The Trump Presidency :::

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by crazypete13, Mar 20, 2017.

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  1. The Devil's Architect

    Feb 10, 2000
    The American Steppe
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Who am I kidding, I'd part her like the Red Sea
     
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  2. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #752 bigredfutbol, Mar 23, 2017
    Last edited: Mar 23, 2017
    I think "invention" is the wrong term; Jefferson wasn't consciously trying to create a party system (although his ally Madison was one of the first to acknowledge that it was happening).

    He played a leading role in the process by which the ideological split between him and Hamilton developed into the competition between the "proto-parties" of the Republicans and the Federalists.
     
  3. Umar

    Umar Member+

    Sep 13, 2005
    One step ahead
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    Nat'l Team:
    Palestine
    Not really. You think the poor benefit most from the military, police, intelligence, courts, infrastructure etc? If the USA got invaded by China tomorrow, the poor would hardly be affected at all. If would be the rich who would lose their wealth and influence.

    Public spending generally benefits the "haves" under the status quo, and pays out just enough to the "have-nots" to avoid insurrection.

    I agree that the idea of making taxes optional in the US is unworkable though.
     
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  4. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    http://www.rawstory.com/2017/03/fbis-russia-probe-expands-to-pizzagate-threats/

    Liberals who are Tottenham or ManU fans have yet another reason to hate Arsenal.

    "One of the principal proselytizers of the PizzaGate conspiracy appears to be David Seaman*, a one-time unpaid Huffington Post contributor and author of Dirty Little Secrets of Buzz: How to Attract Massive Attention for Your Business, Your Product, or Yourself. Seaman's personal YouTube channel has been viewed over 6 million times since October 2016, when he began writing about PizzaGate.

    According to one account, he is also "the founder of Shutterline Interactive, a vehicle for rapidly deploying publicity stunts.” In a 2008 YouTube interview to publicize his book, Seaman said, “I would protest gravity if I thought it was going to get me buzz.”

    In an online March 3 video, he talked about his “Journey from HuffPo to PizzaGate.”

    He and others are calling for a “March on Comet Pizza” on Saturday, March 25.

    “If you don't know who David Seaman is, he's the self-appointed head spokesman of the Pizzagate movement,” according to another account on Reddit. “If you are a pizzagater, this association should make you very nervous, because David Seaman is a mentally unstable con man.”

    With that mustache and pony tail, you just KNEW he was a crazy perv.

    *Might be a different guy with the same name. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
     
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  5. beerslinger23

    beerslinger23 Member+

    Jun 26, 2010
    Jedi mind tricks only work in the movies little bro... Paul Manafort may have been shit-canned last year but Russian bodies who happen to be mixed up with the Steele Dossier keep piling up, like as in this week.
     
  6. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
    Club:
    Seattle Sounders
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The attacks between Jefferson and Adams were pretty epic.
     
  7. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    I would argue that he "invented" the Federalists by lumping all those who favored mercantilism and all those who saw advantage in association with England and all those who were concerned about the potential outcome of the French Revolution into one group and opposing them (and by dissing Washington in the process of that opposition.) The Democrats (let us remember that the party called the Republicans for convenience was actually the root of today's Democrats) were the inevitable consequence of that opposition.

    But conscious invention, maybe, but more likely not-- maybe. So much of what Jefferson did was in the nature of reflexive behavior; and his considered behavior so often overruled his reflexes that it is hard to tell what he was consciously intending. Invention by unintended consequence, anyone?
     
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  8. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    Bollox.

    What services do you think enables a billionaire to keep his outside share of cash and wealth from the 99%?
     
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  9. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I bow to your knowledge on the newspaper era!

    My knowledge is restricted to the modern media era - but I think my point holds

    The SOP was invented before such a thing as modern media existed

    And thus the journalistic function is essentially a "for profit" exercise

    Even with the BBC there is still a degree of state control.

    IMO the information role should have been an independent branch of government - like Judges.
     
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  10. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I like your formulation--there was still a lot of work to be done before the "factionalization" of politics he played an import role in turned into an actual party system. I guess I'd argue that Jefferson was an important actor in a larger story rather than a prime mover, if that makes sense.
     
