Strongest leagues in Europe 2019/20

I think it is a good visualisation and ranking of the leagues. I'd probably move Holland into tier 3 with the French league, but apart from that, spot-on.

 

Any move into tiers from recent years?

 

Spain is tier 2. The rest OK to me.

 

I think Serie A has a good shout for best league in the world in 19-20
While Juve were not as good as in some years during their run, they were still top quality and Inter, Atalanta, Lazio were great as well, which led to a 4 way title race at points in the season. Sassuolo and the likes of Milan and Napoli added to the depth of the league too especially after the break.
Several top performers - Ronaldo, Immobile, Dybala, Luis Alberto, Ilicic, Papu Gomez, Lukaku, De Vrij etc etc.
13 games in 6 weeks due to COVID cost them in Europe IMO and of course performances in the CL influence perception a lot.

Looked at as a whole, it was the most competitive of the big leagues. I'd go as far as to say also had the most stylish/exciting sides in Europe too in Atalanta and Sassuolo.

 

I and many others feel like the last decade there wasn't much between the Belgian and Dutch league. A few observations:

Coefficient ranking of Belgian league is since 2015 higher (this happened for the last time in 1994). Although in recent years the gap is closing and high chances this season will see a reverse. Club ranking over the past five years shows this order:

Ajax
AA Gent
PSV Eindhoven
Anderlecht
Racing Genk
Club Brugge
Standard Liège
AZ Alkmaar
Feyenoord

Head to head is a different story. Last time a Belgian club won against the 'Big Three' was in 2010 (Feyenoord vs Gent; 1-2 on aggregate). Since then it resulted in 11 wins, 4 draws and 1 loss for the Eredivisie team (Vitesse vs Waregem 0-2 in 2017).

Salaries in the Belgian League are higher:

"Average salary in Jupiler Pro League higher than in Eredivisie (march 2018)

Footballers in the Belgian Jupiler Pro League have clearly started to earn more in the past ten years. According to research by the Belgian newspaper Het Nieuwsblad, the average wage rose from 158,000 euros to 337,000 euros. That is considerably more than in the Eredivisie, where the average salary is about 60,000 euros lower.

Partly due to tax benefits for athletes, salaries in Belgium have risen sharply in recent years. The financial crisis had no negative effect on the increase, on the contrary, because the increase continued during that period. After a pause, salaries have risen again in the past two years.

As a football player you are best off financially at Anderlecht. In the Purple and White players, the players earn an average of 643,000 euros per year. Zulte Waregem is surprisingly in second place with an average of 524,000 euros. The average does depend on the number of players under contract. Anderlecht had a total of 55 professional players in the 2016/2017 season, Zulte Waregem only 22 players. Young promising players often do not earn more than 30,000 euros per year.

According to Het Nieuwsblad, salaries in the Eredivisie have barely risen in the past ten years. The average is still around 278,000 euros. These salaries were additionally taxed with a 16% tax increase due to the financial crisis. The amounts in the Netherlands and Belgium are nothing compared to the Premier League, the average salary in England is 3 million euros per year."

This has naturally attracted some decent Eredivisie players (the captain of champions Brugge is Dutch; Anderlecht has two/three in their spine including their #10)

Furthermore, there are much softer restrictions for non-EU players, the spending for agents is much higher (flip side are the lower transfer fees although that has also other reasons imho).

Although I can't prove it, I also feel like BEL across the board was more open to 'scientific' innovations in close cooperation with universities (I might be wrong). Less of an 'old boys network'.

Both are despite all justified criticism relatively well run by all reports and measurements, and both suffer from 'brain drain' and insecure stability at the top (as far as football is concerned, the last decade).

Average age is significantly higher, more foreigners.

There are also potential arguments in return like that the Belgian league hasn't delivered a Suarez, Ibrahimovic or Ziyech (with all those performances in the EL and CL over the past couple of years he has already made the grade - I saw WS included him in their 500 list) - there are both pros and cons.

Belgium is currently also overall more of an immigrant country, which is always beneficial for a deeper supply for your league (source 1, source 2). In Netherlands maybe, to an extent, the Turks and Moroccans have taken over the Surinamese people, who have rapidly closed the gap in level of education and earnings (in 2018 there was however still a net migration of 3500 people on a Suriname population of half a million). Obviously the national team has been fine too with some of them (not all) originating in the native league.

 

This is somewhat decent (the countries are what they play for, not where they are born). For 2018 is here.

 

Looks to me indeed the league has declined a bit, in the players they can attract, the coefficient rank, and the general stability of the football.

This has a few causes I guess but a main one is the sharp depreciation of the Turkish lira in recent years, resulting in heavy losses. Value of Lira-to-euro is now one-third of what it was at the end of 2016.

The training of players itself is average (for the size of the country, although e.g. Russia, Japan are much larger in population) but they boost it with dual nationals.

Not sure which tier or how it should move about, but there has been a widely reported slide.

See also this and where Turkey (Ukraine, Belgium etc.) stands:
https://football-observatory.com/IMG/sites/mr/mr55/en/

 

Have now also seen the commentary and short thread on twitter indeed.

I'm not claiming to be a close follower and one of the experts on this (some of the VI and AD journalists do follow), but here a good account of what happened (article from February 2019):

https://www.france24.com/en/20190208-turkish-clubs-pay-price-after-spending-spree

Or July 2020, with less numbers in the article but the same gist:
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/10/sports/soccer/turkey-lig-besaksehir.html

Big benefit used to be that players only pay 15% income tax for the entire 2010s. Per January 2020 that has been increased (the small paragraph 1.4, with the old rates mentioned).

