Post-match: Thank You Greg Berhalter

Discussion in 'USA Men: News & Analysis' started by FoxBoro 143, Dec 3, 2022.

  1. RossD

    RossD Member

    Aug 17, 2013
    Colorado Rapids
    Colombia didn't even make it.
    Just because you don't think Greg moved the needle doesn't mean it didn't move. How exactly do fans get to determine whether the "needle" was moved? First, what is the "needle" and second, why does what any of us think it "is" mean anything? How do we get to state this with any authority.
    Remember 4 years ago when everyone was saying missing out was setting us years back? I think that was an overreaction too.
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  2. bct81

    bct81 Member+

    multiple (DC United, Dortmund, Arsenal, Leeds....)
    United States
    Mar 17, 2007
    moving around the US every few years ....
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The two goals we scored in group play were NOT due to all the possession. While I like playing out of the back - when the goal ends up being possession w/o generating chances it may feel good but it actually does not create real chances.

    1. Wales goal was a counter from Pulisic feeding Weah.
    2. Iran goal was not wide play but Wes over the top to a running Dest who heads it right in front of the goal for Pulisic to fully commit his manhood.

    the point of the possession was to generate scoring chances - it did not even do that very much in concacaaf.

    The Dutch are one of the best teams in the world and yielded possession to us so they could counter - which they did ruthlessly.

    If you want to play like Spain then put Jedi and Dest glued to opposite sides and you had better be able to make the ball move as opposed to your legs - which tires you out.

    we were tired out versus the Dutch and it is a big reason we lost. The coach is supposed to strategize in advance to reduce this weakness.

    We have come a long way - we have a ways to go - better set pieces, better bang bang play - a real set of quality number 9s. But we also need a coach that tactical adjusts - Van Gaal said as much. They squeezed our flanks and forced us into the trees where they countered when we lost possession.

    No accepting where we are simply based on the current player quality is not good enough. Our players need to improve and our coaching (tactics) as well.
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  3. dlokteff

    dlokteff Member+

    Jan 22, 2002
    San Francisco, CA
    Your overall point is valid, but the Iran goal was absolutely a possession based goal.
  4. Fringshandball

    Fringshandball New Member

    United States
    Jul 20, 2021
    If not for the late goal in the first half, the second half would have been completely different. We struggle to score goals. Do you guys remember the landon donovan and Charlie davies goal vs brazil in the confederations cup? If we had that ability to score the US would be elite because we can also keep possession now. We had like 20 corner kicks and didn't score off of any of them....
  5. Mahtzo1

    Mahtzo1 Member+

    Jan 15, 2007
    So Cal

    Not exactly sure which tournaments you are referring to... Of course we missed 2018, but last 8 tournaments goes all the way back to 1990. If you eliminate 2018, 1990 and 1998 as the worst of the bunch I think it is still hard to make a case that 2022 was as bad as you make it sound.

    I'm a little older than 20. (x3+). While I remember making it to the round of 16 in the past, I also remember issues when we got there and how we got there 2002 was our best year in modern history and we were LUCKY to make the round of 16. If we hadn't gotten help, that year would have been erased from recent memory.

    We lost to Belgium in 2014 by absorbing what seemed like 1000 shots on goal to 0.05 of our own shots on goal. It certainly wasn't a good performance imo.

    2006...well, let's not talk about that one.

    2010...that was an interesting tournament. In contrast to this one, we made a habit of starting our games horribly and adjusting in the second half (if I remember correctly), our game against England was memorable for the way we scored the goal but we certainly didn't pressure England (arguably a weaker side than this version imo) the way we did in 2022.

    If anything, I think you could say 1994 was our best year if you are allowed to consider the relative levels of our talent vs our opposition. We beat Columbia and lost to Brazil in the rd of 16 that featured the infamous elbow by Leonardo. Of course we never really looked like we belonged on the same field as Brazil but we were at a different level than we are now so expectations were legitimately lower.

    Which tournament was more "enjoyable" for me? 2002 due to the excitement of upsetting one of the favorites that year in the first game and our results in the knockouts where we beat Mexico and gave Germany everything they could handle, but second would be this year. Perhaps 1994 would be 3rd, 2010 4th, 2014 would be 5th.

    If I rank them in order by "exceeding/not exceeding" expectations I would have to put 2002 in first but 1994 has to be up there as well (not because of the round of 16 performance). Between 2010, 2014, 2022, we are just arguing over who lost better and for me...if we are going to do that, I think the eye test trumps the stopwatch. I'll take the loss to the Nederlands over the loss to Belgium. the loss to Ghana was frustrating and also loses "points" for quality of opponent.

    Not sure if I covered each year but imo opinion, I believe that this team, and by extension, Berhalter, has nothing to be ashamed of.

    edit: my error on counting. When you said the last 8 included 2022 (duh! makes sense)
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    FTGOTC Member

    Feb 21, 2021
    I’ve had times in my lifetime when I felt we were scared of Mexico. Berhalter led us to a dominance over E Tri like I’d never seen.

    I recall when the USMNT had players who could hardly stand each other. Berhalter helped cultivate a culture in which guys seem to love competing together.