  11. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
    Staff Member

    Bayern München
    Germany
    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
    Club:
    FC Sankt Pauli
    Nat'l Team:
    Belgium
    I miss the high quality trolling of the Iraq War threads in the Karl K era
     
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  12. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    I hope Seaman takes it on the chin for his wacky beliefs
     
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  13. Boloni86

    Boloni86 Member+

    Jun 7, 2000
    Baltimore
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    Gibraltar
    Looks like Manafort is also being investigated by the US Treasury Department Financial Crimes Unit.

    https://www.apnews.com/d43ef4166da6...-US-probes-banking-of-ex-Trump-campaign-chief

    Nothing to see here folks ... Fake news ... This is all normal. Every president's campaign manager is up to his eyeballs in Russian mafia money.
     
  14. bballshawn

    bballshawn Member+

    Feb 5, 2014
    Delaware
    Club:
    Philadelphia Union
    OK. Than explain this conspiracy you are trying to say.
     
  15. cleansheetbsc

    cleansheetbsc Member+

    Mar 17, 2004
    Club:
    --other--
    Red Sea didn't part, and neither will she, for you.
     
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  16. cleansheetbsc

    cleansheetbsc Member+

    Mar 17, 2004
    Club:
    --other--
    Or, just today.
     
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  17. charlie15

    charlie15 Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    Bethesda, Md
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    One thing I will bet on...Our resident trumpster will never be among those losing faith in the deal leader.

     
  18. InTheSun

    InTheSun Member+

    Oct 20, 2005
    The Andes Mountains
    Club:
    Arsenal FC
    Nat'l Team:
    Ecuador
    My dad went to HS with a President.*













    * Not of the United States. :)
     
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  19. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    Problem is, in today's environment they would be immediately accused of legislating from the keyboard, much as the CBO is accused of being politicized and "auditing the Fed" is seen as a necessary transparency.

    The whole structure of our government is dependent on something being seen as disinterested and detached-- the judiciary, the church, the press, the military, something-- to use as a measure of the government's neutrality. And as the pace of progress and change have picked up, there has been less and less ability to keep something both outsidish of the debate and respected by all sides. Accusing the disinterested of partisanship because they don't reject one's opponent, be it abortion, Communists, Negroes, Mexicans, gays, whatever-- has become a routine tactic of whatever last-ditch opposition is currently going on.

    If you make the fourth estate part of the government, it will immediately come under attack from the outside as biased and will immediately face partisan efforts to infiltrate and take control of it. If you leave it in private hands there will be funding for partisan corruption of it.

    At this point I have some hope for the U S Navy and the Marines, but that's about it.
     
  20. Knave

    Knave Member+

    May 25, 1999
    As H. L. Mencken put it ...

    "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
     
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  21. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Man, what is it with goalkeepers and crackpot conspiracy theorizing.

    I wonder what ex-Coventry City and Hereford United netminder, and current Lizard-people theorist, David Icke thinks about this new guy...
     
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  22. nicephoras

    nicephoras A very stable genius

    Fucklechester Rangers
    Jul 22, 2001
    Eastern Seaboard of Yo! Semite
    Ahem - the Independent Centrist era.
     
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  23. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    I'm sorry...so sorry

    House Intelligence Chairman Devin Nunes apologized to members of his panel Thursday for not informing Rep. Adam Schiff, the ranking Democrat, before going public with allegations that Trump transition messages were inadvertently intercepted by U.S. intelligence agencies.

    A committee aide said that Nunes apologized "for not sharing information about the documents he saw with the minority before going public” and that “he pledged to work with them on this issue.”

    http://www.politico.com/story/2017/...-to-white-house-with-monitoring-claims-236415
     
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  24. bigredfutbol

    bigredfutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 5, 2000
    Woodbridge, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was the mod then.

    After he was banned (not by me), he actually sent me a strongly-worded email instructing me that I was not to allow any discussion of him or mention of his name by other posters. He was...something.
     
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  25. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    Karl Keller Karl Keller Karl Keller Karl Keller Karl Keller Karl Keller Karl Keller Karl Keller
     

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