mastroeni M 57/0 Colorado Rapids NC State 8/26/76 Clint Mathis M 46/12 New York Red Bulls South Carolina 11/25/76 Brian McBride F 95/30 Fulham (England) Saint Louis 6/19/72 Matt McKeon M 2/0 RETIRED Saint Louis 9/24/74 Brian Mullan M 4/0 Houston Dynamo Creighton 4/23/78 Richard Mulrooney M 14/0 Houston Dynamo Creighton 11/3/76 Bryan Namoff D 1/0 DC United Bradley 5/28/79 Pat Noonan F 13/1 New England Revolution Indiana 8/2/80 Mike Petke D 2/0 Colorado Rapids So. Connecticut 1/30/76 Eddie Pope D 82/8 Real Salt Lake North Carolina 12/24/73 Tom Presthus GK 1 RETIRED Southern Methodist 4/5/75 Steve Ralston M 36/4 New England Revolution Fla.International 6/14/74 Tab Ramos M 81/8 RETIRED NC State 9/21/66 Ante Razov F 25/6 Chivas USA UCLA 3/2/74 Matt Reis GK 2 New England Revolution UCLA 3/28/75 Chris Rolfe F 6/0 Chicago Fire Dayton 1/17/83 Tony Sanneh D 43/3 Colorado Rapids Wis.-Milwaukee 6/1/71 Mark Santel M 8/1 RETIRED Saint Louis 6/5/68 Clyde Simms M 1/0 DC United East Carolina 8/21/82 Juergen Sommer GK 8 RETIRED Indiana 2/27/69 Ryan Suarez D 1/0 RETIRED San Jose State 7/28/77 Zach Thornton GK 8 Colorado Rapids Loyola 10/10/73 Greg Vanney D 37/1 DC United UCLA 6/11/74 Pete Vagenas M 2/0 Los Angeles Galaxy UCLA 2/6/78 Peter Vermes F 67/11 RETIRED Rutgers 11/21/66 Sasha Victorine M 4/1 Kansas City Wizards UCLA 2/3/78 Billy Walsh M 1/0 RETIRED Rutgers 10/7/75 Zach Wells GK 1 Houston Dynamo UCLA 2/26/81 Richie Williams M 20/0 RETIRED Virginia 6/30/70 John Wolyniec F 2/0 New York Red Bulls Fordham 1/24/77 Kerry Zavagnin M 21/0 Kansas City Wizards North Carolina 7/20/74 *Only cap during the MLS Era came in “the boycott game” against Peru, 10/16/96 I can’t say one way or the other if all these guys graduated from college. I do know that there are a lot of obstacles for these guys. In the old days, when the U20 team was still mostly college players, the guys on the team had to take a semester off to prepare for the World Youth Championship. That costs them a semester, there. And then many players who are drafted in MLS after their senior seasons skip the second semester of their senior year to be able to go to MLS training camp and get a good start on their pro career. So that’s another semester, there. And, of course, often NCAA athletes only take 12 hours a semester, especially the semester their sport is in season, so they can be behind pace to graduate that way, too. Some are able to go back ad finish their degrees. But I’d be surprised if all the players listed above did so. That said, I do know some players have their degrees. Cory Gibbs, for instance, didn’t join St. Pauli immediately after his senior year, despite having an offer, because he wanted to finish school. Eddie Pope famously had it in his contract that DCU had to pay for him to go back and forth to Chapel Hill so he could finish his degree. Others were fifth-year seniors – Clint Mathis, Matt Reis, Kevin Hartman, Ritchie Kotschau - and you have to figure that greatly improves their chances of getting a degree. Even Mathis. Leo Cullen went back to Maryland to get his Master’s, which implies he has an undergrad degree. While he was with the Burn, Ryan Suarez started taking graduate classes. (Some Dallas fans point to that as a turning point in his career and claim he wasn’t the same player once he started pursuing his Master’s. I can’t comment on that.) Most colleges require their coaches to have degrees and several of the players listed above are or were in the college coaching ranks. Paul Bravo (UCLA), Paul Caligiuri (Cal-Poly Pomona), Dan Calichman (Claremont-McKenna), Richie Williams (UVa), Paul Holocher (Cal-Poly SLO), Tim Martin (Santa Clara) have all been college head or assistant coaches, implying they have their degrees. Finally, I know of a couple of US national team players that didn’t play four years of college ball that have their degrees. John O’Brien got a degree from the University of Amsterdam while he was at Ajax. Brian West, who left UVa after his sophomore year, finished his degree at Ohio State while with the Crew. I don’t know if he finished or not, but Oguchi Onyewu has been taking correspondence and Internet classes at Clemson to finish his degree. One last thought - I find it interesting that of the 18 players whom Bob Bradley has given a first-cap to, only four - Bornstein, Demerit, Gros and Namoff – played four years of college soccer. Clearly, the trend is for our elite players to play less than four years of college soccer, if they play at all.
