Tactics, Tactics, Tactics.

Digital Tactics

Excellent post DCU. I agree with most of what you say (no wonder I think it's an excellent post ).

But, we have no one like Razov. Despite his size, Santino is no target forward nor is he a good holding forward. Actually, he's the withdrawn forward. Unfortunately, so is Stewart. But I agree that those two are probably essential starters. I agree with you about Etch's ability to hold the ball, and trying him as a target forward to distribute to the wild dogs coming out of our midfield (Convey, Stewart, Dema, and Olsen) would work quite well. But, somewhere we need a true striker. Hopefully this Cureton fellow will be it, but from everything I've read, he's yet another withdrawn forward, albeit one that can finish well.

This teams danger comes from wherever Convey plays. He forces defenses to collapse and cover, and that opens up opportunities for the rest of the team. I'd say line up like this:

-------------Dema----Santino---------------

----------------Convey---------------------
Stewart------------------------------Olsen
------------Namoff-----Nelsen--------------

------Ivanov------Petke-------Prideaux-----

Namoff has the speed to compensate for Nelsen and the defensive intensity to cover for Stewart and Ivanov when they press forward. He's quick and aggressive with the ball efficiently moving the attack forward through midfield before the defenders can set up. He can be the "early" midfielder to transition the team from defense to offense. Once we get into the attacking third he can track back and allow Nelsen to arrive "late" in the middle for crosses.

Stewart is right footed and works best in space. This setup allows him to drift centrally while Convey drifts to the left flank, forcing defenders to switch. Both players can attack quickly off of a target forward holding the ball, and both players can deliver excellent crosses. With Nelsen arriving late in the middle, he has a good chance to arrive unmarked, and can finish those crosses (while Namoff tracks back to disrupt any counter-attack).

Dema tends to push his dribble as far as it will go, then either shoot or pass. With his willingness to crack a long range shot and tenacity to fight for the ball in the box, he may be a good foil to Santino (if he's ever healthy). He is actually pretty good on rebounds and deflections.

Santino has three very good skills that are getting underutilized in the role Hudson has him playing up top. 1) He can turn on his defender almost at will and has the skill and willingness to run at defenders when he does. 2) He can deliver a very very nice long pass to a streaking teammate almost as well as Hristo can. 3) He can shoot from distance. When he returns he needs to be encouraged to dribble less, pass less and shoot more. When he gets the ball he needs to push the attack, fully realizing that he will likely lose the ball 2/3 of the time. It forces the defense to sag onto him, providing room for Convey and Stewart to exploit.

Olsen needs to concentrate on attacking the width of the field and sagging centrally on defense. Take away his tracking back responsibilities and keep him higher where he has to run less. He is a truly inventive and creative player, let him play to that strength.

Make sure to keep BOTH forwards at midfield or in the opponents half. Keep them fairly wide apart from one another as well. Make sure that they are constantly moving laterally trying to force defensive switches and pull defenders away from their zones and stretch their defensive shape. As soon as we get the ball insist that they make diagonal runs crossing one another to force defensive switches. This opens up the defense for our midfielders to utilize the space underneath.

Then, try to get a shot on goal (even if it is completely blocked by a defender and leads to a counter-attack) during the fast break. This is when defenders are out of position, keepers make hasty decisions, and you get deflections and rebounds.

Teach the attacking players to naturally move away from defenders, and never to "settle" into a spot on the field unless it is at least 7 yards away from the nearest defender. These things will produce riccochets, rebounds, deflections and even own goals. If this is done consistently, we will get many easy goals many of which will be classed "lucky" or "goal poaching," but they are systemic consequences of good attacking tactics.

Now if only Hudson/Trask would realize how to use the players in the roles for which they are best suited. Playing Dema as a Dmid, Stewart as a target forward, Olsen as a right back and Convey as a winger, just isn't smart.

-Digital

 

These are both tremendously well thought out posts. The rationalizations are all excellently laid out and seem very reasonable, the idea of playing to strengths, and minimizing weaknesses is lovely to behold, overall the spinning of very lovely webs.

However, this team was built around Marco and in my opinion can only be truly successful if he plays. He is their leader. Their is a reason players look to him on the field constantly (and it's not so he can slow up the game and lose opportunities so they have to cover for him). He has the confidence and reputation to control a game. Convey has shown he can do this too, but he's mainly shown this in games that Marco has played beside him. (Dallas game he did it by himself).

I certainly believe Dema and Convey centrally backed by Nelsen can win games, but I doubt they could win consistently, so we'd essentially be playing for next year. If the goal is to have a hope of winning consistently this year, Marco must play.

