The website for the supposed United States Association Football Leagues, which had a countdown clock pointing towards Labor Day as its big reveal now shows this: They haven't posted on Facebook since July 22. They haven't tweeted since July 13 (three days after tweeting that they were born). I don't know if it's vaporware or if there have just been (the almost inevitable) delays. But the league that was going to deliver on the promise of bringing promotion and relegation to the United States of America* has yet to do so. The countdown was a nice touch, but if you get all zeros and nothing happens.... *Their phrase, not mine. The USA shrugged, largely.
GMT isn't off by days, it's off by hours. I think they got all hot and bothered about the concept, then saw it was unworkable. Or lost interest. Or didn't want to work as hard as it would take to start a whole league (or two).
It's kinda hard to have a league without any teams. And it's hard to have a pro/rel league without two divisions' worth of teams.
You, sir, have hit on the intrinsic problem. The NPSL could institute pro/rel, but it would be just splitting their existing teams into two arbitrary divisions and making half of them chase promotion to a level they are currently playing at today. And it would be doing it merely for appearances, just like this supposed league that was going to arbitrarily split whatever vaporware teams it may or may not have been able to cobble together into two or more divisions just to satisfy this coterie of Europosers.
Perhaps they got tired of waiting on all the Investors that Teddy and Co. assured them are out there. Because as we all know, the money men are all just waiting on Pro/Rel to get in the game.
https://twitter.com/ProRelvolution Their twitter is not any better. I guess the "Revolution" is on hold El ascenso y descenso oficialmente se ha llegaba a el EUA. Bienvenido a las ligas de futbol asociacion del EUA: http://t.co/FFKyRmO7Wl— UnitedStatesAFL (@UnitedStatesAFL) July 14, 2013
you can't have effective pro/rel unless it involves the D1 league so whether this USAFL league is a hoax or not its irrelevant when talking seriously about pro/rel.
One would certainly think so, yes. ( a ) The problem (here at least) is that almost no one "seriously" talks about pro/rel for a variety of reasons ( b ) I am not yet ready to call it a hoax so much as someone who may have gotten into something without considering how hard it would be ( c ) If ( b ) is true, it lends more credence to those of us who tend to believe this would be a Quixotic (at best) attempt and that you can't simply artificially create such a system where none exists If the NPSL splits its teams into two divisions (as has been rumored) and puts pro/rel between them, that will be a mildly interesting incubator, but (as you rightly point out), largely a pointless exercise without involving a top-flight league and only for appearances' sake. You'd have half the teams chasing promotion to a level at which they played the season prior and half trying to avoid being dropped to a level even crappier than the one they played at the year before, against teams that occasionally show up for games. Oh, and ( d ) if you think something is irrelevant, how about staying out of it, Anonymous Newbie?
well I see what you're trying to do. You're pointing to this dodgy league with their delusions of grandeur and then saying "see everyone? pro/rel doesn't work here! No one cares about this"
I don't think Kenn is saying that this demonstrates that pro/rel doesn't work here (even though he believes, and I do also, that it doesn't). I think he's saying that it demonstrates that using a format (which in this case is pro/rel) as the reason for a league's existence doesn't work.
I am also saying that people who think they can create leagues with pro/rel as a selling point and have that selling point make all the other challenges of starting a league just disappear are as stupid as those who believe if such a system were to be implemented tomorrow in existing leagues, that a multitude of amazing things would happen right away that would solve all of our problems. This particular set of proles (whoever he is or they are) seems to be acting like an underpants gnome: 1. Start soccer leagues with promotion and relegation. 2. .... 3. Profit.
You obviously DON'T see it. What I did there was ridicule the latest batch of proles who think this is easy to do.
okay, fair enough. While I like pro/rel and think it would work here (once the conditions were right), I don't think it is a magic pill that will fix everything. It's just a structure that in the long run that would include more of the country.
It really only fixes one thing - organising a large number of clubs when there are too many for a single division. That's all it was ever intended to do. Funnily enough, with the USA's spread of large markets, it could theoretically work better in the USA than is most countries, but for that to happen you'd need viable clubs to organically grow to create that scenario of "too many clubs". There's no chance of that happening any day soon, and any day in the foreseeable future doesn't look promising either. Really, NASL etc should concentrate on growing their league and clubs first. If they grow then pro/rel could, in theory at least, start to be become a credible option. Until then, they are just knocking on the door and begging to be allowed to come in and play, without offering to bring a single thing to the table. I mean, even if you took away all those sizable obstacles such as franchise fees, single entity, owner investment, financial risk etc etc, what would MLS have to gain by admitting any NASL clubs, let alone losing some of their own in return?
admitting 2013's NASL clubs? Nothing. Admitting 2023's NASL clubs if they were playing in MLS sized stadiums with great crowds? A whole lot: -more quality during the regular season with teams fighting like heck not to be relegated. - new teams coming into the league that add something new and interesting. - bad teams getting punished for being really bad. - more fans throughout the country that now have a reason to follow the top tier because their club have a chance to one day play in it. - Instead of MLS only getting TV ratings in MLS markets they could market the league in all markets with a soccer club in the pyramid. - better regular season TV ratings. Relegation battles are fun to watch. - more investment in lower divisions which would be beneficial to the whole pyramid - traditional fans who enjoy the league system will be far less likely to ignore the league.
well conditions would have to be right. You can't just have pro/rel when NASL clubs are playing at the local high school and getting 4k to show up.
there are words there, but I'm in in Nanjing, and rather drunk, so they could be antythinh. I love everybody, and you are all wondeful and my best mate ever, apart from the ones who want pro/rel. 1912 street rocks,
It's only fair, given that the tinfoil brigade (such as WhiteStar) directly linked to this league and brought it up about how the pro/rel ideal was finally getting off the ground. We didn't bring it into the discussion ... THEY DID So just saying "poof" and pretending something exists that doesn't ? Oh man, we can have a whole bunch of stuff in my house if this is how it goes. Despite the fact that the lower end of leagues are pretty lousy ... Which we don't have now ? Because we do ... and no, not all teams are interesting simply because they weren't in last year .... I'm pretty sure the overall "give a shit" because Hull is in the Prem is pretty much limited to Hull fans. RichardL has already kicked this dumb ass statement to the curb more than once. What ? Why can't they do this now (it is marketed nationally already) ? Pro/rel isn't going make people in Boise ID give a shit. The 2nd division right now has zero limitation ... where's the money ? Why ?