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  1. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Not really. Wasn't wearing Italian blue either. It seemed to be a very quickly drawn conclusion.

    Since we're in France, he could as well have been a local.
     
  2. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    I can't blame for the Swedes, they got 33 times less the population than th US to pick players from, & bunkering as proven to be an effective way for the HAVE NOT'S to compete with the HAVES. Russia beat Spain at last year's men's WC by bunkering, playing 2 five player(with no fwds upfront), straight lines which completely shutdown th passing lanes of Spain.

    However when Sweden bunkered vs the US last week, I noticed they pulled their backline very tight(defending more the perimeters of the pk area, thus giving Rapinoe or Heath all the space to work with on both sides. They did it again vs Germany, but here the Germans vest all their energy into attacking right up the center, thus it worked well for them.

    But it does give the Dutch an excellent opportunity to use both van de Sanden & Materns and attack, coming from the sides(instead of Leke veering off to the right/middle

    on defense, the Swedes, Sofia Jakobsson is one of the most underestimated players ever. Don't think the jackals at FIFA ever voted her on a top ten list for poy, but she's got to be the fastest player in the world, and her ability to bring the from A to B in the quickest amount of time is worthy of another team's dozen passes. That's why the Dutch deefnse can't take it's time & try to pass the ball in the back among themselves(though it's a good way to pace the team ala Jll Ellis is doing so well with her squad), with her speed, Sofia can easliy latch on to an errand back pass & of course, the rest be history.

    So it will be can, the Dutch getting no rest again while expanding all their energies on the attack, can it last for another two games?
     
  3. Going by what Miedema said aboutthe Italian game, the Orange Lionesses arenot going full throttle on the attack, but try to wear down the Swede batteries. If indeed the Swedes are going to concentrate in the centre of the box it creates great opportunities for Lieke and Shanice/Linette to go to the flanks without breaking sweat and sweep in high balls to our headers. After a while either the Swedes stick to that game plan or come to the conclusion they must cover the flanks as well. In the latter case it inevitably means the centre is weakened for penetration by Miedema and the midfield.
     
  4. L'orange

    L'orange Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jul 20, 2017
    It's a good plan but who besides Miedema is capable of nodding a cross in from run of play--and she will be well-marked by tall Swedish defenders? There essentially is nobody else but Van de Donk, who is not very tall, of course. We have a better chance on free kicks in the area of the box, as we saw against Italy, but the Swedes will be tougher to beat with headers than the Italians. As is often the case, the first goal will be huge: If we can get it, the Swedes will have to start coming forward more and the Dutch can play some counters. Let us not even contemplate the other side of the coin. The Dutch can win this match.
     
  5. BarryfromEastenders

    Staff Member

    Jul 6, 2008
  6. law10

    law10 Member+

    Dec 26, 2007
    Lisa De Vanna is actually inhuman in that department.
     
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  7. :DGonna use that in the Dutch forum:thumbsup:
     
  8. Ethan Frank

    Ethan Frank Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Jun 11, 2019
    Van de Sanden. Got one in the run of play against Norway at the Euros, and got one in the run of play against Denmark in the first leg of the WWC qualifying playoff. Van de Donk's much better in the air than I thought she would be, but I can only think of her fourth against Chile when it comes to header goals.

    Edit: Looking back at the original post, I should clarify that van de Sanden, Martens, and Beerensteyn don't have to always be the ones to provide service. Beerensteyn is also pretty good in the air.
     
  9. L'orange

    L'orange Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jul 20, 2017
    Good point. Beerensteyn scored an important first goal against Switzerland off a very nice header in the WC qualifying playoff match.

    I just saw that Van Es has been signed by Everton. That is a good club for her, I think, and she should be able to help that team.

    Speaking of Van Es, what's the feeling among fans of Oranje about Van Dongen taking her spot at left bank in this WC since the Cameroon game? Apparently, Van Es was not very good in that match, and that was why the switch has been made. I confess I don't remember much about her play in that game.

    Is it fair to say that left back is the weakest spot on the team right now? I think so. Van Dongen is doing well enough defensively, I suppose, except for the last 20 minutes of the Japan game when she was really struggling (along with just about everybody else). Her instincts seem pretty solid, but she offers even less than Van Es going forward, and Van Es doesn't offer a lot (though she can deliver a nice ball into the box). She hasn't been a noticeable liability--but she doesn't have the qualities you'd like when trying to win a World Cup. She plays for Real Betis, which finished 6th in the La Liga Femenina this past season, which is not bad. I would think that playing in the Spanish League has been a good thing for her. I have a lot of respect for her and Van Es, who has been a solid starter for the NT for a long time (61 caps), but this is one position where IMO the Dutch need to find a couple of good, athletic young players to try and develop over the next two years.