 

Joint topscorer of last season Cyriel Dessers on the differences he experienced (in a Flanders podcast). It passed by here:

"The difference... I experience it is here [BEL] less tactical, that especially, but that it is here much... Yes I have to pay attention to my wordings. It is less tactical but it is more disciplined eventually."
--- "I'd ascribe tactics more to the JPL. With that I mean play organized..."
"Yes, viola. Because I noticed in Netherlands it was about nuances, details of details to improve and find the right balance in your play. To have there a bit more space or this and that. That is here less I find, I also see that with opponents. Last weekend I saw there was just man marking on Bongonda, and he followed him everywhere he went. I say: that doesn't exist in Netherlands, for example. But that's also tactics eventually, it is in their right. It is more mature football, I cannot say the level is higher or lower..."
--- "Is Belgium more mature?"
"Yes much more mature."
--- "More manlike"
"Yes, it are all men. In Netherlands it is just... there are reasons for it. There is less budget, or they don't want to spend it all, so they look more for youngsters and then you get more youthfull football. There is 'more football' played, perhaps more naive... This question I often received the past few months 'in Netherlands they don't defend and cannot defend'. Yeah, that is also not true. I think the defenders are equally good but it is harder to defend in Netherlands, because more risks are taken, yes building up..."
--- "Because they play higher."
"That too. But also the trainer has... one of the reasons they signed me here is because they want to use me in the pressing and that has become one of my strong points. But well, so far I never had to press for a single second! [laughs]. Many balls are played long so I had something like that I look at my kilometres and see it's disappointing. I never should press because then it gets played long. So that sort of things have differences."
--- "I think it is not bad Belgian teams know their qualities and play to their limits. I see sometimes they want too much in Holland."
"Belgium more realistic, 'okay we are not the best footballers, we ignore midfield.' And mentally, there is still a large section of romantics they call the 'Dutch School'. In the Belgian league it is more businesslike. That is not less good, or less beautiful, no, the results are also there."
--- "But with the general level I think Netherlands is still a little bit better. The infrastructure is still better, the number of talents that move through and improve looks higher to me, and the top teams maybe too. Was there interest from the Dutch top clubs?"
"No, and that had a few reasons."

Now, it should be noted Vertonghen, Alderweireld etc. also helped to improve defending when they were here. Vice versa, it's well documented Cruijff had his contribution in the late 1990s and early 2000s, at a time when the KNVB stood less receptive to him.

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I've finally read Gianluca Vialli his Italian Job book (from 2006), which is a reworked Coverciano thesis. In this there is something about the weather and the wind speeds as proven factor for technique, training and tactics in particular.



According to him, 'Holland' coped with this rather well. "Holland is a northern country and yet the Dutch may be one of the most technically gifted nations in the world, both in terms of skill and creativity. The average temperatures in Holland are not very different from England's, so why do they produce such different footballers?"

He - and others as Wenger - conclude it is the wind more than anything else that makes an influence or limitation (you can build a 'dome' around the pitch, which e.g. Ajax has done too, but that's obviously not cheap). As one of the explanations for why Italian football was 'better' than in England before or around that time.

 

There is also a very interesting interview with sharp observations by striker Bas Dost on the differences between Portugal and the other countries he has played in. I let it pass for now.

Here an article excerpt (from this week) about the investments in youth football:

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As a training country, the Netherlands has the reputation of investing heavily in facilities, coaches and development, but in the last ten years there has been considerable debate as to whether the efforts are sufficient. For example, Bert van Marwijk observed in his period as national coach (2008-2012) that youth trainers should be rewarded much better in order to entice the best coaches to stay active longer in the education. That would lead to a higher level of talent. In 2015, a conference was held about the future of Dutch football, which resulted in the KNVB report Winners of Tomorrow. It stated that clubs in a business with ever-increasing financial interests are struggling with the question of whether the expenditure on the youth academy is yielding sufficient returns. For example, Heracles Almelo, VVV-Venlo and FC Emmen made the choice to invest mainly in the first team and to reserve only a limited budget for the youth academy. RKC Waalwijk even dropped out completely. From the report: "The financial factor surrounding talent investment is currently facing many dilemmas. Costs of youth training, the prospect of future income flows for the clubs, purchase and return value of young players and the inability to retain young players for a longer period of time for their sporting development are issues that are often complicated by the current operation of legislation and regulations."

This dilemma came up again in 2018, when the Eredivisie clubs made new agreements under the heading of 'change agenda'. Especially Ajax, PSV, Feyenoord, AZ, Vitesse and FC Utrecht allocate substantial amounts to train players. They wanted to distribute the TV money a little more evenly, provided the rest would make more work of the youth academy. That would ultimately benefit both club football and the national team. At smaller clubs, the frustration was that it had become almost pointless to pump a lot of money into a youth academy, since any talent that stood out for a moment was immediately snatched away by the top. Moreover, the unequal distribution of media money forced small clubs to cut back on the football school, so that enough money was left to create a first team that could compete with Ajax and PSV. Ultimately, the club directors agreed to increase training fees. The distribution of the annual UEFA solidarity contribution for clubs not active in European tournaments (4.5 million euros) was also linked to having a youth academy.

