Security concerns, particularly terrorist attacks, at the WC

Discussion in 'USA Men: World Cup Fans & Travel' started by Ronaldo's Idol, May 9, 2006.

  1. Ronaldo's Idol

    Jun 13, 2004
    With the largest sporting event in a western country post 9/11 under a month away, I thought a discussion of topics relating to terrorist security measures during the WC would be a good idea.

    Reasons:
    1) Germany has known terrorist (Al-Qaeda and other) cells.

    2) As Americans, we are the primary target due to our government's foreign policy.

    3) The World Cup is possibly the place where the largest congregation of American citizens, or American sympathizers will gather outside the United States and close to terrorist cells in perhaps the next decade.

    4) The World Cup is the most visible sporting event in the world, and if a terrorist attack was successful during it, it would send a very strong, visible message that the war against terrorism is far from over.


    So, with these scary reasons for why terrorism in the WC is a very relevant topic to discuss, here's my initial thoughts:

    I think the most dangerous, vulnerable places to be during the WC are:
    1) riding the train to and from the games the US is playing in.
    2) the open air large screen monitors in city centers, especially when the US is playing, but in general too
    3) waiting in lines to get through security (whether it be to get inside the stadium at US games, or to get into the parking lot or off the train)

    The ways that a terrorist could easily attack would be:
    1) leave a bomb in a bookbag on a train, maybe stored in an overhead compartment where it isn't obvious who it belongs to and it won't stand out as belonging to someone who isn't on the train. The bomb could be left while riding the train long before anyone who is going to the US game even boards, perhaps the previous day or in the early morning. The person who brings the bag on the train could even get off the train and set the bomb off with a timer. And if there are no metal detectors (there aren't) to get on the trains, well there is no way to secure against this as far as I can tell

    2) suicide bomber on a train, or in line to get into the stadium. Again, I just don't see how it can be defended against

    3) leaving a bookbag bomb at an open air large screen viewing place in a city center...again, this depends on how tight security is to get in, but with thousands entering and leaving freely, its probably not that hard

    Ways to avoid being in a dangerous situation:
    1) Don't ride the train to US games...I am really considering this for myself. I am considering renting a car just for the gameday, so I can avoid the train. I have a bad feeling about riding the train, until I see that security includes metal detectors and personal searches of everyone that gets on the train (but as Richard Reid showed us, even this isn't necessarily sufficient).

    2) Don't wait in big lines at the stadium...I plan to get there very early and to get into the stadium as early as possible as I think inside the stadia will be the safest place. Outside...at some point, the security ends and the lines to get through security begins.

    3) Do not congregate with other Americans in a vulnerable, low security, predicable place. That is, I think an American rally is a bad idea. If the USMNT is going to the trouble of not putting the US flag on the team bus (and probably other camouflaging measures), I think the US fans should take this as a hint.



    So these are my thoughts, and I know that most people will discard them either by saying "it will never happen" or "we can't stop doing what we want to do because then the terrorists win" and both are probably correct. But I am on the fence about what risks I'm willing to take to watch soccer.

    Someone might bring up that the Olympics in Greece went off without a hitch. And yes that is true, but does Greece have known terrorist cells (I'm not sure, I'm really wondering)? And how many Americans traveled to Greece to watch the US (again, I don't know). And finally, so what, maybe the terrorists found the WC to be a more attractive target due to visibility, accessibility, or some other reason.

    The point is, people will definitely vary a lot on this topic, and will act according to their own opinions, and that is fine. But before I go either riding the trains or instead renting a car, and before I decide to get to the stadium 8 hours early, or instead just go a few hours early, I'd like to know the opinions that are out there and the reasoning behind them.

    So fire away...and let's try to keep this on the specific topic of terrorist threats against Americans at the WC and how to avoid them and related topics.
     
  2. scaryice

    scaryice Member

    Jan 25, 2001
    The odds of being a victim of a terrorist attack are so slim that it's not worth worrying about.
     
  3. Ronaldo's Idol

    Jun 13, 2004

    That may be true. But what are the odds? How many Americans are going to be at the World Cup? How many trains are going to be going to the stadium on gameday?

    Lets say 50 trains go the the stadium, and one gets blown up, well those are odds I don't want to take.

    Even if its a 1/1000 chance (which is reasonable, depending on whether or not terrorists are really planning something), that's enough for me to pay attention to.

