Post-match: The Post Presidency :: Trump Faces The Music Thread

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by crazypete13, Jan 20, 2021.

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  1. Umar

    Umar Member+

    Sep 13, 2005
    One step ahead
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    #4801 Umar, Dec 7, 2022
    Can’t they recover most deleted messages through forensic analysis if they get the physical phone?

    Which is why in that Rooney Vardy case, Vardy’s agent “accidentally” “dropped” the phone at the bottom of the North Sea on getting the demand for her phone?

    Unless you use some Pegasus to monitor the phone, would be negligent to hold off on a phone grab only for the target to suspect an investigation and delete the messages and destroy the original phone.
     
  2. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    Bayern München
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    #4802 The Jitty Slitter, Dec 7, 2022
    Generally they can't be recovered, but that is all going to depend on access to backups and how specifically stuff was deleted.

    But in any event, an investigative technique is to get records direct from service providers, then get people to lie, then come around for the stuff. Often there is stuff that can't be deleted. e.g contacts between phones, email records of official organisations, contact logs etc

    This is of course why people backchannel on WA - this is very common in business now. You back channel the deal on WA, then switchback to email to confirm

    I listened to an interesting Denver Riggleman interview on this, as the j6 committee have a vast network map of digital comms. DOJ could in theory subpoena devices, but you need probable cause per person/device
     
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  3. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    #4803 The Jitty Slitter, Dec 7, 2022
    Incidentally, I am not trying to defend DOJ here - IMO the FBI/DOJ should have been rounding up coup plotters on the day of jan 6 and quickly thereafter seeing much of this happened in public
     
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  4. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Cascarino's Pizzeria Member+

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    #4804 Cascarino's Pizzeria, Dec 7, 2022
    I agree. Democracy was on fire and they said "let's first get the guys who stole busts from the Capitol" The longer it drags on the more people become less interested in nailing the plotters.
     
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  5. Funkfoot

    Funkfoot Member+

    May 18, 2002
    New Orleans, LA
    #4805 Funkfoot, Dec 7, 2022
    Actually not sure - so many trials to keep track of!
     
  6. JamesA

    JamesA Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    Victoria
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    #4806 JamesA, Dec 7, 2022
    According to a CNN source, Trumps own legal team had an independent third party search 4 of Trump's other properties for documents. They allude to the fact DOJ seem to think some documents are still missing?

    WTF is Trump playing at?
     
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  7. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Cascarino's Pizzeria Member+

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    #4807 Cascarino's Pizzeria, Dec 7, 2022
    Cheeto Benito'ing as he has been for around 6 years now.
     
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  8. rslfanboy

    rslfanboy Member+

    Jul 24, 2007
    Section 26
    #4808 rslfanboy, Dec 7, 2022
    Welp! More docs found in a Florida storage unit.
     
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  9. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
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    DC United
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    #4809 song219, Dec 7, 2022
    I think that Trump is trying to prove he is the real Florida Man.
     
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  10. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
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    #4810 dapip, Dec 7, 2022
    Top security shedded…

     
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  11. dapip

    dapip Member+

    Sep 5, 2003
    South Florida
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    #4811 dapip, Dec 7, 2022
    U-haul classified:

     
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  12. Cascarino's Pizzeria

    Cascarino's Pizzeria Member+

    Apr 29, 2001
    New Jersey, USA
    #4812 Cascarino's Pizzeria, Dec 7, 2022
    :p

    Fja9acQXgAAQ9yP.jpeg
     
  13. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    #4813 The Jitty Slitter, Dec 8, 2022
    I understood why they couldn't get search warrants for more locations (no PC) but surely now they can do wider raids?
     
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  14. dapip

    dapip Member+

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    #4814 dapip, Dec 8, 2022
    Bestie Vlad did not oblige...

     
  15. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
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    #4815 song219, Dec 8, 2022
    Trump didn't remember who Whelan was until someone reminded him in the last day or so.
     