    The same is true at centerback, especially given that Van der Gragt has had injury issues and Dekker is 32. It should be noted that Van der Gragt has been playing well, and the Dutch are fortunate that she recovered from her year of injuries just in time to play in this tournament. Kerkdijk is the other reserve centerback on the squad. She is 23 and plays for Bristol City in the FA WSL. I have not seen her play at all except for a stretch against Poland in the Algarve Cup--I believe that was the match--and I don't think she was very good that day. My first impression was that she isn't fast or athletic enough to be a good NT centerback--but my assessment is based only at that one look and I could be wrong. I hope I am!

    I'll be curious to see where Van Lunteren plays next year. She is, at the moment, without a team. She is another player that could be an asset to any number of teams in the English league, including Manchester United, where she could join forces with Groenen. She deserves to be a bit selective, I think.
     
  10. Ethan Frank

    Ethan Frank Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Jun 11, 2019
    I thought van Es was pretty poor that game in possession. I was completely fine with van Dongen starting against Canada, and after a great game there, I thought she deserved the start against Japan. However, after a shaky first half against Italy, Wiegman may indeed have a decision to make there along with the van de Sanden or Beerensteyn decision.

    That's probably fair. I thought Worm might have gotten into the World Cup squad, and she seemed more attack minded from what I saw. For some reason, I feel like van Dongen plays more often as a center back, which could explain her tendency to stay back. I could likely be wrong there though.

    Or maybe she'll join Arsenal to keep up the Dutch numbers there.
     
  11. Ethan Frank

    Ethan Frank Member

    Chelsea
    United States
    Jun 11, 2019
    Interesting that Wiegman brought three players to the press conference, and the questions to the players and coach were asked separately like they do in the post match press conferences.
     
  12. L'orange

    L'orange Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jul 20, 2017
    I wonder how many of the current Dutch NT starters we might see starting again in the next World Cup, in four years? One of the things that this group has got going for it is that most of the core players are in their prime--in the 25-27 year-old range, which is ideal. Spitse just turned 29 and is the oldest starter, I think. Groenen and Bloodworth are 24. Miedema, not yet 23; Beerensteyn and Roord, both 22. That bodes well for the future.

    There is no reason outside of injury that group (Groenen, Bloodworth, Beerensteyn, Roord and Miedema) shouldn't be fit and as good or, hopefully, better than they are now. However, the group now the 26-27 range--Martens, Van de Donk, Van de Sanden, Van Lunteren, Van Es, Van der Gragt--will be 30/31 in four years and arguably past their prime. Some may still be fit and still playing and maybe even playing well; others by then may have retired or lost their positions. Of course much depends on what sort of young talent comes up through the Dutch youth teams in the next two-three years. It will be interesting to follow.
     
  13. blissett

    blissett Member+

    Aug 20, 2011
    Italy
    Club:
    --other--
    Nat'l Team:
    --other--
    Apart from Pelova, who's already in this WWC roster, I had seen some interesting youngsters in the Netherlands' team at U-20 WWC 2018.
     
  14. One major difference with the young girls playing soccer now in contrast with this group and the U17-U19, is that most of them now play in all girls teams instead of mixed boys/girls teams.
    Wonder what the effect is of that as the current crop for sure didnot have it easy playing alongside boys and I'm sure that has had it's effect on them on toughness/technicality.
     
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  15. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    recently both the u17 &u20 teams have had really good success, wasn't it few months ago that the u17 went all the way to PK's before succumbing to Germany in the finals of the Euro u17's. So the upcoming talnet is there.

    another interesting thing was the Dutch went also 'against the grain' that their home 1st div. league is quite weak compared to others(but then the 3 out of top 4 leagues of Europe's NT's have failed to impress(France, Germany, Spain, minus England)

