Like many of you we have tryouts coming up in the next few weeks. At my sons current club for U12 there will be two teams. Team A, coached by his current coach and will be a merge of the best players from his existing team and a pre-ENCL team that is dropping out of the ENCL system and Team B which will be the remaining players from his existing team not chosen for the better team and another team of kids who didn't make the current team this year. The number of slots for kids on the existing team to move up into the better team is low, 2-4, and as you can guess, we were told we are on the bubble for getting selected. Now, I let my son know that he could be selected and to emphasize his need to play at the top of his game over the next few weeks (observers come out from the club) and at the tryouts. But, I'm not sure it's in his best interest to make that team. The coach is good and familiar, but my son is on the bench now and would be on the bench on the better team. On the lower team he'd be in the top 5 players and would be a starter. (I had the chance to see the U11 incarnation of the team play over the weekend). We won't know who the other coach is until the team selections and we will have a limited amount of time (24hrs ish) to agree or not after the tryouts and a slot on A or B is offered. (We are lucky to basically know we will get a slot on at least B, I expect some kids are going to get pushed out this year). A major determination for my son would be friends, but either way he'll have to choose so I see it as less of a factor (although that would come into play heavily to switch clubs). As a wrinkle, I also have him down to tryout at another club, that same week. For this community though, the generalized question is, is it better to be on the bench with the better players and see better competition but play fewer minutes OR be in the top of a lesser team and get the play time against weaker opponents. Possible that it can't be answered generally? Factors like what does he need to work on (soccer iq/confidence/aggression) and which coach will be better for him are individualized. Appreciate any thoughts regardless.
I have heard two different opinions on this. Some think that better players and better competition is the way to go even if they don't get much play time because most of the development comes in practice and they will be practicing with better players. However, our trainer (a former pro whose son is also a pro and on the youth USMNT) would say that they need to be on a team where they get a decent amount of play time or the kids start to question why they are practicing so much for so little actual play time and might lose interest. So, I think both opinions are valid and it might just come down to which option your child would prefer.
Imo, it depends on the kid's personality---not every player is cut out to be a valuable, high-energy asset off the bench. From my experience, the opportunity to train/play with the higher-level team is invaluable. If your son has a solid work ethic, possesses a generally positive mentality, is persistent, and has some patience, being a bench player---if decent minutes are available---on a talented team isn't a bad thing at all. Indeed, your son may become a more versatile player as he's working towards earning more minutes.
Have been taking this approach during the last couple of tryouts seasons with my rising U15 daughter. It gives her a chance to see what's going on outside of her current team/club bubble. Multiple tryouts can also be an empowering experience for the player, especially if he/she is able to have a say in the ultimate decision.
One thing to consider: Once you've opted for the higher-level team, it might be tough to drop back to a lower level of competition even if it means having a larger role. My own's a bench player (though generally getting decent minutes) on a team that plays tougher competition than he'd ever seen before joining a couple of years ago. But the idea of heading back to his old club and playing at a lower level so he could again be a FT starter (we don't live in a big city so his options are limited) is off the table -- for him the idea of playing against kids who just aren't as strong as what he's now accustomed doesn't sound like much fun. With tryouts ahead, there's no guarantee he he'll even make his current team again. Not sure what would happen then.
I would always error on the side of playing. I coached a B team that came about through the merger of two A minus teams and kids new to travel. 3 kids moved to the A team when the u13 roster expansion happened, and another at u14 when the A team striker decided baseball was his sport. By the time HS rolled around, kids who played a lot for me were getting more freshman/jv minutes than kids that were on the A team but only had the advantage of practicing against the good kids and playing 5-10 minutes a week. As. aclub admin as well as coach I could also see the external evaluators tryout feedback, and watched kids who might hae started at a 3 (out of 5) at the u12 tryouts drop to a 2 by the u15 tryouts, again correlated to being a low minute A teamer. A lot canhappen between 12 and 15 but I strongly believe they get better by playing. 3 sessions (practice + game) vs 2 sessions (practice, < 20 minutes game) adds up, even if it is only for a year until the roster expands at u13. Good luck...
