Serie A Guerin Sportivo 1980-1991 every game with player ratings

Discussion in 'The Beautiful Game' started by Vegan10, Aug 2, 2018.

  1. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Just looking back now at this, and it's interesting in that the GS reporter responsible for the match grades gave Careca a 6.5 (a mark that can be given to pretty impressive performances, plus it's the joint highest for a Napoli player that game with Renica), but he ends up picked out in the top 3 disappointing performances by the publication (maybe reputation can make it more likely players do end up as such though sometimes?).

    Gazzetta gave him a 6, which wasn't among the lowest grades of his team (but Renica's grade was - a 5!).
     
  2. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Continuing with this....

    Careca 1988 Guerin Sportivo ratings - 1988/89 (start to season to December)
    Atalanta (h) - 6.5
    Lecce (a) - 6.5
    Pescara (h) - 7.5
    Cesena (a) - 5.5
    Lazio (h) - 6
    Juventus (a) - 8
    Milan (h) - 8
    Fiorentina (h) - 7
    Bologna (h) - 7
    Roma (a) - 5.5
    (Average = 6.75, and overall average for 1988 Serie A games = 6.68)

    Diego Maradona 1988 Guerin Sportivo ratings - 1988/89 (start of season to December)
    Atalanta (h) - 6.5
    Pescara (h) - 7.5
    Cesena (a) - 7
    Lazio (h) - 6.5
    Juventus (a) - 6.5
    Milan (h) - 8
    Fiorentina (h) - 6.5
    Verona (a) - 7
    Bologna (h) - 8
    Roma (a) - 6
    (Average = 6.95, and overall average for 1988 Serie A games = 6.81)

    I know when looking at some of the earlier years GS seemed to be rating Napoli players higher than most, but this time I certainly spotted some examples (at least a couple each, but I didn't look thoroughly) where these players got higher grades in some games by Gazzetta. The ratings, I established on another thread, were coming down a bit in general through the 80s, but anyway Maradona's average for 1988 is a bit away from the very top ones from earlier (including his own 1985) I remember, but up there somewhere given the deflation in grades, and Careca's 1988 average seems to be high by recent standards too.

    I think it is definitely true that things can vary between publications, although maybe over the season the players given the best ratings seem to be fairly consistent as would be expected. Some players receive quite different averages in different publications though over a season I've noticed, as well as the examples of some wildly different grades in particular matches. In theory there are lots of sources available - the ones valid for the Guerin d'Oro, perhaps some additional ones (sometimes?) included by DBS Calcio, La Repubblica outside of that for example maybe?, etc etc. But comparing these top grades from Guerin Sportivo itself has some value or interest anyway I suppose, and adding the calculations for calendar year can be informative I think.
     
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  3. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    It also depends how you value each publication. Based on repute, GS, Gazzetta are generally considered the top by the standards of Italian readers, followed by Corriere and Tuttosport; hence the 4 more cited sources by GS. La Repubblica would fall into the category of La Stampa and other less cited sources.
     
  4. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    So yeah, I think Vialli and Baresi seem to be the most likely choices from other players....

    Gianluca Vialli 1988 Guerin Sportivo ratings - 1987/88 (January to end of season)
    Inter (h) - 7
    Pisa (a) - 6.5
    Napoli (h) - 6.5
    Empoli (a) - 8
    Torino (h) - 6
    Verona (a) - 6.5
    Como (h) - 7
    Milan (a) - 6
    Pescara (h) - 6
    Cesena (a) - 6
    Avellino (h) - 7
    Fiorentina (h) - 6
    Roma (a) - 7.5
    Ascoli (a) - 7.5
    Juventus (h) - 7
    Inter (a) - 5
    Pisa (h) - 6
    Napoli (a) - 7
    (6.59 so far, going into 1988/89)

    Franco Baresi 1988 Guerin Sportivo ratings 1987/88 (January to end of season)