    I do believe there are main 3 reasons for the current success(giving that their the Euros champs
    1)Wiegmanns coaching, giving that she thinks outside the box, thus playing a variety type styles/or especially the constant long balling, though we saw a lot of the opponents lately bunkering to stop it.(mentioning this as comapred to the central Euro preference for more possession/ball control type game)
    2) being able to produce 3 superstar quality fwds in Miedema, van de Sanden & Martens(the only other team that's got 3 superstars upfront is the 22 times more populated, USA
    3) the Dutch school of soccer thinking! I don't know exactly what age this takes place, but the Dutch have their fair share of great inovators of the game(obviously as the inventors of the 'total football concept') but now has finally took hold in the womens side as well & put them on the forefront along with the US & Scandavia(thought their were allready there way back in 1991 )

    one question, got to be asked(from the Dutch soccer experts, please no trolls!) but I noticed that while technical knowledge is helpful, the Dutch players just seem to more so much more athletic than their central Euro counterparts. So do the Dutch push athleticism over technique? Or a combination of the two? Asking this cuz I've had debate with the so called puritans who insist tha woso should be first & formost about technique, and you can that kinda of argument take place in next door, Germany, who stubornly refuse to use more athletic type player
     
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  16. :mad:
    The Lyon authorities have banned the Orange march, due to safety concerns (attack on the crowd by terrorists) and the long distance (20 km) to be covered.

    Given the midweek day, the 9 hours drive from the Netherlands, the flights and fast trains already full to capacity, the number of fans expected is around 3000, way below the 15000-20000 in Valenciennes.
     
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  17. Lieke skips group training:
    [​IMG]
    Lieke Martens. © ANP
    Martens slaat groepstraining van Leeuwinnen over
     
  18. Bauser

    Bauser Member+

    Dec 23, 2000
    Norway
    Club:
    Fredrikstad FK
    Netherlands won the U19 Euros in 2014. Miedema, Bloodworth, Roord, Kaagman and Kerkdijk are in the current World Cup squad from that team. Harvesting at senior level now.
     
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  19. L'orange

    L'orange Member+

    Ajax
    Netherlands
    Jul 20, 2017
    Very good point. You have to think that playing with boys helped those players--and Miedema was one of them. I vaguely recall reading that the Dutch women's youth teams do some training with the boys teams--or maybe it was at Ajax. In any case, I think it would be very beneficial for the girls/women at club and youth NT level to at least to have some sessions with their male counterparts.
     
  20. I think it's more the result of what I mentioned earlier these players came from a period that the low number of girls playing ment they had to be part of boys teams.
    Plus Dutch girls and women are bigger than other nations women.
    We Dutch donot push athleticism at all.

    Actually it's a mindset. Dutch kids grow up with the strong believe we're the best and our way is the only way. That's engrained in their minds rising through all ranks in the Dutch system.
    That's why I never want to see an Orange shirt being worn by players that left at very young age to epl clubs. If as a player you havenot got at least 2 years Eredivisie under your belt, you're poisoned with inferior ways of thinking. They simply donot represent our Dutch soccer heritage.
    So it's a continuing proces in their soccer career.
     
  21. law10

    law10 Member+

    Dec 26, 2007
    Interesting because other than a piece of Miedema magic that Spain U19 final was a close game, and Spain did not start a single player from that game in their round of 16. And the Spanish had some wonderfully talented players and took out an unbeaten Norway at home in Jessheim the semis.

    Seger, Fischer, Sembrandt, Asllani, Jakobsson, and Lindahl. That's almost 1000 caps and why they're where they are in this tournament and what the Netherlands will have to deal with to go through.
     
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  22. hotjam2

    hotjam2 Member+

    Nov 23, 2012
    Club:
    Real Madrid
    my take on the US semis win; Jill Ellis did bring her backline high enough where given the chance, van de Sanden would be able to get behind the Americans via direct long balls, with all the space provided(by a high backline) Similarly, the Dutch slaughtered the higher ranked Australians that way in a friendly, a week before the WC. Wish that particular frinedly didn't happen as most of the WC opponents might of scouted that game & hence bunkered to stop from van de Sanden fom getting the spaceshe needed to due her deadly deeds.
    So Ellis likewide would probably not play so high vs Holland, most of the game that is(and actually bunkered at paets vs Sweden to nullify the speed of Sofia Jakobsson. She will however, hit you, full throttle, with an extreme/high press for the 1st 15 minutes for each half. Thus she does have to pull up her defense/exposing the space in the back. so if the Dutch want to take advantage, it will be for those 1st 15 mins or so. Problem is. can the Dutch defense handle the merciless pressure applied to them by the press?

    guess we'll only find out if the Dutch get passed Sweden
     
  23. The Orange Lionesses named their campaign for the WC "Our hunt" (Onze Jacht)
    Like a pride of lionesses going after a prey:
     
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