Through the teams from A through D in the alphabet, based on improved rankings during their tenures (not treating WCC teams as mid-majors although they really are): Larry Friend @ Air Force Jim Thomas @ Boise State Kia McNeill @ Brown Tari St John and Rob Alman @ Butler Gavin McKinney @ Chattanooga Neil Stafford @ Cincinnati Bill Hempen @ Colorado State Tracey Bartholomew @ Columbia
Do the high profile jobs open not pay enough to get any of these candidates? Lots of quality suggestions.
I kind of called it..... Stafford had a lot of success early in his tenure at Cincinnati but his last two years have largely been disappointing. Are you hinting that he might be ready to move on to a position above a mid-major? If so, I will respectfully disagree with you. In all honesty I really don't believe that he is ready for that.
No, I'm only reporting that over his time at Cincinnati, its rank has been improving at a fairly good rate. I consider Massey as more reliable than the NCAA's RPI, and their Massey rank has improved about 60 positions from the year before he arrived (2012) to this past year (2019). That's notwithstanding that their rank was poorer the last 2 years than the prior group of years. Also, his teams also have been playing significantly tougher schedules than when he arrived. That says to me that if I'm a smart AD (or other person in charge of the hiring process), he's on my list of possible coaches I want to check into further.
I would throw Todd Dyers name in this mix from Longwood University.He has done a great job at Longwood.
DePaul Univ. They have arguably the worst women’s soccer facility in the country yet the coaching staff somehow gets it done year after year.
Worst facility in the country?? Don’t think so. Average sure. Plus a great academic school. Those coaches in my opinion achieve around what they should give or take year in year out. In the same conference what the Xavier staff have done in a short amount of time is incredible.
Fine but definitely worst facility in the big east. And I was not arguing whether Xavier has or has not done a great job ; they have.
Can’t coach, can you describe the DePaul soccer facility or r u just guessing that their soccer facilities r average?
I appreciate your viewpoint and do recognize that Cincinnati has been playing against a more difficult schedule during Stafford's tenure. That said, Cincinnati is 13-18-6 over the past two years. Wouldn't an AD want to first see if the performance over the past two years is an anomaly or, rather, a continuing trend? If Stafford did have designs on moving up to a higher level than Cincinnati, he probably should have done so earlier similar to Matt Fannon going from Bowling Green to Iowa State. I guess that is always the risk that coaches take, though. Additionally, Stafford may be perfectly content and wish to remain in Cincinnati. I pointed out earlier that while Lie has done a good, or even excellent, job at Xavier, he probably needs to show what he does with more of his recruits and a stiffer out of conference schedule. I would not deem him ready to move on just yet.
First, Dyer isn't going anywhere but I'm curious what you base that statement on? Has Longwood ever won the Big South? been to an NCAA Tournament? I understand Dyer to be a good person but he's in a winnable conference at an affordable state school in a great soccer state with a good budget, but hasn't really done much. I see 2 seasons with 10 wins since joining the Big South in 2012. RPI around 200. This thread was started with the question "who are the other top Mid Major Head Coaches that should be considered for the jump to the next level?" If the standard here is decent people that have .500 records, we are going to have a very long list!
But it is all relative...some of these up and coming mid major coaches have lots of things going for them in regards to facilities, location, etc. They may be very good coaches, not denying that and ready for a power 5 team, but it is a bit easier then at other places. If VMI finishes mid tables in the SoCon that is a tremendous result for that coach...same if Arkansas Pine Bluff would beat some traditional D1 teams...lots of things to consider when looking at coaches...for some attracting solid players may be easy...but for others who are not getting top players but still winning games, those are top coaches. just some thoughts...
Could be, which would suggest that it takes far more years to evaluate what a coach can do (at least on the "good coach" side) than a lot of posters on BS think.
Agree with you. Some places a monkey could win. Great academics. Fully funded. Beautiful campus. Great location. I think the bigger question might be whether any of the Power 5 coaches are ready to step up to a mid-major! Lol. Where the academics are so so, facilities poor, and the funding light. In all seriousness though, you can’t judge solely on record. You need to look at two things IMO. 1) Where the program was when the coach arrived. 2) What is the ceiling for the program based on comparable schools and are they achieving close to that. You could also add a third piece which is can they recruit and win with their own players. To see that one, you’d need to analyze the coach over a 4-5 year period. What mid Majors have taken the biggest jumps over the past couple of years relative to where they were? Does Massey show that?