Apparently these agreements were necessary to stimulate clubs to let money flow to the base, because that is no longer a matter of course in the Netherlands. That is now also reflected in the figures of UEFA. You might expect the Eredivisie right behind the five top countries, but that is not the case. With an average of 1.9 million a year that clubs spend on youth academy, the Netherlands ranks eighth in Europe. Behind the Russians (16 teams) and the Swiss (10 teams), who spend about a million more each year than the Dutch clubs. The Eredivisie scores slightly higher than the top competitions in Portugal and Belgium.

Average investment per club in top division *
1. England € 6.1 million
2. Germany € 5.3 million
3. France € 4.7 million
4. Italy € 4.3 million
5. Spain € 3.4 million
6. Russia € 2.8 million
7. Switzerland € 2.7 million
8. The Netherlands € 1.9 million
9. Portugal € 1.8 million
10. Belgium € 1.7 million
* About 75 percent are paid by the clubs themselves, the rest is funded through contributions from UEFA, national associations and sponsors

In the top countries, the clubs do spend the most, but compared to their earnings, this is not the case. In the Premier League, for example, only two percent of turnover goes to youth academies. The other four top countries also get no further than three to five percent. The sub-top leagues have a less bulky wallet and rely more on training themselves. They also see a revenue model in the export of players. They therefore invest proportionally more in training. It is again striking that the Netherlands does not stand out in the sub-top. On the contrary. It is true that the Eredivisie clubs reserve slightly more for youth than the Russians with 6.9 percent of turnover, but the investments are relatively smaller than in Portugal, Belgium and Switzerland.

turnover * youth * relative investment *
1. England € 272.0 million € 6.1 million 2.2%
2. Germany € 175.3 million € 5.3 million 3.0%
3. France € 84.7 million € 4.7 million 5.5%
4. Italy € 115.4 million € 4.3 million 3.7%
5. Spain € 157.3 million € 3.4 million 2.2%
6. Russia € 47.0 million € 2.8 million 6.0%
7. Switzerland € 21.6 million € 2.7 million 12.5%
8. The Netherlands € 27.6 million € 1.9 million 6.9%
9. Portugal € 24.4 million € 1.8 million 7.4%
10. Belgium € 24.4 million € 1.7 million 7.0%
* average per club (Note: in its investigations UEFA has recalculated the amounts to averages per club, but the expenditures differ greatly. Seven Dutch clubs spend less than a million a year on the youth. Eight clubs pay between one and three million The top three clubs invest more than five million a year).
[...]
Given the considerable, but not spectacular investments that are made in the training, it is an achievement that the Eredivisie annually scores high in the lists of countries that export the most talent. But the question is whether this is enough now that competitions from the backfield are catching up and in the right-hand row the question increasingly arises to what extent it makes sense to keep an expensive youth academy in the air if every top talent is stolen. The KNVB also seems to realize this. In the union meeting of last December, the professional and amateur clubs gave the green light for a new youth plan. This includes grants for clubs that set up programs to train large groups of talent in their region with qualified coaches. In addition, the union wants to financially reward clubs that deliver players to the Eredivisie. "A bonus based on the return of a training," said football development director Art Langeler about this idea last year. "If you let a player make his debut and he plays more than a third of the league matches, the club will receive a premium from the KNVB."

Although the idea exists for longer, this within the EU now legally accepted and tested premium system is inspired by Germany, where the clubs use part of the TV money to stimulate training. The more self-trained players under the age of 23, the greater the share of the pot. With the new financial arrangements of the KNVB and the Eredivisie, clubs must be tempted to continue to invest in the coming years.

How do the Dutch courses further compare to the other countries? Let's take a closer look at the group with which the Eredivisie competes. How modern are the accommodations? If we look at the age of the complexes, the national landscape seems up to date. Only Russia scores better.

Age of accommodations
Russia 18.9 years
Switzerland 26.9 years
The Netherlands 19.2 years
Portugal 29.0 years
Belgium 27.2 years

In the Netherlands, FC Groningen, Feyenoord and PSV, among others, opened improved or new complexes in recent years, but clubs are also not standing still in the rest of Europe. Between 2010 and 2020, 502 of the 673 clubs surveyed renovated their accommodations. In eight European countries, all clubs at the highest level refurbished their complexes. In the Netherlands this concerned 82 percent of the clubs. This means that the Eredivisie scores comparable to the competitive leagues. Spending on new complexes was higher than in Russia and Belgium, but lower than in Switzerland and Portugal.

2010-2020
clubs with new facilities spending on renovation / new construction
Russia 81% € 1.8 million
Switzerland 40% € 5.5 million
The Netherlands 82% € 2.9 million
Portugal 86% € 3.9 million
Belgium 94% € 1.0 million

How much manpower is available to prepare the talents for debuts and transfers? According to UEFA, the number of full-time jobs is a relevant indicator and the Netherlands also comes out as an average sub-top country in this respect. The clubs in Russia and Portugal have a larger medical and technical staff for the youth academy. The arsenal of coaches and scouts here is comparable to the situation in Switzerland and Belgium.

full-time jobs organization medical education coaches scouting / analysis
Russia 4 4 3 16-20 3
Switzerland 1-2 0-1 0-1 8-10 1-2
Netherlands 3 3 0-1 8-10 1-2
Portugal 8-10 11-15 4 11-15 5-7
Belgium 3 1-2 1-2 8-10 1-2