    It's still a relevant discussion.
     
  4. mandrake

    mandrake Member

    Sep 12, 2005
    Silver Spring
    It's something to be aware of (i.e. report suspicious activity), but I don't plan on changing my plans or behavior because of it.

    I live just outside Washington DC. If I wasn't here I would be back in the ancestral homelands of New York. I figure if they haven't got me yet while I have been living in these two high profile targets, I'm not going to let it bother me while in Germany.

    Again, I will observe my surroundings (it comes naturally with city life ;) ), but don't plan on doing anything different.

    I can understand your concerns, and if you feel safer renting a car, go for it. You don't want to ruin your vacation worry about terrorists.
     
  5. supersport

    supersport New Member

    Oct 17, 2001
    San Francisco
    Attacking an event like the WC would be a real stupid move on their part. Such an attack would just strenghten and unify more nations against the terrorist at a time when Bush and Co. are losing all the momentum they had after 9/11.
     
  6. Ronaldo's Idol

    Jun 13, 2004

    I think it is a folly to think that terrorist are looking at the big picture like that. Terrorists are very disjointed, probably don't communicate with each other that much, there are many different groups, and they probably don't care all that much about how the west thinks of them. All they care about is hurting the west as a way to get back for what they deem to be ill acts against them.

    So looking at the big picture, like you alluded to, I think is not really something they do, or at least I can't have confidence that all terrorist cells who aren't in contact with the leaders, if there are any leaders, will not attack because they are worried it will embolden the west against them.
     
  7. JBigjake

    JBigjake Member+

    Nov 16, 2003
    Perhaps, but an attack on Americans may be viewed less critically in the Moslem world than blowing up a Palestinian wedding. IMO, that was the act most reviled by Moslems since the Iraq invasion, perhaps more because it occurred in Jordan.
     
  8. jorge805

    jorge805 Member

    Feb 14, 2001
    Vegas
    Even Osama loves soccer, dude! It's good to be aware, but it's not worth the stress to worry about it. Terrorists thrive on the element of surprise, and Germany being super secure for Cup, they'd lose that (not to say that it isn't possible). People said the same thing about the 2002 Olympics...and that was IN the states, where there were plenty more Americans at large gatherings. If it happens, it happens. As long as I get to one damn game, I'd die happy.
     
  9. Magpie Maniac

    Magpie Maniac Member

    Dec 28, 2001
    North Carolina, USA
    Club:
    Newcastle United FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Hey, I'm all pumped up for this tournament, but I also want to return home to watch my two kids grow up.

    I'm not particularly paranoid about the security. I imagine that there are lots of things going on behind the scenes with the intelligence and police agencies. That said, I'm also going to avoid waving an American flag everywhere until I'm at the US matches. We're renting a car so we can see some things off the beaten path, but I like the idea of having my own source of transportation simply for the security aspect.
     
  10. Bv3000

    Bv3000 New Member

    Apr 23, 2005
    Ventura
    Well, the US team will be travelling incognito.

    http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/20....wcup.us.bus.1st.ld.writethru.0197/index.html

    Here's a picture of some of the other buses.

    http://img310.imageshack.us/img310/9563/teambuses8mv.jpg


    Also, Al Qaeda and other terrorists plan their attacks well in advance. If there is going to be an attack it is surely already planned. A USA rally planned at this point would not be a potential target for terrorists. However, it would be a potential target for ordinary hooligans.
     
  11. supersport

    supersport New Member

    Oct 17, 2001
    San Francisco
    As do countless other Muslims, and unfortunatly many of the terrorist themselves. I'd say they would much rather watch the WC, then ******** it up. There are much easier targets then the WC, and with Muslim nations competing in the WC it could even have a bit of a backlash in thier homelands.
     
  12. roadkit

    roadkit Greetings from the Fringe of Obscurity

    Jul 2, 2003
    Fornax Cluster
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Iran has a team going to the World Cup.

    While I support erring on the side of more security during an event like this, AQ has been able to launch an attack against much more American events (Super Bowl, World Series, Championship Bowling) since 9/11.

    That's because, in spite of Iraq, they are on their ass operationally. And if they did do something during the World Cup, I'd hate think of the massacre that would ensue once all the Polish, Brit, and Czech hooligans figure out where the Muslim enclaves are in Germany.