    Napoli (h) - 7
    Juventus (a) - 6.5
    Como (h) - 7
    Pisa (h) - 6.5
    Fiorentina (a) - 7
    Cesena (h) - 7
    Ascoli (a) - 6.5
    Sampdoria (h) - 7.5
    Verona (h) - 7
    Torino (a) - 5.5
    Pescara (h) - 6
    Avellino (a) - 7
    Empoli (h) - 6
    Roma (a) - 6
    Inter (h) - 7.5
    Napoli (a) - 7
    Como (a) - 6
    (6.65 so far, heading into 1988/89)
     
  5. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    La Repubblica is definitely of a higher quality and up-market than Tuttosport. More serious, less partisan, more principled. What @Krokko also said.
     
  6. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    For 1980s standards ? I’m not so sure. They weren’t viewed that way by Italian readers in a poll in the 1980s and aren’t used as the top 4 in GS average grades.
     
  7. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    The thing is, the 4 top sources that GS uses consists exclusively of sports publications, utilizing many journalists that specialize in the sport. La Repubblica and others are not newspapers dedicated solely to sports, so there’s a limited amount of correspondents involved, which doesn’t mean less is worse than more. But obviously the sales of these newspapers are based less on sports than news in general, hence the Italian reader would buy the other newspapers that focus primarily on sports.
     
  8. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Continuing immediately with the new season....

    Gianluca Vialli 1988 Guerin Sportivo ratings - 1988/89 (start of season to December)
    Torino (a) - 5
    Como (h) - 5
    Pisa (a) - 5.5
    Ascoli (h) - 6.5
    Inter (a) - 6
    Bologna (h) - 7
    Fiorentina (a) - 7
    Roma (h) - 6
    Juventus (a) - 5
    Lecce (h) - 6
    Milan (a) - 6
    (Average = 5.91, overall 1988 Serie A average = 6.33)

    Franco Baresi 1988 Guerin Sportivo ratings - 1988/89 (start of season to December)

    Fiorentina (h) - 7
    Pescara (a) - 7
    Lazio (h) - 6.5
    Juventus (a) - 7
    Verona (a) - 7
    Atalanta (h) - 6.5
    Napoli (a) - 5
    Lecce (h) - 6
    Inter (h) - 7
    Torino (a) - 6
    Sampdoria (h) - 6
    (average = 6.44, overall 1988 Serie A average = 6.58)

    So maybe interesting to see 'star of the moment' Vialli's numbers, but in essence it would be a mistake to think he'd be among the top ones for 1988 averages - I think it's probably going to be correct that Donadoni for '88 would have been higher actually, and others like goalkeeper Zenga seemingly I think too. Vialli had a bit of a hangover after the summer. I noticed the Gazzetta ratings were quite often the same or similar for these players(especially at the start of 88/89), but he probably scored a bit better with them, and Baresi even a bit moreso I think. But Baresi too is behind the Napoli pair for this year with GS as we see. Interestingly I noticed, for his very well rated 1987/88, he was actually twice in the Hit Parade top 10 of the week, and twice in the top 3 disappointments of the week!
     
  9. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    These are the preferences of sources, according to GS poll of its readers.

    With GS aside, La Repubblica is the 4th top voice, followed by La Stampa. Interestingly, Tuttosport is the 2nd top choice after Gazzetta.

    Of course, La Repubblica and La Stampa are way behind in points.
     
  10. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    So the 1989-90 season kicks off.

    No GS grades but the top 10 “Hit Parade” continues.

    1989-90

    GS Round 1

    011EF245-2C35-4024-ABE6-C5D9091DF486.jpeg 09065F6C-310B-4824-A02E-BCD7FA8DE039.jpeg
     
  11. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    First round of Gazzetta I’m missing, will start in the 2nd round.
     
  12. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Some guys like Junior, Ramon Diaz and Laudrup have departed Italian football.
     