Is the Netherlands not a champion at all? Yes: in synthetic turf pitches. With an average of 3.4 units, the Netherlands not only scores higher than the direct competition, but even the highest in all of Europe.

natural grass pitches synthetic grass pitches in total
Russia 1.9 2.4 4.3
Switzerland 4.4 3.0 7.4
Netherlands 3.9 3.4 7.3
Portugal 4.0 2.5 6.5
Belgium 5.1 2.8 7.9

The aim of UEFA is ultimately to bring training to a high level all over Europe, but the question is whether this report will contribute to this. This first survey provides a good overview of the international landscape, but remains somewhat superficial because it says nothing about the quality or the efficiency of the courses. In the Netherlands, the KNVB gave stars based on quantitative criteria for years and there was a lot of criticism. "That was about lamps, balls and vans," director top football Nico-Jan Hoogma scoffed at the system that went overboard five years ago. After that, the programs were able to acquire the predicate locally, regionally, nationally or internationally, but those valuations are now also outdated. The license requirements only apply to suitably qualified trainers, a training plan and a minimum of three teams aged 16 to 21 years.

It is a pity that UEFA has not added depth by also investigating the philosophy of education. For example, the proper organization of a U21 competition here has been a headache for years and the KNVB advice to stop training pupils last year caused a lot of discussion. The UEFA report does not map out how other associations organize this. So it remains with nice comparison material, where the image that the Eredivisie invests an extreme amount in youth is gets some nuance.

https://www.vi.nl/pro/uefa-onderzoek-nuanceert-investeringen-nederland-in-jeugd

In the reactions people wonder about why Switzerland is so high; the likely answer is the limited amount of clubs in the top division (ten teams) and the high price level (roughly at least 60% higher as the other countries).

Another aspect is whether the money is well spent (for example the large staff Portugal has, aided by lower labor taxes/costs as in the other countries, and the returns) and it leaves out the amateur/volunteers scene of the equation.

https://totalfootballanalysis.com/a...nt-in-the-eredivisie-data-analysis-statistics

 

Another interesting discussion - relevant to the production of footballers and type of footballers - I saw here and here with people from various countries and cities like Dublin chipping in.

Claims like this (not by a layman) are possibly too extreme (long story) but there is either way a significant and sizeable difference.

"Compare the 'painter's district' with a banlieu (43% youth unemployment; earnings 7,500 against 20,000+ in 'painter's district')"

 

Two other interesting articles, the first one a bit sour and strong formulated (by the former ghostwriter of Cruijff his autobiography and columns) in the local Amsterdam paper:

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Ajax is too big and too small

The impact of the KNVB and UEFA decision to award the first Champions League ticket to Ajax and not AZ is still underestimated. With this Ajax was immediately assured of more than 30 million euros in income, which the club desperately needs to keep the budget balanced with a salary of approximately 90 million euros.

The result of the ambition to join the yet to be established Global Super League, in which only the best clubs in the world will be active. Within a separate entity, over which the international unions Uefa and Fifa have no control. That is why Ajax now has offices in New York and China and has interests in Japan, Australia and South Africa. In order to increase the global image, both sporting and business.

In the Netherlands, the club has to make do with the Eredivisie. It is becoming increasingly clear that playing in the national competition for Ajax is mainly a matter of securing participation in the Champions League. Now that the association is increasingly transforming into a company and is being managed in this way, Ajax does not hesitate to weaken the competition by luring youth players, trainers and specialists to the Johan Cruijff Arena. Gentleman's agreement or not. Everything that smacks of collective thinking and doing is hardly embraced by the club.

The change is in the sporting performance. By delivering in the Champions League, not only the international status of Ajax is increased, the team from Amsterdam also boosts the Dutch coefficient in the Uefa ranking and more clubs are eligible for European football.

In your own country a separate status, but what about internationally? The director, the mondial tried and tested former player Edwin van der Sar, plays a role in this. As Vice-President of the European Club Association (Eca), he can keep a finger on the pulse of clubs such as Juventus, Real Madrid, Liverpool, Bayern Munich and Paris Saint-Germain. Or join the negotiations for a new FIFA World Cup for clubs, with an intended budget of 1 billion euros. These are conversations in which Van der Sar experiences the increased bending power of the top clubs.

Such as the Eca decision to drop out, because FIFA president Gianni Infantino did not offer enough guarantees. The Swiss saved his face when he was able to cancel the World Cup "thanks" to Corona. After that, some clubs talked to American billionaire Stephen M. Ross. This happened outside of the Eca and there is a strong suspicion that the Global Super League, with clubs outside Europe, was also discussed at that time. When asked if he was also sitting at the table with Ross, Van der Sar responded: "Ajax is not big enough for that yet ..."

So too big for the Netherlands, but too small outside of it. Hence, at home the end sometimes justifies the means.

https://www.parool.nl/columns-opinie/ajax-is-te-groot-en-te-klein~b74a4fc9/?referrer=https://www.google.com/


BeNeLiga, the rescue or a utopia?

Fusion competition plans To counterbalance the major leagues, the Netherlands and Belgium are investigating whether they can start one strong joint league. But nobody wants to be the face of the BeNeLiga for the time being. A summit meeting with UEFA is scheduled for Thursday 24 September.