It's always a tough call. You'd like to have your player training and playing against competition that is going to push them, but if they're not playing, it's hard to improve. I would say some of it depends on how the 'A' coach uses substitutes. Do they try to get the bench in for quality minutes or are they simply using subs for a couple minute breather for their starting 11. My son has been right on the cusp of cracking his club's A team, but he's gotten himself to the point where he is happy with the team they have assembled and has become one of the leaders on his squad, barely leaving the field unless they have the game well in hand. Being a center back, he also recognizes that it's not a position he would be able to get many minutes for the A team, as the back line is not normally an area where subs get any time typically. And we're ok with that as well, as it means we don't have to spend the time and money to travel to places like Orlando and Vegas in order for him to be a cheerleader.
I dont like the idea of being a tweener. I see players who year after year are just there to support. What is the point? The best environment is development focused and where the player is accepted and comfortable and gets plenty of playing time. Club and coach should be the service provider and player should be treated like the customer. If a player makes the team, he should be considered as valuable as any other player. Hopefully you find a coach that believes in this.
Yes, play time is key. I see plenty of kids on the A team who look good in practice. When they get in a game it is a different story. That is why they ride they bench for a lot of the time. In practice they get familiar with the other players, so even lower level kids will have the confidence to go against the better players, because they do it every day. When they go against unknown players and systems their confidence is lacking and their game play suffers. In game, nobody on the other team is your friend. To add to that, I tell my son to go as hard as you can at your teammates in practice. Not to make him look better, but to help the team get better. You want the hardest possible competition in practice, because when you play another team, it will be even tougher.
Exactly this, my kids been looking great in practice and then not translating that to his field time. My ideal situation I think would be to play on the B team and play up on the A team (mostly bench time) when schedules permit and travel is light. Barring that, my preference is the B team, but, ultimately the choice will be my son's - both in how well he plays up and through tryouts and then when evaluating whose going where. Appreciate the input from everyone, I'll update after tryouts.
my son was not good at sitting on the bench. it hurt his moral and his confidence. We decided it was best for him to not being on that team. Like someone else said, the choice is usually very specific to the individual. In theory a better team = better practice. But if you can't get into the game it's hard to tell if the practices are paying off. Tough decision. My son also played High School. As a freshman he practiced every day with the varsity, but played on the JV team. He would've rode the pines til the late minutes on varsity. Maybe consult with the coaches to see if he can do some cross training? Not sure if that's an option.
you need to with guns blazing. Insult the staff, the club admin, explain that little Suzy / Johnny is too good for their club and you are joining a super club with all-stars that will assure your player will not only go D1 full ride but assure them a multi-million pro contract. And be sure to wear your new club gear to the remainder of training sessions. OR Be gracious and thankful to your existing club and explain that you have decided to try a different club next year and if it doesn’t work out you may return at a later date. Play and practice hard for the remainder of the year and don’t bad mouth your current club and attempt to steal players on the way out. but between me and you go for the first method and stick it to them!
If you know the coach well enough, talk to him after a practice and let him know you've decided your son is going to go elsewhere and then probably also let the club owner/registrar/etc. know as well (so you don't get billed for the new year). Although I do like Option A from SoccerPop (at least in my own head ). I've seen too many kids, however, who have left a club only to come back with their tail between their legs. So, you know, burning bridges and all that.
Never burn bridges. You never know if you'll be back at the club or if a sibling may go to the club. Make sure you're properly released so your child can participate in games. My daughter had a girl on her team who's prior team wouldn't release her player pass because they were mad she left. So she could only participate in practices and not games for one whole season.