    ******** terrorists.
     
  13. schmuckatelli

    schmuckatelli New Member

    Nov 10, 2000
    Of course, there were also the Winter Olympics in Salt Lake City in 2002, and in Turin, Italy, 2006. I think a few westerners might have participated in and viewed those events...

    Terrorist cells or not, for years, travelers were warned off using Athens airport because of suspected lax security.

    While it's a good idea to be smart and be careful, some people worry too much.
     
  14. dkrboys

    dkrboys New Member

    Feb 16, 2006
    Simi Valley, CA
    I'm a fairly paranoid person, let's say "safe" & cautious. However, you've put way to much thought into this! If there wasn't something horrible planned already, well......you've given some hooligans and outright nutcases some great ideas for their own sick plots. You've even outlined the details pretty clearly.

    Being cautious is one thing, freaking people out is another.
     
  15. bltleo

    bltleo Member+

    Jan 5, 2003
    GERMANY
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Well if no one ask you to come to Germany. If are afraid or have concenrs particuarly terrorist attack, then you can stay home:). This is the most safe place for you.

    Here in Cologne is super game England-Sweden. I´m not afriad of all these english hooligans. I think Cologne will be prepared at this.

    The slogan is "it is a time to make friends"...so I hope we will get only friendly fans...

    of course there is always some risk..but this is during any big event...
    olympia, world cups, politican meetings etc. So I´m not worry about it.
    Germany is prepared.
     
  16. bltleo

    bltleo Member+

    Jan 5, 2003
    GERMANY
    Club:
    FC Bayern München
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    yes and the Iran President wants to come to Germany and watch games. I think Iran plays in NÜRNBERG AND FRANFURT. This might be a risk. People in Nürnberg are not very happy about it. This is only worry I have. But I´m sure Germany will manage it.
     
  17. jamison

    jamison Member

    Sep 25, 2000
    NYC
    Amen to that.

    I again suggest that if I didn't die on a NYC subway during the Koch administration, the odds of me getting the eternal red card now, on a train, are way too remote.

    It's a concern, but what is the upside to AQ if they do this? Is Germany the great satan as well? The absolute quickest way to inspire the full ire of the world (not to mention Pol/German hooligans) would be to suspend the Brazil- Italy R.16 game because someone threw a bomb at the USA bus...
     
  18. Ronaldo's Idol

    Jun 13, 2004

    I really don't think suicidal terrorist bombers will be fazed by Polish/German hooligans. And I think there is an enormous upside to AQ if they do this. It would be a hugely visible statement to the world that they are still there and they can impose their will on anyone. I'm not ready to discount the terrorist threat on assumptions that they like soccer too much or are afraid of hooligans.
     
  19. gngrasso

    gngrasso Member

    Dec 16, 2005
    Long Island, NY
    I don't think any terrorists would dare come to Germany because they are afraid of catching avian influeza (bird flu). :rolleyes:
     
  20. Ultra Peanut

    Ultra Peanut New Member

    Jun 3, 2004
    Achewood
    Club:
    New England Revolution
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    ...from the maurading hooligans.
     
  21. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    uhh... you're more likely to be injured or dead while driving a car in Germany than from a terrorist attack.

    Try to watch less than 16 hours of CNN/day if you can manage. :eek:
     
  22. BocaFan

    BocaFan Member+

    Aug 18, 2003
    Queens, NY
    The World Cup dwarfs those events. In fact, it dwarfs the summer olympics too.
     
  23. Nico Limmat

    Nico Limmat Member+

    Oct 24, 1999
    Dubai, UAE
    Club:
    Grasshopper Club Zürich
    Nat'l Team:
    Switzerland
    As a westerner living in the Middle East I can only roll my eyes at this thread...

    (and I speak English with an American accent)
    I think FOX News is more his style.
     
  24. JBigjake

    JBigjake Member+

    Nov 16, 2003
    Did you perhaps mean to say "has not been able"? OTOH, perhaps AQ is unaware of the primary American sports. (Of course, MLS Cup has been unscathed also!)
    Well, that settles it then! bltleo has spoken! :D
    So you're predicting Italy for second in our group? If the USA bus is still around, then we won the group?
     
  25. MikeLastort2

    MikeLastort2 Member

    Mar 28, 2002
    Takoma Park, MD
    I absolutely refuse to let fear of terrorism alter my plans in any way.
     

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