He calls himself a "believer". While others speak of a utopian plan, Vincent Mannaert, general manager at Club Brugge, is a fanatic advocate of the BeNeLiga, the fusion competition with the best football clubs from Belgium and the Netherlands. “We are not dreamers, we are realists,” he says. "If you want to remain internationally competitive, you have to do this."

The concrete idea for a BeNeLiga has been around since 1996, with then PSV chairman Harry van Raaij as one of the proponents. It never took serious shape - until now. Under the direction of five Belgian and six Dutch clubs, the possibility has been investigated for over a year, supported by the federations from both countries and consultancy firm Deloitte, which wrote a report of 250 pages.

March 2019, in Hotel Okura in Amsterdam, the Belgian national champion Club Brugge took the initiative, on the sidelines of a meeting of the ECA, the organization of European top clubs. Mannaert and Bruges owner Bart Verhaeghe found support for their plan to work with the Netherlands to counterbalance the tendency for European elite clubs and top leagues to run away sportively and financially. “If you still want to have the ambition to get far in Europe in the long term, you have to act now,” says Mannaert.

European club football is facing radical changes this decade, those involved expect. There is a fear that the English, Spanish, German and Italian leagues will gain more exclusivity for the new European cycle from 2024. For the past two years, these four leagues have already had the privilege of four participants in the Champions League, guaranteeing them hundreds millions in revenue before a ball is kicked.

Top European clubs, including Juventus and Real Madrid, have a growing position of power over UEFA. In doing so, they use their previous plans for a split-off elite competition, the Super League, as a lever to push their way through.

In this unruly force field, the gap with medium-sized football countries such as the Netherlands and Belgium is growing. "The big leagues say: do we really still have to play against that team from Belgium where we win 5-0, that makes no sense, does it?", says Peter Croonen, apart from chairman of the Pro League also director at KRC Genk, one of the clubs behind the BeNeLiga. “That sporting argument is already starting to turn against us. Are we going to wait until the calf has drowned or are we going to try to do something?

Sixth competition in Europe
By forming one strong competition, the Netherlands and Belgium, together, should become a factor of importance. The aim is to grow into the sixth league in Europe, where the Eredivisie and the Belgian Pro League are now tenth and eighth respectively.

The mutual resistance must be increased, with the ten best clubs in the Netherlands and the eight strongest in Belgium playing against each other for a full season. This should indirectly lead to better performance in Europe. Proponents hope that this upgrade would make it more attractive for young talent to stay here longer.

Commercially and in terms of TV income, clubs need to improve - but the question is to what extent that will happen. For media money, one of the most important sources of income for a club, Deloitte now works with a very wide bandwidth of 175 to 475 million euros.

"We believe in the fact that one plus one equals three," says Mannaert. “It is about marketing international rights, that is also the success of the Bundesliga and the Premier League. Today we mean little in this individually; Belgium and the Netherlands derive the media income mainly from their own market. If you can link and bundle that, you appeal better to a global market. ”

The Eredivisie clubs now distribute an average of 80 million euros in media money annually. The contract with broadcasting agent Fox Sport is fixed until mid-2025, it is plausible that if the Eredivisie (regardless of any BeNeLiga) signs a new contract for the period after that, the amount will be significantly higher. The Belgian league recently closed a new five-year TV deal with Eleven Sports, worth 103 million a year.

Former media man and conglomerate director Bert Habets, who is highly familiar with both cultures as a Limburger, has been put forward by the initiators to investigate the potential in the market. It is difficult to estimate what media groups are willing to pay for the BeNeLiga. "Nobody is going to show in their cards what the value is when you still have to bid," says Croonen. "Value is created in the tender process."

Ally of UEFA?
Another crucial point is the distribution of European tickets. Now the Netherlands and Belgium both have five, with a total of four places for the (preliminary round) Champions League this season. It is up to UEFA whether this number is maintained in a BeNeLiga and how the distribution takes place: purely on the basis of the ranking, or ranking in combination with the country.

A top meeting with UEFA president Aleksander Ceferin is planned around the European Super Cup in Budapest on Thursday 24 September.

The more tickets, the more attractive to get on. Clubs consider it essential that the number of ten is maintained, but it is not self-evident. Because this will probably also lead to protests from countries such as Turkey and Portugal, which also belong to the middle group.

At the same time, the BeNeLiga can become a strategic ally for UEFA, enabling it to position itself stronger against the big leagues and super clubs. It is still unclear how UEFA thinks about so-called cross-border competitions, for which there are also plans in Ireland and Northern Ireland. "We may be the first to officially submit the question to UEFA," said Croonen. “But we are certainly not the last. They have to develop a vision on this. ”

Possible introduction is only from 2024, a decision is expected sometime early next year at the earliest. "We do this initially to avoid having to say in ten years' time: if only we had researched it properly then," says Croonen. "If we sit still now, there is a real chance that we will regret it afterwards."

Landslide
It would mean a landslide for Dutch (and Belgian) professional football. Under the BeNeLiga there will be a kind of Eredivisie "light" - without the traditional top three. The result is that, say, Heracles Almelo can win the Eredivisie, and then automatically enter the BeNeLiga. Because there is promotion and relegation between BeNeLiga and the national leagues.

Especially in the Netherlands there is a lot of resistance and there seems to be insufficient support for now. A survey by Voetbal International at the beginning of this year showed that four Eredivisie clubs are in favor of the idea, the others are neutral (seven) or are at with the currently known information against (seven).

