Should MLS let top players go?

Discussion in 'MLS: News & Analysis' started by flanoverseas, Aug 8, 2002.

  1. flanoverseas

    flanoverseas New Member

    Mar 2, 2002
    I keep reading about how this player or that player needs / has to go to Europe to get better and that the MLS is a second rate league. So...

    I don't live in the States right now, and I didn't go to MLS games very often the last time I did in 2000. I should have, but I didn't follow soccer like now But... Were I living in the U.S., I would go every week now to see LD, Mathis, Beas, Twellman, Quaranta, etc...And, I think I would think twice about going if each year all of our best players were getting shipped away. I'm sure there are plenty of fans like me.

    Europe, Europe, Europe. That's all you ever hear even though half the WC squad came from the MLS, and among the Euro players (who play) probably only Reyna, Sanneh and O'brien were integral to our success.

    Then you have the argument that if we don't sell off our best players, the younger ones won't ever get a chance. Maybe that's true, but by keeping the top players, the league will only improve.

    I say, keep the players. If the MLS holds on to the top players, the league will get better - not that we don't have a lot of talent from Central and South America - but it might also become a league that is attractive to European players who are less than 36 :) And they'd pay less taxes. The MLS could become the Premier League of the World :p
  2. todda74

    todda74 New Member

    Nov 4, 2001
    Flan just curious, what got you into soccer now? Was it the World Cup or moving to France or what?

    Good argument you brought up about the on the fence fan and what the exodus of Cletus, Beasley and LD might do to attendance.
    1) I think that the American player can develop into a top flight international in MLS. Look at the development of our young American players so far. Keeping them in the league will highten the competition even more, driving the players younger than them to even higher levels. Though granted the top 4 leagues in Europe are at a higher level and I would love to see an American be one of the top players on a Euro team, most notably a Champions League contender.
    2) Since MLS isn't profitable I think if they can make a huge amount of money selling an American player then that would be a good decision. They shouldn't sell all of them but if a team is going to offer $10 mil plus for a player they gots to go. I know no one is offering that much right now but maybe in a few years.
    3) If they can take the money made from transfers and use it to set up reserve teams or expand the rosters that will be the best way to give playing time to young players that are not seeing much of it because of the more established veterans.
  3. bostonsoccermdl

    bostonsoccermdl Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 3, 2002
    Denver, CO
    It is obviously a fine line b/w what is best for the league's attendance and what is best for the individual player.. I tihnk that at some point the league has to let players go regardless of whether they play in the starting lineup (this is often a HUGE issue) just to make $$$ and stay afloat. The MLS has top suck up some pride and take the $$$ to ensure it doesn everything it can to "live and fight anotehr day." I'd say this amount lies somewhere around $7M.........
  4. listentobobmarley

    Jan 5, 2001
    if they will be playing. Then yeah they should be let go.

    If they dont, they we need to hope that they luck out like Frankie Heyduk and even with little or no playing time, improve there skills.

    I think it should be determined player by player, whats best for that individual player is what should be done.
  5. Jacen McCullough

    Nov 23, 1998
    You have to look at the big picture. Obviously, the league can't sell ALL of the top stars, or it would be a PR nightmare. On the other end though, they can't KEEP all of the top players either. Look at McBride, Beasley and Mathis. Those are three players who want to go to Europe. It's been their dream, and it's something they feel they need to do. If the league says NO, and doesn't attempt to sell them, that leads to two negative things. 1: That player will just leave when their contract is up, and probably won't have alot of positive things to say about MLS once they are in Europe. 2: The next generation of young players may balk at signing with MLS, knowing that the league won't help them achieve their dream of playing in Europe. Some stars, Landon Donovan, Josh Wolff, Tim Howard and others, have expressed an interest in staying with the league long term. Those are the players the league needs to keep and center their marketing on. Rather than do the "Strike Force" thing (although it wasn't too bad) where you promote Mathis, Beasley, Wolff, McBride, and Donovan while all but two of the five want to leave the league soon, they should center their promotions around impact players who have expressed an interest in staying with the league long term.

  6. Jacen McCullough

    Nov 23, 1998
    Forgot to mention, USA Men isn't the best forum for this. Moved to MLS News and Analysis.