Are mid majors everyone except Power 5? WCC, Ivy League, Big East, CAA and Conference USA would be the next group?
Obviously Matt Fannon is one of them as his Bowling Green teams improved significantly and very quickly. I also mentioned Michael Thomas at South Dakota as they were poor before he took over and has turned them around quickly into a winning program. In the same conference Chris Logan did the same thing at North Dakota. You got to give those coaches props as I couldn’t even imagine living in the Dakotas let alone running a soccer program there and recruiting to that region. Illinois Chicago had a huge turnaround this year as well. I think you can recruit to the Chicago area but there is plenty of competition in that area too. i think these are good examples of good coaches improving bad programs quickly so it can be done. Do the trend back this up CP?
I think your 1, 2, and 3 all are good. I'm going through the schools in alphabetical order, looking at the schools' ranking trends, including trends since new coaches stepped in over the last 13 years so long as the coach has had at least 4 years at the school. Massey doesn't provide the trends, but I have his ratings/rankings and do the trends. In a bit, I'll provide some examples. (I actually do this as a coach resource for non-conference scheduling, but it lets you look at how coaches have done, too.) Illinois Chicago had a massive, stunning ranking improvement in 2019. Of course, in Tom Anagnost it has a coach who was looking very good as a Power 5 coach, so although the extent of the improvement is surprising, a significant improvement isn't. South and North Dakota both have done a lot better during their coaches' short tenures, but it's not clear yet how far they'll be able to take those teams. So I'd say the coaches are looking good so far, but reaching a final conclusion probably is premature. I'm only up to the F's in team names, so it will be a while before I get to charts for them that include their 2019 results.
To piggyback on the last few posts I would agree with many of the names mentioned but personally I wouldn’t consider an Ivy, Big East, or WCC school as a mid-major. The Ivy League has a higher RPI than the Big 12, one of the Power 5 conferences. And any conference with Georgetown, Santa Clara, BYU, Portland, or Pepperdine doesn’t have the feel of a mid-major. One thing to also keep in mind is that there can be wide discrepancies at the mid-major level, where 1-2 teams can be fully funded and have bigger budgets than the rest and other programs may have less than half the resources. That alone can create a big competitive advantage. Monmouth in the MAAC is a great example, no way does St. Peter’s, Manhattan, Canisius, etc. have what they have in terms of resources. Doesn’t minimize what Turner has done but it’s worth mentioning and keeping in mind. You may see disparities at the Power 5 level within those conferences too (Washington St doesn’t have what UCLA does) but typically not as wildly a difference than mid-major conferences
Mid majors are the schools that are not P5. That is pretty universally accepted. The Ivy being ranked higher than the Big 12 is a combination of the Big 12 not being very good this year and the IVY gaming the system. Leave it to those smart people. Results of this "top" conference v the P5? Brown 0-0 and 0-2 Colgate 0-3 Cornell dnp Dartmouth 2-0 (Syracuse) Harvard dnp Penn 1-5 Princeton 1-2, 0-0, 0-3 Yale 1-2 So this "power" conference had 1 win against a P5 school (Syracuse.) They went 1-6-2. The IVY being RPI ranked higher is a bad example. I would think the AAC and the WCC are better examples.
To "piggyback" The Big east was a 2 big league. And 1 of those was an auto qualifier. The highest ranked RPI Big East team was 35. The WCC- Portland is not relevant anymore. There was 1 WCC team in the top 25. and 3 in the top 50. AAC- Had 2 teams in the top 50. To give you an example- Hofstra lost this year to Penn St 6-1 and Rutgers 4-1. These leagues have some good teams no question but that is the reason for the thread. They are doing a good job in not top top leagues. Examples of Top Mid major coaches for me: Georgetown Memphis BYU Brown USC FAU FGCU SLU Pepperdine All school who have beaten P5 schools and or won their league with regularity.
For what it’s worth...my list of teams that have dominated their conference and are in the NCAA Tournament on a regular basis! South Florida/Memphis in the AAC BYU/Santa Clara in the WCC Denver - Summit Brown - Ivy League North Texas - CUSA FGCU - ASUN Georgetown - Big East SLU - A10
Great chocies! And most of those have made noise against quality opponents. I would think a list of top Mid Major coaches would need to have had significant success in their conferences and a few scalps to hang their hat on! Most of those would check both of those boxes! Brown, Denver maybe haven't.