"We are already struggling to fill the stadium," said Cees Roozemond, director of sc Heerenveen. "We wonder whether matches against Belgian clubs are an added value and suddenly attract many more spectators."

They are therefore not in favor. But the club's poor financial situation means they are not in a position to say no in advance - perhaps it will bring major benefits. “We think: damn it, it is all very far away. We are almost quicker in Scandinavia than in the south of Belgium. ” At the same time, he believes that this should not be a reason to strike it down.

Dutch clubs are unsure about how it will be received by supporters. In the corona crisis, they lean on fans who have bought season tickets in the knowledge that they can only go to matches for the time being. By committing to the BeNeLiga, clubs run the risk of alienating themselves from their supporters.

That dilemma also touches on the heart of the consideration: rationally, in terms of economic potential, it may be a good move, but the Eredivisie is also a cultural-historical phenomenon, which will never be the same again in a merger with the Belgians. "If you conduct the debate now without such a study, you will very quickly get into emotional discussions where many clubs instinctively say: that can never be better for me, so I am against", says Croonen. "With the research we want to conduct the debate soberly and see if there is a basis for it."

Wouter Gudde, director of FC Groningen, finds the ambition to become the sixth league in Europe stimulating. “But I wonder why we can't just do that ourselves. Why do we need the BeNeliga for that? And only on the basis of a calculation by a consultancy firm, I do not believe that FC Groningen will generate more TV viewers and money against Kortrijk. ”

Annoyance with the Belgians
None of the six Dutch clubs that are among the initiators have publicly embraced the plan for the time being. Nobody wants to be the face of the BeNeLiga at this stage. In the meetings, the Dutch are reticent and do not show the back of their tongue - which can also be negotiating tactics.

This sometimes leads to annoyance at Belgian clubs, most of which would like to, says an insider. "We want to jump, why don't you take our hand and jump with us?", The Dutch were asked at a meeting in Eindhoven at the end of August. There was no clear answer.

“In Belgium, people believe more in the theoretical model and the potential,” says Croonen. "In the Netherlands people have more: interesting, it is possible, but can we get it all more concrete? Can we get the numbers for all levels?"

Illustrative of the Dutch caution is that it was decided not to hold a press conference after the last meeting. Also, none of the directors of co-initiators Ajax, Feyenoord, AZ and FC Utrecht responded to a request from NRC to speak about the BeNeLiga for this article.

A spokesman for Feyenoord says that they are happy that it is investigated. “So that after that the recurring discussion can be ended, because in the end it is not good for the clubs; whether it becomes clear that it really means a significant step forward for everyone and that there is therefore reason to work towards implementation. ” A risk for Feyenoord is that they lose their status as a top club in the BeNeLiga, given the stiff competition.

Everyone watches Ajax
The plan has no chance without Dutch pioneers. That's why everyone looks at Ajax. At first that was enthusiastic: now that the club is reaching its limits in the Netherlands, a BeNeLiga offers a more international perspective. And champion of two countries, Ajax also seemed beautiful.

But the club management realizes that the strategy they have now, becoming champions of the Netherlands and thus are almost certain of the group stage of the Champions League, also works fine. That would be more difficult in the BeNeLiga. That is why Ajax is now limping on two thoughts, says a person involved, but either way they also know it is not healthy when only Ajax is the winner.

Remarkably, it is a non-initiator who is now most emphatically in favor of the plan: PEC Zwolle chairman Adriaan Visser. He worked in Belgium for about ten years, knows many clubs, and is impressed by the stadiums, the cities, the supporters. "A BeNeLiga is a party for me. I'd do it immediately."

PEC Zwolle is now stuck in the middle bracket. "The chance that we will become champions of the Netherlands is zero." That would soon be realistic, in the Eredivisie new style. Big party in the city and then entering the BeNeLiga - Visser is already dreaming aloud. But some of his supporters are critical. "My hard core certainly doesn't like it," says Visser. "But we have to dare to break new ground in football."

--------------------

INITIATORS
Eleven clubs took the initiative for the BeNeLiga: Ajax, Feyenoord, PSV, AZ, FC Utrecht and Vitesse for the Netherlands and Anderlecht, Club Brugge, AA Gent, KRC Genk and Standard for Belgium. The federations are involved to monitor the vitality of the whole pyramid. If it is put to the vote, a five-sixth majority of the eighteen Eredivisie clubs is needed in the Netherlands. In addition, the Eerste Divisie must also agree, just like the General Assembly of the KNVB.

The BeNeLiga must consist of the ten best Dutch clubs and the eight best in Belgium. This is by a Belgian proposal determined on the basis of the performance in the last five years before the start. The division ten by eight is based on the number of inhabitants - 17 million in the Netherlands, 11 million in Belgium. There is promotion and relegation between the BeNeLiga and the national leagues.

 

Good article here, including the links within that article.

The number of Argentines in Europe’s major leagues is dwindling, and has been for a few years. The ones here tend to be quite old. Has a country that always seemed to have a bottomless well of talent finally run dry? https://t.co/yTK3VIukfP

— Rory Smith (@RorySmith) October 8, 2020

1314110822147411968 is not a valid tweet id

Meanwhile, the UEFA has placed some difficulties on proposed merger leagues, based on some false and dubious argumentation.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Eredivisie/comments/j6yzej/de_telegraaf_beneliga_far_away_as_uefa_boss/

See the comments there.