As for the other ideas, Namoff is an excellent player (and so is Carroll by all accounts), but he still makes at least one crucial mistake nearly every time he plays and Carroll certainly would too as a rookie. Chino, for example does not. The Peruvian may lose the ball and give up stupid fouls from time to time, but somehow those mistakes never seem to hurt the team by giving up a goal. Namoff's mistakes (while playing out of position as a defender, I'll admit) are usually crucial and cost the team. So, starting him is a risk. So is starting Dema at forward. He never did well at Chicago as forward, so why will he do better now? Santino is equally a risk as he is inconsistent as well in whatever role is given to him and he doesn't seem to accept the fact that he has to continue to grow as a player and not continue to try and play the same game he's played his whole life. Stewart is a whole 'nother can of fish. If he gets his confidence back and is willing to accept the role of a piano mover, excellent. If no to either, it's a disaster waiting to happen.

Just pointing out that the best aid plans of mice and men fail just as much as the plans of Hudson and Trask have done so far.

To me, it doesn't matter what is done, until a true finisher is found, this team will struggle mightily, so rearranging the deck chairs is moot.

 

Marco10, I worry that your anaylsis is one that results in no changes to our tactics. Also, I worry that you believe that these players are incapable of winning without Marco. Marco is a leader, but he is not the only player that can run the play of the game anymore. Assuming he is the only way we can win is foolish and costly.

I agree that "this team" was built around Marco. By "this team" I'm referring to the team that has taken the field with him this season. Marco's team is 1-2-5. If we to play to Marco's strength, which most of us would agree is not what it use to be, then we're limiting the strengths of 9 people around him.

But here's the catch. Look at Marco's career like Michael Jordan's. In Chicago the team was built to support him. He was the best in the NBA, much like Marco was the 90's. You could bring people in to assist him to get the job done, and you knew in the end, he would get it done. You KNEW he could do it.

Now, compare the end of their career's. Michael is still an inspirational leader, but the team could not survive on his shoulders alone. He needed other players to step up and carry the team when he could not.

That is where Marco's career is at with United. He cannot do it alone. He will still have his games, but he cannot be the only one out there. This team has been built around Marco from the very beginning, but now the team needs to be built around the future and Marco needs to assist the future by continue to be an inspirational leader.

What DigitalTron and DCU are trying to do is reshape this team and reshape Marco's role on the team. The future is were success lives. In sports you can never look back or dwell in the present. The only way to succeed is to live for the future. Marco is not the future.

Great posts everyone. I really like your analysis. Very in depth.

 

Great posts.

It was fairly obvious at the end of last season that Convey was passing Etcheverry in ability in the center of midfield. The we traded The Cartographer (ooohhh THAT feels good) for Dema who had shown in Chicago that he was both much more effective in the middle rather than the wings and that he could be a valuable offensive foil to the main central mid (Nowak in Chicago).

At that point we had two problems in midfield (figuring that we ink Olsen in at right wing): a hole at left wing and what to do with the max salary Etcheverry? (The only way I see that the team was built around Etch this year was because of his salary and the inertia in the minds of the coaches.) Ideally we would trade Etch for your average winger but he had (and has) no trade value.

Hudson had the idea though to play (start) Etch since he prefers his vets. Unfortunately this has backfired. Thus Dema has usually played way to deep in midfield to do what he does well and usually Convey has been pushed to left wing. Both moves to accomodate Etch have proved wrong. Both moves should be undone.

This still leaves the problem of the left winger. We do have potential stop-gap solutions:

1) Stewart could do an adequate job playing out of position

2) Barclay or Namoff, maybe Carroll could be given a chance

Of course with Hudson favoring the vets he's keeping the young 'uns from developing in the midfield.


Finally, as DT says, we still have problems at forward though I wonder if the forwards would start scoring if Dema and bobby were in the central mid positions.

 

I really liked the posts so far so I want to put my two cents in. However, I have to preface this by saying that I am not a die-hard DC fan and don't live in the area and have no means of watching games other than the ESPN2 game once a week. That said, I don't know these players individually so keep that in mind.