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  16. JohnR

    JohnR Member+

    Jun 23, 2000
    Chicago, IL
    #4816 JohnR, Dec 8, 2022
    Not a surprise.Why would Trump make a phone call on behalf of some schmuck he never met, and who can't bring him business? I doubt his advisers ever even mentioned Whelan to him. They knew better than to try. Just tell the press secretary to talk about how Trump is working on getting Whelan home, and leave it at that.
     
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  17. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    #4817 diablodelsol, Dec 8, 2022
    What does this mean? In this country….you can’t raid without a warrant.
     
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  18. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    #4818 taosjohn, Dec 8, 2022
    More to the point, the reason this took so long is that our asking price included Whelan, and the Russians wouldn't pay it. They would NOT "let him out for the asking."

    And we are left to speculate on why they wanted the guy they got, since he doesn't seem to be one of theirs. I'm speculating that he may be in for a debriefing that might not be altogether comfortable.
     
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  19. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    #4819 The Jitty Slitter, Dec 8, 2022
    Preet explained they can't get a warrant for extra locations to search for stolen docs (e.g the bedminster golf club) without specific intel as to why they expect to find dox - it can't just be a general claim that trump did a crime in one place therefore he maybe did a crime at another place. But now it is being shown trump has crime docs at his other business, I wondered if that could amount to Probable Cause for additional raids, on the basis that he likely had stolen docs at other places he had offices - e.g Trump Tower
     
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  20. Smurfquake

    Smurfquake Moderator
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    Aug 8, 2000
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    #4820 Smurfquake, Dec 8, 2022
    Some people (like me) were saying that Trump having classified material at Mar-a-lago meant that the DOJ should get warrants to search Trump's other properties e.g. Trump Tower in New York and Bedminster in New Jersey, on the basis that he's a ********ing packrat who squirreled away stuff anywhere he could, so he probably had classified material in those properties as well. But other people (like Jitty) said there was insufficient probable cause for warrants to search for classified documents in those other properties. Now that it's been shown that he had classified materials in other locations, some other people (like Jitty) are now saying there may be enough probable cause to search his other properties for additional classified materials.
     
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  21. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
    La Norte
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    #4821 song219, Dec 8, 2022
    The speculation is loyalty. Bout is not part of Putin's inner circle but they still appreciate that he didn't talk.
     
  22. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    #4822 diablodelsol, Dec 8, 2022
    I guess I misread your post. So you’re saying there should now be probable cause to search his other sites? On that, I agree.

    What I’ve never understood is that possession of classified documents is traceable. There are records of what was provided to trump. There are records of what trump returned. Anything with no return record by default should be assumed to be in Trump’s possession somewhere. Why isn’t that sufficient probabl cause to search all properties owned by him. For ********’s sake…I believe there is paperwork that the GSA organized this shipment to this storage space….
     
  23. ElNaranja

    ElNaranja Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Jul 16, 2017
    #4823 ElNaranja, Dec 8, 2022
    If the suspect is non-white you can just make stuff up to get your warrant. Or maybe just shoot into the house and now you have a crime scene...search away!

    My frustrations with the AG are just....
     
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  24. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
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    #4824 Yoshou, Dec 8, 2022
    I believe this is actually part of the problem... Paperwork in the Trump administration was sketchy at best. Trump believed he was a King and, therefore, trivial things like signing out and signing in secret documents was beneath him. There were people in his administration that tried to follow the rules behind the scenes, but as we got further and further into Trump's administration the people that cared about the paperwork got smaller and smaller.
     
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  25. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
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    #4825 Yoshou, Dec 8, 2022
    Unfounded?

    The DoJ has requested that Trump's team be held in contempt for failing to adequately respond to the subpoena instructing them to hand over all of the documents (classified and otherwise) that Trump stole from the White House. It isn't 100% exactly who the DoJ wants to be held in contempt, but the media is saying Trump is one of them.

    https://www.cnn.com/2022/12/08/politics/doj-trump-contempt-classified-documents/index.html

    Now, admittedly, the most common punishment for failure to comply contempt charges is daily fines, so we aren't going to see Trump in handcuffs, or an orange jumper, but it stacks up and is a good way to piss off a judge.
     
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