 

https://www.21stclub.com/2020/09/03/the-foundations-of-a-strong-league/
https://www.21stclub.com/2018/05/03/changing-the-food-chain/

 

In the meantime the Eredivisie and Eerste Klasse have indeed swapped places in the UEFA ranking.

Didn't know where to place it but came across this interesting article in the newspaper:

In terms of 'group dynamics'; yes it is a true cliche they tend to have strong individual opinions and egos, but at the same time there tends to an awareness too as Sid Lowe says here, or this podcast episode touches on.

There is also a 'famous' The Lancet article showing the physical activity levels of children in 2001 and 2016.
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanchi/article/PIIS2352-4642(19)30323-2/fulltext

Ranked from low to high:

Prevalence of insufficient physical activity (95% UI) in boys, 2001 Prevalence of insufficient physical activity (95% UI) in boys, 2016

Central and eastern Europe

Slovakia 69·8% (66·3–73·2) 65·5% (61·2–69·6)
Bulgaria 71·3% (67·8–74·6) 67·0% (62·8–71·0)
Albania 72·0% (68·3–75·4) 67·6% (63·4–71·5)
Croatia 73·1% (69·8–76·2) 70·1% (66·1–73·7)
Ukraine 73·4% (70·1–76·5) 70·6% (66·7–74·3)
Romania 74·6% (71·3–77·6) 72·7% (68·9–76·2)
Czech Republic 74·2% (70·9–77·3) 73·1% (69·3–76·5)
Moldova 74·8% (71·4–77·9) 73·3% (69·3–76·9)
Hungary 75·0% (71·9–78·0) 73·5% (69·8–76·9)
North Macedonia 75·5% (72·4–78·4) 73·5% (69·8–77·0)
Poland 75·2% (72·1–78·1) 73·7% (70·0–77·1)
Slovenia 75·4% (72·1–78·3) 74·8% (71·0–78·2)
Lithuania 75·9% (72·8–78·8) 76·0% (72·5–79·2)
Latvia 76·2% (73·1–79·0) 76·2% (72·7–79·3)
Estonia 79·1% (76·2–81·7) 80·6% (77·6–83·3)
Russia 79·1% (76·2–81·8) 80·9% (77·9–83·6)

High-income western countries

Ireland 70·5% (67·4–73·4) 63·5% (59·5–67·3)
USA 70·9% (68·2–73·5) 64·0% (60·3–67·5)
Greenland 73·1% (70·4–75·6) 68·4% (64·8–71·7)
Finland 74·0% (71·4–76·4) 69·0% (65·6–72·3)
Spain 74·4% (71·9–76·8) 69·8% (66·4–73·0)
Canada 74·1% (71·5–76·6) 70·5% (67·1–73·7)
Austria 74·7% (72·1–77·2) 71·2% (67·7–74·5)
Luxembourg 76·3% (73·9–78·6) 73·4% (70·2–76·4)
UK 76·2% (73·8–78·5) 74·7% (71·6–77·5)
Iceland 77·0% (74·4–79·3) 75·4% (72·3–78·3)
Netherlands 77·5% (75·2–79·7) 76·6% (73·6–79·3)
Malta 77·3% (74·8–79·6) 76·7% (73·6–79·5)
Portugal 78·6% (75·9–81·0) 78·1% (75·1–80·8)
Norway 79·3% (77·1–81·4) 78·6% (75·9–81·2)
Belgium 79·3% (76·9–81·5) 79·2% (76·4–81·8)
Germany 79·5% (77·3–81·6) 79·7% (77·0–82·1)
Greece 79·2% (77·0–81·3) 80·0% (77·4–82·5)
Israel 79·2% (76·9–81·4) 80·1% (77·4–82·5)
Denmark 80·4% (78·2–82·3) 82·1% (79·7–84·3)
Sweden 80·6% (78·5–82·6) 82·2% (79·7–84·4)
France 81·1% (79·0–83·0) 82·4% (80·0–84·6)
Switzerland 80·9% (78·9–82·9) 82·5% (80·1–84·7)
New Zealand 82·5% (80·5–84·3) 84·9% (82·8–86·9)
Italy 82·9% (80·9–84·7) 85·9% (83·9–87·8)
Australia 83·5% (81·6–85·2) 86·8% (84·8–88·5)

"In the USA, these data might be explained by better physical education in schools, the pervasive media coverage of sports, and a strong presence of sports clubs providing many opportunities to play in structured, organised sport (such as ice hockey, American football, basketball, or baseball), often rather male-dominated activities."


Aside from previously mentioned point about countries being an 'immigration country' (see post #7), and thus increasing your supply and depth, this is fairly relevant as well.

A quick search shows Spain ranking high in other sources too (consistently higher than Italy for example), so that might well help them in a variety of sports like football, tennis, basketball and giving a high depth/strength in athletes (relative to population as well in football). The 'golden age' in sports.