Why attempt to recreate an old Chicago team (I realize you have have Dema and Hristo)? Why not attempt the recreate the attacking line-up from the 2001 Fusion team? I won't address the defense because if it ain't broke...The 2001 Fusion squad was Hudson's team, I believe he was responsible for bringing in like 7 of the players the usually started. This team was strong in the center. From what I can gather, DC has a lot of players who can fill the central attacking/midfield roles. Perfect. If you remember the 2001 Fusion team's core attackers were Serna, Chachon, and Preki. Serna was the primary target and was almost always the deepest. Chacon played the withdrawn attacker role and would often come back to get a ball. Preki had the attacking midfield role but, he and Chacon would often overlap each other. A bit deeper, your organizer, still in the center was Rooney. Add workhorse Chris Henderson wide at mid and the attack could come from anywhere. Defenses were at a loss because the only attacker you could consistently account for was Serna and even then he didn't just stay on the central defender. Chacon, Preki and Rooney could not be consistently marked because they could come from anywhere. This was evident by the fact Miami had and insane amount of assists that year (89), it was all about exploiting space. I want to note that it was this system that opened the doors for Chacon and Rooney, who aren't exactly your top scorers, but Chacon had 19 goals and Rooney had 21 points. It helped Serna too, I mean 15/15 c'mon. Preki's Preki but he had a hell of a season too.

My point is, why is this core attack so hard to recreate for DC. It seems to me that the surplus of DC's players could effectively be used assume the formation Hudson used in Miami. This is where not being able to the see the games gets me in trouble. But somewhere between Quaranta, Eskandarian, Quintanilla, Curtis, Stewart, Etcheverry, Convey and Kovalenko these roles could be filled. The problem is who? There wasn't a lot of firepower coming off the Fusion bench so there wasn't much of a dilemma. I think it has to start with the Serna role and the rest should fall around, but again I don't know who that is. Someone who wants the ball at their feet in front of the goal, but is still looking at his team. Perhaps, Quaranta, it was said he's inconsistent, but I think he's the biggest forward DC has and the would lend itself to the Serna mold. Once the target man is in place, I think there is a wealth of players who can fill the Preki/Chacon roles. Obviously, I'm not the one to suggest who. Then there's the organizer. Why not Stewart? Wasn't he tried at this role when Reyna went down on the USMNT? I think he could handle it. I'm also assuming that Olsen could fit the Henderson role.

On an aside, I'd also like to suggest that the defensive midfielder is unnecessary position and perhaps they'd be better off with 3 or a flat four in the back where the outside backs could sneak up. Not that it isn't a useful position, but when you're not scoring and you have a Rimando in goal, aren't you just playing a man down on the attack?

Also, it was suggested in another post that Etcheverry is not the future of the franchise. If you guys remember, one of the first the Hudson did in Miami was to ship off Valderamma. I wonder if Hudson (or the boys upstairs) are holding on to him out of respect. It was easy to send Pibe packing he was a disrespectful clown. And while we're putting away the antiques, what's up with Hristo? He doing any good?

I apologize for not really suggesting any hard solutions on this post. Maybe someone who's more familiar with the current DC and remembers the old Fusion line-up could offer a more concrete utilization of talents. I just think with so many talented central striker/forwards it would be foolish not to incorporate a strategy that Hudson himself has used successfully before. At any rate, I hope something breaks because I really want to see Hudson ruling the league like those of us who grew up on South Florida soccer know he can.

 

That lineup could work, but it would take a drastic change in Hudson or a season ending injury to Marco.

We should keep this in mind for next season because the guys upstairs have to know that Marco is done after this year. That said, I could see us playing a similar lineup in starting in August. Convey will be done with National team duty, TIno should be healthy, which gives us two young guys who are needed to make this system work.

That being said, we should not stick to Marco because this team was "built" around him. When you know a player is aging and is on the downside of a great carrer, you don't add to his load, you subtract from it. Thus far, the team has failed to adapt to its play and injuries, with the excption of Bobby moving into the middle. However, we will not rid overselves of the Marco problem until Hudson leaves. I think that they are tied together at the hip and they will leave together. If we are gonna suck, I would rather it be a bunch of young guys out there giving their all and giving fans the hope that we will be great again some day.

 

Just a few additions to what DCU and D-tron have already said.

1. D-tron is correct, we don't have a target or holding forward. Cureton doesn't sound like that is it either (a finisher perhaps but not someone comfortable holding the ball with his back to goal). Santino really is best as a withdrawn forward.

2. The header to this thread is "tactics". While who plays what position suggests some tactical decisions, I don't think many of the tactical issues for this team are ones that are driven so much by who is playing where (other than some extreme examples--obviously Convey is faster than Etcheverry).