You got it. The trend should be: no college players in the nat team. College is where players that had any semblence of talent left go to lose the rest of it. The college system in its current state is, sorry to say, a joke. Its not competitive enough, and the commitment is not there even if a prospective college player wants to go pro, he has to spend a great deal of time on academics when it is required that he spend all of his time, like its done everywhere else in the world, on soccer. The quality of MLS will begin to see even faster improvement in its youth ranks when it starts to move further away from using the college ranks as feeder system - that or college soccer somehow becomes on par with college football and basketball. Note: to those who might jump on my case and cite someone like Claudio Reyna as an example of a player who had a college education and had a successful career, I say (1) imagine how good he would have been if he had spent those critical years training at the higher levels, and (2) he was not a superstar in any case, just a very competent player.
And to add another note to this one: Johann Cruyff invited Reyna to join Barcelona after seeing him play in the '92 Olympics that were held in that same city. Reyna turned down the offer in order to finish college.
Just to be clear, Reyna turned it down to "go back" to college. Reyna left UVa in the winter of 94, midway thru his Jr. year after leading the Cavs to their third straight NCAA title. He spent the first part of 94 in the US' residency program in Chula Vista leading up to the WC and that summer, after the WC, he signed with Bayer Leverkusen. To the best of my knowledge, Reyna isn't a college graduate. As luring as Barcalona is and was, college education is still hugely important to American parents, often moreso with first-generation American parents like Reyna's, who may not have had a chance to go to school. As baffling as his decision to go back to Charlottesville seems now, at the time, from his perspective, it isn't that surprising. Now, the culture in American soccer puts far less emphasis on the college game than was the case 15 years ago and, as we all know, it's actually rare now when an elite prospect stays all four years. (Though too many still stay too long.) But back then, college soccer was something you walked away from much more judiciously.
Good point. Just to be clear, my position is I don't think any potentially elite player in the US should play college soccer for any period of time; rather, they should go directly to a pro system youth squad from the get go. If things don't work out, there is nothing wrong with going to college. There are plenty of late starting collegiates.
Something else to consider: how many of our Nats and 2010 prospects are current/former members of Project 40/Gen Adidas? That's the key right there.. getting these players signed young but giving them a guaranteed option to attend college if their career doesn't work out.
You can not put a premium on a college degree. Education should be first and foremost with our youth. But I will be the first to say that some, not all players, lose some degree of development through the college system. It's just not up to par. We shouldn't rely on the college system to produce talent. Soccer is a game that by 21-23 yrs. old you should be hitting your stride because by 30 it's a down hill spiral for most. As MLS clubs develop their academies, I would like to see the academies offer educational benefits like putting the kids through college. It will benefit all parties in the long run.
I think you are right, and ultimately I think that is what you are going to see from the MLS youth team systems in the future. Lost perhaps in all of this is that the traditional "system" just isnt going to work in the USA. Although some youth players will be directly signed by euro clubs, those that stay in the US should have the extra incentive of guaranteed or at least aided college education. This is probably the best of both worlds.