  13. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
  14. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    I'll see how things are looking in the middle of 89/90, but feel free to point out other possible choices for calculating 1989 average grades for (using Gazzetta this time, for the first time).

    I am already thinking it could be worth having another look at Vialli's grades for that year though potentially (given the 1988 part of 88/89 was evidently low rated). I'll see how him and the other 4 I had in mind are doing before the New Year (assuming we get the top 10 or so listed each week for Gazzetta it might even make things more obvious).
     
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  15. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Gazzetta round 2

    2FFF04BB-287E-4A22-A979-1DF98DDC1E08.jpeg B93A3B2F-BF24-4C40-9CBD-A8E54DD4D229.jpeg 7A4E367B-53BB-4115-A457-F41B2997D656.jpeg 08FF51FA-48F7-481F-A2FC-E954BBC5B058.jpeg 1FBC7BA8-9A6D-46BC-A867-6A17F8DF3A01.jpeg FBCE1A78-8256-4841-B6DB-C313F099D364.jpeg FAA4A2C3-736A-4677-B66A-F41CAEF06BCE.jpeg 0C6EF88D-7EDB-4D01-8FD4-9D706414A43F.jpeg CD37F87E-A302-4E0E-A654-0C5552B22F7B.jpeg
     
  16. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    There’s one problem: I’m missing the month of December of Gazzetta; I have the rest though. I do have all GS throughout but they are not giving grades.
     
  17. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    With these notable players gone, Klinsmann joins Inter Milan as the new foreigner star.
     
  18. PDG1978

    PDG1978 Member+

    Mar 8, 2009
    Club:
    Nottingham Forest FC
    Ah, ok, well maybe the first issue of January will help a bit but we'll see. The players we are concerned with should show up in the top 10 of the season so far by position (even if a full breakdown of all players isn't available) and we might be able to verify in which games they all played in from other sources so work out their December overall averages that way at least.
     
  19. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Gazzetta team of the week and top position averages through round 2

    8C38A41A-1359-4CA0-B17B-E7E413062A7A.jpeg
     
  20. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Yes, mate.
     
  21. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Around this time, legendary defender, Gaetano Scirea, passed away in an accident.

    3E682933-A9DB-4F5F-8415-D70B328C1B2D.jpeg
     
  22. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    GS rounds 3 & 4

    05D90B32-2048-431F-A609-BCA94DFB442F.jpeg
    Round 3
    7D2DC1C3-4ED2-4E3C-9E46-92C037C6325A.jpeg
    Round 4
    F57E710E-97EC-4D37-8F37-29584F304B5A.jpeg
     
  23. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Gazzetta round 3

    B986345B-69C3-460D-A434-6305895A8AE7.jpeg 456C48F7-7243-4D42-86BF-A38D4DC01271.jpeg 5103D7F4-CE25-4F06-BDB8-34BD63E56F64.jpeg 635B932B-B6C4-49DB-B2EB-5DE7C48D9BC9.jpeg AF2E77C4-E127-41D5-9CF1-27A7F4898063.jpeg 7F3EFBEE-1C2B-4705-9A1A-6FF4082EDE3F.jpeg C00DEA2C-6498-4EE8-A3FE-414FAF30A546.jpeg 07DCBEB8-F9A7-468B-AAA7-4CFAFD5C5CBE.jpeg D05D01E8-F812-41BD-9DE5-664C9D29FF67.jpeg
     
  24. Vegan10

    Vegan10 Member+

    Aug 4, 2011
    Gazzetta team of the week and top position averages through round 3

    AFC4B548-291A-4B01-A786-A6DB45FABDE9.jpeg
     
  25. PuckVanHeel

    PuckVanHeel BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Oct 4, 2011
    Club:
    Feyenoord
    Well Juventus was by far the most supported club of Italy so not surprising Tuttosport ends as #2. They are really very partisan in certain things.
     

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