Good advice, but that's terrible behavior on the part of the aforementioned team. That release needed to happen, regardless of "hurt" feelings; maybe a phone call from a law office would've expedited the process. As for never burning bridges... My U14 daughter left our in-town club last year, and is likely leaving her current out-of-town, ECNL/RL-level club at the end of this month. Last year was acrimonious, to say the least---she was not happy at all. I was able to conduct the exit in a respectful manner [although she was able to get some nice, stinging jabs into the mix by making training videos, demonstrating significant skill advancements (one which depicted her performing 2,000+ continuous juggles, just prior to making her exit official), during the shutdown months], but I certainly did not hold back from delivering some truths as I saw them. My sense was that the girls DOC could handle a bit of criticism (he was indeed able to listen in a reasonable manner), as we weren't the only ones delivering such messages. Long story short, my U9 son is now playing for the less-than-satisfactory club, mentioned above, because he has a number of friends alongside him. To be clear, the boys side of the club is in significantly better shape than the girls. Where my daughter is concerned, the now-outgoing girls DOC has been about as apologetic as one could expect---he's not a bad guy (imo, he made some clumsy operational mistakes, misjudged some people, and didn't pay close enough attention to the details; that said, he also lacked resources and support). The new girls DOC, who arrived from another part of the state and who coached against my daughter's ECRL team this past season, now wants a chance to sell the new program to my daughter, which I've encouraged. Daughter's not coming back (her p.o.v. is that the club needs to demonstrate, over the course of a year or so, that it's changed), but at least the lines of communication are open. This year's exit isn't anything like last year's; rather, my daughter just wants to play for another out-of-town ECNL/RL-level club that places more emphasis on possession-based soccer (her current one is oriented towards direct soccer, raw athleticism, size, and speed).
Lots of ways around that sort of thing. Wait until January and they can leave in most cases, speak with the league - there are circumstances where they will step in. Look for a temp solution where the player can play in a different league. We dealt with a completely un-acceptable position and the league stepped in. Another family got their credit card company to step in and dealt with the financial side of leaving a club early. Know the club - know your player - understand the development process (different for boys and girls) and be honest with yourself before you make decisions. Realize that at certain ages - your player must be part of the process. recognize that it all starts with fun and that is something that you must maintain - which may mean you stay on until your player decides they want to go and not the parents - that happened with my youngest as well. I also recommend looking at the numbers in terms of players who go pro - get $$ for college and so on and then be honest again - as to where your player is. Sometimes a more family orientated environment is better then an all aggressive environment (again that's what I found with my youngest). Sometimes they even become better players outside of the big three because it's just more suitable for them. This is a tough road and we all want whats best and many of us are new to this - so don't get beat up over these decisions - create a matrix board and keep it as numeric as you can. Finally if you have a younger daughter... quit soccer and play hockey
just to respond to a couple of posts and try not to derail the original post, but the girl that came to my daughter's team was u13. To keep her player pass was a desperate move by a small club to keep a big fish. Didn't work and actually backfired. Just shows the pettiness of some clubs. The girl wanted an immediate transfer so waiting wasn't really an option. It's the past now and she's still with us and happy she made the move. My son left our current club for a different club. His playing time had decreased and while he would've made the team he's one of those players that came off the bench. We sat with the coach and DOC and decided for everyone it would be best to move to a different club. One year later and my daughter is still with his ex-club and my son has contemplated coming back. He's grown physically and as a player and would challenge for a starting position. Based on how we left I'm sure he'd be welcomed back. He most likely won't go back because that would mean giving up High School soccer, and he loves the social aspect of that.
Coming all the way back around on this - ultimately a good chunk of the kids my son was competing with went off to a multiple club location pre-ENCL team, so he got the spot for the local "A" team with his friends that we wanted. Less of a struggle than I expected in the end after so much hand wringing. No choice really needs to be made, although I'm pushing for his to attend a least a second club's tryout before accepting just to get the experience in case next year we want to do ENCL or switch clubs. Thanks to everyone for your input and best of luck on your own kids tryouts this year.
More parents should do this. I did. The kids should know what it's like to do tryouts at the different ages so they are more comfortable if/when they have to switch clubs. Some kids aren't good with the pressure or situation and it'll show at a tryout. IMHO, the more they go to tryouts (even if there really isn't an urge or need to switch clubs) the better they will be in the long run.
Completely agree. I see this all the time at the U12-U14 levels---a substantial subsection of parents simply haven't prepped their players to handle the psychological issues associated with pressure situations such as tryouts. Regular exposure to different types of environments (camps, tryouts, etc.), players (the more varied the personalities/backgrounds, the better), and coaches (ditto) is highly recommended. I'm fortunate to be friends with a coach/scout who sold me on this idea a couple of years ago. Beyond the game, you are helping your child to develop an anti-fragile mentality towards life.