  7. Kambiz_BAHAL

    Kambiz_BAHAL New Member

    your right abotu o'brien, reyna and sanneh... except you forgot Hejduk and Friedel...
  8. erikfootland

    erikfootland New Member

    Jul 19, 2002
    Arlington, VA
    move to Europe?

    I think that whether a player moves to Europe or not depends on the players. It would be nice to hold on to our american superstars, but MLS is also not up to par of the European leagues, and I think that is hurting some of the younger guys. Personally, I can see LD, Beasley, Wolff, Mathis, and some of the younger guys making a big impact in Europe, and those guys will only get better in Europe. All these guys have had great success in MLS, but for somebody like Mathis, who does not seem to have much of a work ethic, needs to go to Europe while he has a chance, cause they will carve that guy out of wood. I think that Mathis being in MLS is hurting him a lot, and a lot of our younger guys like Wolff, Beasley, LD are already at the top of the league and should probably go to Europe to test the big leagues and hopefully take their play to the next level. It's exciting to see the top players in MLS, and I would pay a ticket to see them play, but I also like to see the up and coming stars play as well. 96' was a different story, where there were 2 or 3 good playmakers per team and then a lot of youngsters who didn't really deserve to be in the league. But now the talent coming out of college is a lot better, and the league is really building a strong foundation with our younger American players. If we can keep doing this with our "average" players, then the league will get much better, and there would be no reason to our top players to leave, but for now I think that they should try their luck in Europe and see what they can do. Remember, Brazil sells off all of their talent, and they still have a great league, and still continue to produce great players all of the time. Wishful thinking comparing MLS to brazil, but maybe someday...
  9. flanoverseas

    flanoverseas New Member

    Mar 2, 2002
    I've been pretty nuts about it since the ball rolled through the Italian goalkeepers legs in Italia'90, just didn't go to a lot of games. I've become more of a fan from being over here and NOT being able to see friendlies, go to games.

    And I'm positive that my thousand+ posts have made me even more of a fan. My girlfriend thinks its just a place where I go to argue :)
  10. Brownswan

    Brownswan New Member

    Jun 30, 1999
    Port St. Lucie, FL
    We should be bringing top players here, not letting go the few we have. Unless we can settle being the A+ League -- and just slightly + at that.
  11. erikfootland

    erikfootland New Member

    Jul 19, 2002
    Arlington, VA
    How are we going to bring the top players here? Why would a top player come here for the league max of about $278K while he could be making about a hundred times as much in a European league? We need money to do that, and the only way we could do that is to get more fans at games, or to sell our talent to expensive European teams.
  12. flanoverseas

    flanoverseas New Member

    Mar 2, 2002
    So we sell our talent to buy Europe's talent? ;)

    The attendance factor. Is it up since the WC?
  13. erikfootland

    erikfootland New Member

    Jul 19, 2002
    Arlington, VA

    I think that Europe's talent is a bit better than ours. We have a few select individuals who might be able to get a significant transfer fee, but nobody near what a top European player would be getting for theirs.
  14. halfnelson31

    halfnelson31 New Member

    Jul 23, 2002
    i think mls should lock up guys like LD,DMB,Wollf, etc to long term deals and then LOAN them to european clubs for 2-3 years. they could go over and develop and sh!t and then come back and dominate the league. It would also be good cuz when they come back they can help develop the average mls players.
  15. tpm

    tpm New Member

    Sep 28, 2000
    Long Beach, CA
    The problem I have here is that is the aforementioned were THAT good, they would be dominating mls currently. That's when the large transfer fees are offered. Transfer fees are lower when buying on "potential" alone.

    My current assessment is that LD and DMB are very talented players who have excelled in tournament situations (youth championships and World Cup), but have yet to consistently assert themselves over an entire season in mls. They need to get past moments of brilliance and get to a consistently high and dominating level of play.
  16. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078
    mls can't afford these guys

    they know it (they being players)

    they know they can make it in europe (big paycheck)

    problems ensue

    some fans want the best to stay here, thinking that we can't develop new talent or that we must try and be the best with what we got... i really don't understand either of these points, at all

    we (our league) are young, so we gotta aproach it like a young player... know where we are at... do what we have to do and push to be better... if we try and be the best right away... it's tantamount to a 12 year old signing with man-u, playing first team right away and obviously things blow up right there and the career is over

    so we slowly build our base, we work everything so that the day will come when we can actually be a big boy... instead of a little fish right now...