On talent recognition and the increased relative age effect as football grew more and more athletic (although VI notes, with hesitation, that the ship is turning again):

Well-known is the Norwegian model: select later. The Norwegians are successful, measured by population. They serve as an example in the world of sports, although few countries dare to adopt the model. Platvoet notes that Norwegians also select, especially in the sports in which they excel. And they also look with some envy to the Netherlands, because of the talent recognition and the offering of extra challenges and curriculum.
https://www.volkskrant.nl/sport/sel...messi-s-komen-toch-wel-bovendrijven~b9a14a69/
https://www.vi.nl/pro/het-geboortemaandeffect-zo-oneerlijk-is-het-nederlandse-voetbal

 

Yep, although PSG are challenged by Lille right now - who have a better collective and who broke the long overall invicibilty streak of AC Milan (1st of Serie A today) in the Europa League.
Renato Sanches (Lille) just got injured though. Ibra too, at Milan.

Also, if ever Marseille win their next two games, they'll have the same amount of points than PSG (2 games less than PSG).

Yazici, the "number 10" of Lille, is on fire at the moment, within this strong and playful collective. PSG are a ghost team.
As for Rennes (CL), unfortunately, Camavinga got injured for the first time lately and other teammates of him start to got injured as well. Otherwise, it's a very good side too.

The clubs (thus leagues) who can apply quick recovories treatments will be favoured even more than before in this context of much injuries like we see right now.

As for Neymar it doesn't change many things (seems like he's back... until next injury time?) but most of all, PSG are missing Verratti since a very long time now, he who's the vital cog of the team since years. He just entered in the last 30 mins. of the CL final btw. That's a really long time that he is missing or that he is (re-)appearing just here and there.

Lyon (3rd today) have the poorest ratio chances/ goals scored (with more efficiency, they could be at the height or ranked before the 'ghost team'). Monaco are doing good enough with Kovac as their coach. Nice would be a much better side with more experimented players at the back because they have youngsters + the old Dante there, while they have a very good coach, a very good keeper and interesting forwards.
Montpellier ranks higher than Nice, Monaco and Rennes at the moment but they dont have a defining game even less a series of good games for now.

Lately, maybe Lyon has found a scorer of goals in Tino Kadewere, so finally the team could be judged better as a whole. But it asks for confirmation. Moussa Dembélé still has no goals this season. They had to integrate all the new Brazilians at midfield too.

So I think there are good teams behind PSG. While PSG really is a shame of a team many times (they think they don't need to play football or run or... to win a game? Tuchel always changes formations depending on the match and there's no cooperation between him and Leonardo too, as for the transferts etc. as the Brazilian doesn't consult him ... in the meantime,Tuchel has no A-plan and relied on the ability to score of Mbappe-Neymar most of all... and there's the injuries too... maybe if the club was more severe with its stars, it would be a bit different? Anyways, they're at the bottom of the hole right now (with that CL Final they should have lead by 2-0 at half-time... also... erm...). And I think it is more interesting to follow the other teams like Lille (hopefully, Sanches and Celik will not miss too much to the team... but they were important until now).

edit : also Tuchel plays Marquinhos at midfield and Danilo at the back... while it should be otherwise.

 

Also says something about the Serie A when a super old Jose Fonte can stop Ibrahimovic.

 

Btw, it's all young players around Fonte like it is at Nice aroud Dante. But at Lille they are better (all foreigners, and the team also has a better-oiled midifield and btw, also, I just see and recall now that Malang Sarr, 21 years, quitted Nice to Porto, but it was the same on the last season with him).
Fonte for sure aged better than Dante (who goes surely a bit more to the beach at Nice too, eh). But yeah, he starts to seem a bit old now, for 2020-2021. It's never been about running speed in his game but it shows that it starts to be a bit more difficult by now, after two excellent seasons in L1. Hopefully, he could be very good again on this season, though. But there are signs... he had a problem at the eye lately after a shock with Memphis, I see now.

The Serie A still has (very) probably better coaches and staffs than the Ligue 1. Although again, Lille and Rennes (if the squad is rather complete, without too much injured players) are doing interesting things.

But we still must see Juventus doing some significative results in the Champions League since 2+ years.
In 2019-2020, PSG has eliminated the interesting Atalanta (without Illicic...Psg qualified in the last minutes, when they started to play...) and Lyon reached the semi-finals by eliminating Juve then Man. City.

 

Are there indicators for this? Or numbers? That's interesting.

 

I don't know, just an impression when you see that teams like Atalanta or Sassuolo have an ambition in the way of playing. + a greater tradition of high standard coaching that doesn't seem to stop. The quantity and the quality.

PSG would hire any of them. Not sure about the Serie A clubs being much interested in the French coaches : the only example was Rudi Garcia lately, at Roma, and it did not work very well to say the least. In the end.

 

Thanks. Yeah, that makes sense. I was thinking as well about the high depth of gifted French footballers with a tactical sense, and a relation to the coaching (or not)

I do have the impression though that foreign coaches often don't succeed well in Serie A. Plausibly because of the high tactical level and such, but there also seems to be a communicative issue (the percentage of people, even more so footballers, who can understand/hear English is quite low).

• English (34%)
• French (16%)
• Spanish (11%)
• German (5%)
• Other regional language (6%)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Languages_of_Italy

Obviously there is also Mourinho, funnily at a team without a single Italian player. Maybe one can even think Guardiola got his points across better (with better upward results) in a native setting. And with the Serie A ever more converging towards the other major countries, maybe we'll see a change.

 

You posted before the 2020-2021 season. In the country coefficients at https://kassiesa.net/uefa/data/method5/crank2021.html Sweden is 22nd, and they're the only one of the top 26 without a club in the CL or EL Group Stage.