I think the tactical issues are things like this:
--at Colorado, holding back and waiting for the Rapids to make a mistake or self-destruct. When that didn't happen, we had a half to win the game. We dominated play the second half but didn't generate many chances and effectively gave away 2 points we should have won. In otherwords, we weren't not the aggressor against the weakest team in the league.
--Failing to act quickly, especially on transitions and counters. We seek to hold the ball rather than take risks. There are too many teams in MLS this year who seek to put 8-11 men behind the ball and our possession strategy (especially with no clear aerial threat or poor set pieces) only rewards these tactics.
--Unclear roles of attacting players (expected to just "freelance" out there and "create something").

I think we change those issues and we could have Barclay or Quintanilla or Carroll or Namoff or even Convey at outside mid and still succeed. I think the team's problems are less about who is playing where and instead, about what players are asked to do.

 

Excellent post! Welcome to the DC United Board Sink.

You seem to have picked up a lot of good insight even from the limited games you have been able to see on ESPN2, nice job.

You have accurately stated the Miami Fusion's system and success, but unfortunately, there are two almost irreplacable elements. Preki, as he proved by carrying KC to an MLS Cup and by being the engine of the Fusion, and again this season with a previously horrendous KC attack, is just a fantastic player. He is much like Piotr Nowak was in Chicago, in that he not only controls the flow and directs the attack, he pushes up to the forward line and scores often. Convey is the closest thing to Preki we have, and Etch's style is 100% the opposite of Preki's. Preki pushes gaps, forces defenders to collapse into coverage, and dishes, much like a point guard in basketball. Etch is the 3 point shooter who hangs out around the fringes and uses pinpoint passing to create danger. While Convey can fill in the central role admirably, if he's central, then we lack someone on the wings. Hudson is wrestling to figure out who that might be (Hint, it's Earnie Stewart!).

The other irreplacable part is the much disliked Diego Serna. He was their bull in a china shop with deadly accuracy. The closest players we have to that style are Ali Curtis and Alecko Eskandarian. That's probably why the team does so much better when one of them is in the game even if they aren't the best players. But neither of thim is anywhere close to what Serna was. Serna demanded constant and complete attention from one defender, while another defender kept an eye on him and hung back in position to cover if Serna beat his man--and he often did. This created space for Chacon and Preki.

In DC, Convey could play the Preki role and Stewart could play either the wing or Chacon role. But these configurations assume playing without Etch. Therein lies the problem of re-creating the Fusion style in DC United 2003. Plus, a good target forward is wanted everywhere in the world. Thus, they are extremely hard to find using MLS money. Many of us were pushing to acquire Dante Washington, who is sort of a poor man's target forward, but better than anything we have currently.

Your tactic of exploiting the gaps is an excellent one. While Hudson brought in all very old and very experienced attackers who already had learned these things prior to the Fusion, here at United he has young players who have not learned that. Unfortunately, Trask has absolutely no desire to teach him how. Thus, we cannot score.

-Digital

 

DC has been missing so much on the field this season, it's hard to know where to start. Nevertheless, if one were to start from scratch, I would say that a successful approach for DC would focus on balance -- many ways to attack, many players capable of attacking -- and on speed. And whatever the approach, it has to allow DC to put its most gifted players on the field.

The first step is benching Marco. His style of play leads to a lack of balance -- too predictable, too focused on only a few options. And Marco's presence on the field slows the pace to the point that no one else can be effective.

The same applies to Chino, Hristo, Quintinilla and probably Kovalenko -- either too few skills or too little speed.

That leaves the back line more or less as it is -- Ivanov, Prideaux, Petke, and Nelsen. I would play four in the back, because Nelsen is a much better central defender than he is a defensive midfielder. I have not seen much from Ivanov so far, but he looks like he might be dangerous moving forward from a outside fullback position.

The midfield would be Convey, Olsen, Stewart, and either Namoff or Carroll. I think Namoff could be the best defensive midfielder on the team, given a chance to make his beginner's mistakes and learn. You might want to put Santino in Stewart's spot, if Stewart continues to look ancient.

Upfront, my choice would be Eskandarian and Tino. If Tino plays midfield, play Curtis up front.

Overall team speed would be good. The attacking options would be much increased. Everyone would be capable of playing both ways and no one would need constant defensive cover. It would be worth a try.

 

My thoughts exactly.

 

Not to nitpick, but Hudson had nothing to do with Valderrama going back to Tampa. Logan made a "Commissioner's Decision" to move him, because the league didn't want one of their biggest stars sitting on the bench.

OK, I'll bite. Have you watched any of the games where Nelsen played d-mid? He is such a great two-way player, and contributed tremendously by winning balls in midfield and starting the attack quickly, rather than waiting for Etch to track back and get the ball from a defender. That all goes to waste when he plays in the back.