    and being a little fish ain't bad... you are all in the same pond

    what's this mean?

    league has to let players go, they can't afford them... the players need to develop more than what they currently can here... this will do a number of things

    -money for league
    -more money for player
    -improved national team (this leads to more fan fare as it is currently our strongest asset in developing soccer fans)
    -more roster slots for american players (abroad and here)
    -players look favorably upon mls (it's a league that is cooperative with a player's dreams)
    -more chances for stud to happen... and really push soccer in the US (this has not happened, do not believe it has)

    mls is already losing young players every year that they could be signing... but won't because they don't see mls working for what they want... they would rather toil for a few years in the reserves then get first team in mls and have to worry about mls letting them get a chance in europe (mls likes to sign long term deals)...

    mls is also starting to irritate their stars (save ld, who is upset he never got any first team at the age of 17 :rolleyes: )... mcbride, beasely, mathis, wolff, pablo, etc. all want their chance abroad... some are starting to sound up about it... mls needs to watch itself in this regard
  17. Casper

    Casper Member+

    Mar 30, 2001
    New York
    Agreed. But don't call it luck that Frankie improved without first team playing time. Call it a great practice work ethic (a major reason they don't mind having him around, even though he's available) combined with excellent coaching.
  18. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078

    well to be honest, the way it seems the league has acted thus far... the are only concerned about the money...

    personally, i don't give a rat's ass... they get over there and they work hard... they will earn pt... some places it will be easier than others, but i feel confident in anyone we send over there to get pt if a team wants them at all

    i think the league if the league is only holding out for the best possibly money offer, they need to ease up
  19. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    1. I think the MLS stars are just a victim of circumstance. You can't expect MLS to sell these guys at the going rate for players without EU status, because for the most part, they're worth more to MLS than that.

    2. Even if you are not, I'm sure Landon knew that it is against German rules for a player under 18 to play in the Bundesliga. Your petty vendetta is uninteresting.
  20. flanoverseas

    flanoverseas New Member

    Mar 2, 2002
    Why the heck do people keep saying that Frankie improved. If anyone remembers him doing anything besides

    1. ANNOY
    2. TAKE BALL

    could you please direct me to the highlight. I know he played great defense for us, but I know most of you were just screaming for him NOT to boot it downfield, just once.

    Sanneh improved.

    Frankie didn't lose a step.
  21. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078
    lol, thanks dd

    we can always count on you for throwing some idiocy into these things

    i have no idea what the hell you are thinking on your first "point"... mls is the one that isn't realizing they are getting good offers, they want eu status offers for proven euro players... what can i say, not bright people

    ld is the one whining about not getting a chance, not me... i said the dude got all the chance in the world and would still get a chance when he goes back... a vendetta to say that he would get his chance is uninteresting because it's the truth and thus not really a vendetta... people like you like to think that there is a conspiracy going on so that he won't get pt, thus a vendetta that is interesting in how damn funny it is

    keep trying dd, someday you'll get it
  22. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    How much is a can of beans worth to you? Less than a dollar, I would think.

    How much is a can of beans worth to a millionaire about to starve to death in the desert?

    Apparently, you can't conceive of something having different values for two different people.

    How much is Zidane worth, today, to ManU or Arsenal or someone? Even if MLS could sign Zidane, he's worth far, far less here...because the marginal revenue he'd produce is less in MLS than for a Euro club.

    And to reverse it, an MLS icon like McBride may be worth more to MLS to Everton.

    You're having a hard time grasping the concept that both sides in a business deal have to agree on the price.

    In a moment, this problem will be no more, as I went ahead and got premium membership.

    Membership has its privileges.
  23. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078

    you do realize that doesn't work

    these said millionaires don't have one can of beans... you seen the talent trying to bust through in this nation??? they got cans of beans to spare and then some... we have hole fields of beans going unharvested it's so full of talent

    as for your ender,

    i'd say it was an honor to make you spend $30 to block me, but it just took common sense and simple thought on my part... unfortunately two things not in abundance in our society
  24. Stogey23

    Stogey23 Member+

    Dec 12, 1998
    San Diego, CA
    Great job Jim! You should get a commision.
  25. jmeissen0

    jmeissen0 New Member

    Mar 31, 2001
    page 1078

    you're hired

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