So he turned down Barcelona in order to go back to school, and then ended up signing for Bayer Leverkusen instead and yet still didn't graduate? If that's true then I can't help but find it to be a bit of a tragedy.
Here's a question. Who was the last player to get a cap for the USMNT, while they were still enrolled in college. This presumably hasn't happened since MLS' inception in 96. I've always thought it was Reyna, but I'm not sure that's true. As a U.S. national player, Reyna got his first cap against Norway on January 15, 1994. He was a member of the team at the 1994 FIFA World Cup, but did not play due to injury. (think of that. Reyna really should have played in 4 world cups. 3 is a great achievement. 4 is legendary) On August 8, 1994, Reyna signed with German Bundesliga club Bayer Leverkusen after playing in the 1994 FIFA World Cup. So I guess its possible that Reyna's first cap came while he was still attending classes at Virginia. Is that possible? I bet somebody like Sandon knows the answer to that. Had he left school to train full-time, or was he still in school during that January cap against Norway. I was reminded of this recently when somebody went on a tirade in the Yanks abroad forum about Joseph Lapira of Notre Dame not getting a shot at the USMNT. He got called up for Ireland for a friendly in NYC, instead. And here I was thinking that the USMNT would never ever call up an NCAA player again. Ever... So if Lapira (or this poster who claimed to be a friend of Lapira's) was expecting the call from the USSF he was really kidding himself.
The last amateur/college player to be capped by the US senior team was Ante Razov, who got capped against Uruguay in March of 95 in Dallas in what was Bora's last game. It was the spring of Razov's junior year when he got capped. No player still in college has been capped since, though Chris Albright got a call-up in June of 99 when he was still at UVa. He didn't play in the game (it was the Argentina match at RFK the US won 1-0) and shortly after that he signed with MLS anyway. Reyna wasn't in college when he debuted with the US. As I said earlier, instead of returning to Charlottesville for the spring semester of his junior year, he joined the US residency program and that's when he got his first cap. Amazingly, for someone who was one of the best college players ever and for playing in an era when college kids got capped, Reyna never got a cap while still in college.
Jonas actually got his cap while he was still in HS. He, Mike Slivinski and Nelson Vargas were standouts on the US U17 team in 1991 and shortly after the U17 WC ended. The US had a good showing in that tournament, beating host Italy, Argentina and China in group play before being upset by Quatar (Quatar?) in PKs after a 1-1 tie in the second round. That was in August of 91 and in September of that month the US played Jamaica and Bora gave Jonas, Slivinski and Vargas a cap in that game. That's the match where Sivinski became the youngest American to get a Sr. cap till Freddy played 10 minutes against Canada last year. It was also the only cap for Jonas and Slivinski and Vargas only got two more. I know Jonas played four seasons of ball at NC State but I have no idea if he graduated.
I remember that one. I still have it on video. But does it still count since the game was abandoned due to a thunderstorm?
We still have the right to say that 6 former NC State players have at least one cap with the senior US national team. Pablo Mastroeni, Tab Ramos, Roy Lassiter, Dario Brose, Mark Jonas, and Henry Gutierrez.
No one is doubting that. Though, it doesn't say much for the developmental process at State if a guy comes IN to the program having been capped and leaves not good enough to get drafted by MLS. BTW, best State player not to get capped by the US was Scott Schweitzer. He was a really good player and I think was good enough to be capped even when playing with Rochester (summer) and Cleveland (winter). Had MLS been willing to pay him enough to match the two salaries he was earning, I think he'd have been one of the better defenders in the league and earned a cap. Can't prove it, of course, but I believe it. And if you go back a few years, it's too bad Sam Okpodu and Chris Ogu couldn't have become US citizens. Given the era they played in (early 80's) had they been US citizens I'm pretty sure they'd have been capped. But I digress.
Scott Schweitzer said on the radio one day that he chose to play in the USL instead of MLS because the rivalries are better and he doesn't like the single entity system.
According to this article Michael Parkhurst graduated from Wake Forest. And his MLS profile states that he was on the Dean's List every semester.