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Discussion in 'Germany' started by Schwalker, Jun 1, 2008.
Like Salzburg, Leipzig and New York.........
But looking at their chosen logo, I'd say they should be the "Cardinals".
Good to see Jahn Regensburg stick with the classic, classy logo they have. No reason to mess up a good thing.
I am a fan of BvB's as well. And not just because of Keith, either...
I don't think any big (and this includes 3rd and most 4th division) clubs would do anything like this anytime soon. But this is a club without a big fanbase which is trying to get into semi-pro football. It seems as if they are "rebranding"... although I doubt it will do them much good, so it probably won't start a trend...
Hey, I said pseudo-American . I think most of those names are randomly picked out of dictionaries (or the TV guide... I mean, Grizzly Adams? They have been around for years, but I still ask myself "why" everytime I look at a hockey table).
The new logo would have been cool (IMHO) with the tradional name:
But as already said, I don't have a problem with the name "the reds", the club colour is red, so it's related to them. Maybe a bit modern, because it's in English, but that's not the main point for me.
Some wiki research:
The club OSC "Olympischer Sport Club (Olympic sports club)" was founded in 1972, but merged from ATS (founded 1859), PSV (Police sports club), Judo Club and TuS Bremerhaven (founded 1893) and this was the old logo:
I have to admit, I prefer the new logo, but would have used my OSC version.
THey could have used that version and used 'the reds' beneath... sort of in the way 96 tried to change their logo (thank god that didn't work, but for Bremerhaven that could actually look good):
Currently in danger of insolvency: Eintracht Bamberg and TeBe Berlin.
SSV Reutlingen have gone into insolvency and will be relegated automatically.
Eintracht Bamberg has gone into insolvency - therefore relegation in RL Süd is already decided: Bamberg and Reutlingen go down automatically, Bayern Alzenau is already relegated.
Promotion is already decided as well: North: Babelsberg 03, West: Saarbrücken, South: VfR Aalen
To bring everyone up to date on reform stuff as well: Zwanziger himself has admitted that thze new Regionalliga was a bad idea, and it has been implied that there will be a reform for the 2012 season already (this will be voted on by the DFB later this year).
Various newspapers have reported that the Regionalliga will go to 6 or 7 groups by then, but nothing official yet.
Interesting idea. But what's exactly the rationale behind that? In what way would it help?
- lower costs (travel, but also salaries - being competitive will cost less the more groups there are)
- more derbies, less reserve sides
- the requirements will likely be lower (we'de basically be back to the old Oberliga, although with 6 instead of 9 groups, but still much closer than the current 3 groups model)
- you don't lose anything - in the Regionalliga, TV money is basically a non-factor.
Currently the pyramid is utterly broken - you can count the number of clubs currently below the Regionalliga who could afford playing there on maybe two hands (and with two insolvencies again this season, obviously not everyone in there can afford it either).
This season one of the promotion spots to the Regionalliga is entirely uncontested so far - it will probably have to go to another league (no team has applied for the second Northern German promotion spot).
Sounds very reasonable. So why didn't they do that from the beginning? Looks as if the DFB had totally overestimated the financial situation of the RL clubs.
The idea was stupid from the beginning (and I'm not one to get out the told you [general you] so card, but... well, I did in this very thread two years ago ). As for why... if you are a conspiracy theorist you could say it was deliberate (to basically turn pro football into a closed shop - which isn't as crazy as it sounds, if we stay with the current model for longer this would basically happen, as no club, not even Magdeburg or Essen, could survive staying full time without a promotion for long in the current RL).
I think they just don't have a clue, though, or don't care (the DFB would be even less capable of a conspiracy than any government ).
Edit: damn, this is REALLY almost word for word what I wrote in this thread in 2008. Scary .
Wouldn't that widfen the gap between the 3rd League and the new RL, though?
Basically it all comes down to the fact that the succes professional football has had in Germany the last 6+ years was at the expense of the clubs that play beneath those levels.
As it is right now the fourth level isn't working - and the top clubs in the fourth level won't see that much of a decrease in revenue (it's not as if people in Magdeburg come to see Wolfsburg II, or Lübeck, or Wilhelmshaven - and as it is right now there's not much TV money, and only local sponsors anyway). It's either a reform with a bigger semi-pro RL, or abolishing promotion/relegation between the 3rd and 4th division. I don't see any other possible way here (you won't be able to go back to a two tiered 3rd division now - despite it's flaws, it's better for all the clubs currently in there, and for all clubs in the 2. BL, compared to the old RL).
TeBe Berlin has gone into insolvency - relegated automatically, you know the deal by now.
Türkiyemspor might as well, although it's not sure yet.
Hansa Rostock II will be relegated voluntarily if Hansa I is relegated to 3. Liga (which they will, unless Bielefeld goes into insolvency and keeps them in 2. BL), as they can't finance the reserve side anymore then.
It is a shame to see these smaller clubs falling by the way side. Is it merely a lack of revenue being generated?
I know, speaking of my club Jahn, they had their fair share of issues a few years back and still do to some degree. How some survive and others do not is interesting. Still, it is a shame.
Well, either not enough revenue, or costs being too high (of course the management also plays a role - but currently it's become extremely difficult for smaller clubs even with responsible management).
And there are many factors - some clubs are basically kept alife with tax payer money, other by individual sponsors. The bigger the club, the less likely a financial crisis will end in insolvency (Eastern clubs are sometimes somewhat of an exception, there are more factors at play).
Eintracht Braunschweig should have gone into insolvency around 3 times during my lifetime, but every time the city saved the club.
I wish my German were better so I could understand more of the jist of what was on Jahn's site. I am sure there are many back stories that I am missing as a result of my "iffy" German.
Ok, here we go. So far that's what it looks like with pro/rel into and out of the RL. Because of a handfull of clubs still struggling for the license (Bielefeld, Jena, etc.) there might be some further changes.
Insolvency: TeBe Berlin, SSV Reutlingen, Eintr. Bamberg
Relegated: Oberneuland, St. Pauli II, Goslar, Gladbach II, Worms, Trier, Bayern Alzenau
Promoted from OL:
Bayern: FC Memmingen
BW: Hoffenheim II
Hessen: FSV Frankfurt II
Niedersachsen-O.*: Eintr. Braunschweig II
Niedersachsen-W.*: TSV Havelse
NOFV-N.: Energie Cottbus II
NRW (2 teams): Wiedenbrück 2000, Arm. Bielefeld II
Südwest: FC Homburg
*if Kiel is relegated from the 3. Liga both Lower Saxony clubs are promoted (instead of only the winner of the Lower Saxon championship final to be played next month), if Kiel is saved because of another club going down for financial reasons Kiel II will be promoted instead of the loser of the Lower Saxon final.
Non-promoted OL champions:
Hamburg: Victoria Hamburg
Bremen: Werder Bremen III
Schleswig-Holstein: Holstein Kiel II
Huge problems for RW Essen too:
I expect the DFB to allow them to use the guarantee they had to get for the 2010 license. That it's unlikely that they will generate more revenue on their own in the RL makes it more bleak, as they will get bigger problems every year. Maybe starting anew would be better for the club by now.
Well, the DFB actaully surprised me on this one. So it seems RWE is history.
That's is sad. Have a soft spot for RWE.