    We looked like one of the best defensive teams in the World Cup despite having a 35-year-old dude and an MLS player (I think he’s great, just acknowledging that he isn’t a Premier League guy) as our primary center backs, due in part to the elite midfield that he cultivated. .

    We went toe-to-toe with World Cup royalty, finishing with a higher xG, being somewhat unlucky, and ultimately looking like we belonged and even on another day could have easily won.

    We picked up the commitments of multiple talented dual nationals who should factor into our NT for years to come (Dest, Pepi), as well as one who could be a generational talent and who *no one* in the fandom had even heard of before him being announced as a camp attendee (Musah).

    And he did all of that despite a sometimes-toxic and often-irrational fanbase at his neck.

    Thank you, Gregg.
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  7. Eighteen Alpha

    Eighteen Alpha Member+

    Aug 17, 2016
    Stoke City FC
    Dear Gregg,

    Thank you. You were a good steward for our national team in a time of transition. You brought back a sense of brotherhood and camaraderie which had been sorely missed. You were instrumental in recruiting talented dual nationals. You are a sincerely nice guy.

    I have the deepest hope that you continue to enjoy success in your career with either an advancement in the US Soccer management ranks or by landing a good club team position. I, for one, will follow your career with interest and best wishes.

    Although it is time to turn the page, your service to our national team will be long remembered fondly.

    warmest regards,

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  8. fishmonger

    fishmonger Member

    Jul 2, 2014
    New York Red Bulls
    The metric is simple. Did we perform better than other WCs we were most recently in? The answer is no. Why complicate things? Do you think you would get the same benefit of the doubt in the working world? If you were hired to increase sales and didn't, you would be deemed a failure. I mention Colombia because someone here said I should talk to foreigners about their views on US soccer. That was very condescending, as I know those views very well. But explaining all this is tedious, there are more important things to turn my attention to. I'm glad Berhalter will soon be seeing the door. And he won't suffer the same fate most of us would when shown the door; he isn't facing the street or complete ruin. People should stop apologizing for him. Have they never worked in a " no excuses" environment? I I respect your opinion, this is only a soccer board, this stuff isn't really that important, so peace and enjoy the holiday season if you celebrate any of it, and if not, I wish you all the best anyway. Cheers.
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  9. deejay

    deejay Member+

    Feb 14, 2000
    Tarpon Springs, FL
    Jorge Wilstermann
    Nat'l Team:
    It's too bad you didn't learn about "cambio generacional" from the Colombians.
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  10. don Lamb

    don Lamb Member+

    United States
    Aug 31, 2017
    You want to measure the success of this World Cup by comparing it to "the most recent World Cups we were in." Why are you leaving out the most recent World Cup, which were notably NOT in.

    2018 is not something that should just be forgotten or ignored. We missed the World Cup, and the program had to start over from scratch with a bunch of teenagers coming into the squad whether they were ready or not.

    Despite that, we qualified for Qatar, and then proceeded to play the possession and protagonist style that we have never seen from the US before. We advanced on our merit and played a traditional power straight up. They beat us, but, in many ways, it was a type of performance that we have never seen from a US team in the World Cup against that type of team.
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  11. lmorin

    lmorin Member+

    Mar 29, 2000
    New Hampshire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Thank you, Gregg. I feel you did pretty well with what you had. It was not a well-rounded squad. It had no depth. It did not have an internationally proven striker. It had to play with a defender who was not even on the horizon during the previous 3 yrs and missed #2 and #3 defenders through injury. You and the team had to coalesce during the pandemic with constantly changing player availability. That coalescence had to be squashed into an all-too-brief (for most players) interval or too long an interval (for the rest) between club play and the WC camp in Qatar. And, you had to work with a group of players many of whom were still injured. All things considered, you did quite well.

    I do wish you had considered a strategy that did not include a striker. I would have liked to see Pulisic as an attacking midfielder with two wide players ahead of him.

    I don't know whether or not you should return as coach. It depends upon who else might be available, I suppose. If someone new is brought in, he should have well established international credentials; no chances should be taken with the appointment.
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  12. Excellency

    Excellency Member+

    LA Galaxy
    United States
    Nov 4, 2011
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Greg was always very presentable and wise when it came to talking with the media. Additionally, of more concrete value to our team, was Greg's good relationship with European managers for teams where our players played. I think they liked him a lot more than they liked Klinsmann who was too brusque and hard headed. Thank you, Gregg.
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  13. tomásbernal

    tomásbernal Member+

    Sep 4, 2007
    Portland Timbers
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Gregg, I greatly appreciate how you've managed this team throughout a difficult cycle. You clearly are a "player's coach", and that is shown both by how many dual-nationals you convinced to join the effort as well as how together this team has been. Your tactical preparations in the group stage were, honestly, shockingly good. It's been an admirable tenure. You've set this ship on a good course for the future and your efforts will not be forgotten. I hope you don't get caught up in the "what could have beens" and push for a second consecutive cycle--don't let things get stale. Go coach a club in Europe, improve in the areas you need to improve in (as you are wont to do) and continue to prove yourself. Perhaps in the future you'll get another chance to coach this team again.
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