It's odd at U16 and up. Here is what I am seeing... 1. Crazy parent - un-realistic about their player trying to stuff them in (usually at the Eclipse) where they think they have a shot at the top team. 2. Crazy parent - realistic about their kids but with few spots open on the "best of the rest" club teams, they are just in full panic mode. 3. Insane keeper parents! Now I say #2 and #3 are not un-realistic - just drivien crazy by the process at this age and the lack of open spots. This is very true for keepers looking to make a move - which typically ends up being lateral. 4. Clueless parents - no idea what is going on and will listen to what ever garbage DOC's are dealing. Now for a question for you all... I find that myself and some of our close friends on our team fall into a category where we know what's out there - know where are kids are in terms of talent and just want to keep our kids (and ourselves) happy. I consider us to be enormously lucky in that we have a family that we travel with and spend a good deal of time with during MRL weekends - good food, cocktails, card and board games and great banter. I have to admit - that is really what has kept me grounded as a parent. Anyone else find themselves in this position? I know to some it may come off that we've thrown in the towel but I honestly thing we just have accepted some realities of youth sports and want to have fun.
I am hoping to find that position in our next club. We currently like the parent situation, but the future soccer situation is pushing us away. U12 team made up of mostly 11s, and a 10. But this past wknd at a State Cup series, inconsistent attendance by some. The oldest group only had 8 show up. Hoping the next spot will have more dedicated players, so age movement is based on skill not need.
My son was in the DA and after speaking with the coach/owner/DOC we determined a move was best for him. He wasn't seeing the playing time and we took a realistic look at it and knew he was the type of player that would only be happy if he was playing. We also knew where he was talent wise and realized he was slightly behind due to puberty, size, etc. The move hurt. He missed his friends but he adapted and likes his new team. He was tempted this year to go back to his old club but then sat down with me and he decided that he ultimately liked things at his new club and is staying. He's not going pro. He's not getting a college scholarship. Will it help him get into a particular college? Maybe. I haven't been able to connect with the parent's on his team yet. Just one guy who's like me that stays to the side and doesn't join the group of parents that scream their heads off. I can't stand that. This guy enjoys the game. My daughter is very good for her age. She's playing up one year on a good club and is a starter on that team. I sat with her as well and asked her if she wanted to tryout for a more competitive team. She said "no". She's young enough that she isn't sure if she's going to want to play after High School and really enjoys being with her friends. So we stay where we are because she's happy. I've connected with several parents on her team and I think we have a realistic view of our kids' situations. It makes for great conversations at games and social events. My daughter went to NC for a showcase. I had to work so she went with her teammate and her mother. She's like another daughter for them. They were happy to take her and if it weren't for those relationships she probably wouldn't have been able to go. I think having a realistic view takes so much pressure off the everyone in the family. I played since I was 5. Played D2. And then played in men's leagues and some coed up until I started getting injured too many times in non-contact form. So I called it quits. I want soccer to be to my kids what it was to me. I want them to appreciate the sport and everything that goes with it. I really do. It's been a huge part of my family's life. I'll never forget watching my father at my kids' games and seeing the joy in his face to see them out there having fun and competing. Sorry, back to the point. Lol. What you're doing is what more parents should be doing. Enjoy the ride because it will end some day. And if you can get some beers in, all the better!
Excellent post! All our parents are pretty quiet but we have fun jamming our kids from the sideline - it's all in fun and they will laugh at us - they love the sport but also have now realized that it's okay to have fun as well. I swear MRL weekends are like family vacations for us all. We as well do not expect pros or $$$ for college - but a walk on for D2 and D3 for sure but we are making sure they focus on academics first. As a kid I had tremendous talent but was more interested in friends - this pissed my old man off because he was extremely competitive. My sister was more like him and less social - more focused on grades and sports. I've tried to find a middle ground for my kids - have fun but don't have regrets (which I most certainly do when it comes to the sports I played). So far so good - loving club and loving high school and most importantly - great memories!