RSL 2020 Games 3-5: MLS Is Back Tournament incl. Knockouts, PBP

Discussion in 'Real Salt Lake' started by Ismitje, Jul 11, 2020.

  1. evilradar

    evilradar Member

    Real Salt Lake
    United States
    Apr 4, 2019
    Also can we talk about Alvin Jones? Dude knocks us out of the WC and within 3 minutes of his MLS and RLS debut gifts the other team a PK. I never want to see Jones in an RSL jersey again.
     
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  2. RSLer

    RSLer Member+

    Sep 24, 2008
    Stansbury Park, UT
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The Orlando bubble worked out well as far as Covid-19. The resumption of a normal schedule is going to be bumpy.
     
  3. RSLer

    RSLer Member+

    Sep 24, 2008
    Stansbury Park, UT
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  4. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    Not malicious but INCREDIBLY STUPID.

    I thought Kyle looked like a player resigned to his fate of being pretty much done as a player in that shot.

    I do think that he could actually add something to this team as a late sub. 15-30 minutes a game not in the hot and humid bubble confines.

    Father time is pretty much undefeated so it will be interesting to see what Kyle does moving forward.
     
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  5. RoyalNonesuch

    RoyalNonesuch Member+

    May 10, 2009
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    #430 RoyalNonesuch, Jul 28, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 28, 2020
    SJ knew what we were going to do. Every time we got forward (up the wings and then crossing or cutting back, near the corners of the box) they had help. Most attempts to dribble through that prepared defense resulted in give-aways or missed passes. They blunted it.

    Now flip the field - and think about how exposed our outside defenders were in that same location - answer: Very exposed. The help provided on both attack and defense by the two midfields (where we lost) was significantly different imo. Everton worked his head off in the first half...but he got worn out.

    RSL's pressure was applied much higher than San Jose's. It probably expended more energy...for less effect. Meanwhile SJ absorbed, their midfielders had more legs and possessed better and were able to contribute numbers to both defense and attack more consistently than RSL was able to. They handled the pressure than RSL did, they possessed better, and they got up field and stretched our D out a weird incoherent line and found ways through it. That Swedish guy was ********ing great - I would have rated him like an 8 or better. Judson should have been yellowed but he was effective too.

    RSL's offense improved when we got down 2-1 and 3-2 - higher line, more numbers ahead, more SJ fatigue, more desperation (and we gave up a counter or two as a result) - but we generated shots and a goal.

    I think too much criticism of Rusnak is ... harsh considering he probably made a helluvan effort just to get fit enough to play and clearly wasn't all the way back. He avoided contact. He was pacing himself endurance wise. If you're Freddy - you have to start him because he's one of your creative dynamos and you don't have too many of those.

    The McMath shade is fair. Nick earned a lot of points we won't earn this year...even in his twilight.
     
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  6. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    McMath did not have a great game but not all of that is on him.

    I wouldn't give up on him just yet.

    The first goal could/should have been saved but that was a pretty hot shot. Also, there is no way that Espnioza should get that shot off as wide open as he was if it wasn't for Toia letting him wander into the box all by himself.

    The second goal with the PK he guessed right and got a hand on it almost making the save.

    Third goal was just a comedy of errors. First, it looks like Zach is trying to get something started quickly but no one seems to be interested, he then does make a very weak and ill advised pass and the RSL defensive players make little effort to bail out their side and the rest is arm raising history.

    Fourth goal he is there and makes the save if Justen doesn't just let Wondo waltz on into the box. Also, Meram was could have done much better too.

    Fifth who cares.

    Over all this wasn't all on Zach but he could have played better. He was definitely hung out to dry a couple times and did make a very nice save bailing out Glad.

    Is he Nicks replacement and the future starting keeper for RSL maybe not but I think he could be a solid keeper given the chance.

    Not much more of a chance but I don't think more time would kill this team. They're not going anywhere this season any way.
     
  7. SpiffCoug

    SpiffCoug Member

    Nov 10, 2004
    Orem, Ut
    Some of my takeaways from the MiB tourney.

    MacMath got worse as the tourney progressed. He's a serviceable keeper, but will lose the team more games with untimely brain farts or poor distribution.

    Ruiz seems to be solid. But he's not spectacular. He seemed to do better when we were pushing a higher line.

    Toia never looked comfortable. He got beat consistently and easily. Of course, then his replacement immediately came in and gave up a game changing penalty.

    Herrera is clearly the better defender as most attacks didn't seem to come down his side. But he needs to be better on offense as opposing defenses seemed ok with our offense going through him. He routinely seemed more involved on offense than Rusnak and Kreilach. I don't know if that's by design, but it's not very effective or dangerous.

    Minus the red card, Silva, Glad and Holt were a decent enough trio of center backs.

    Baird was solid. He still looks fast in attack and works hard. He was dangerous in attack, but he needs the ball more from the midfield.

    Douglas looks much stronger and his hold up play is improved from last year. I'm excited to see how he continues to develop. Good things seemed to happen when he got wide and created space for people to run behind him into those gaps.

    Kreilach might quietly be our best player. He has 3 of the team's 5 goals. And easily could have had several more against SJ. But he's not a 10. We need to stop playing him there.

    Everton runs hard. Gets stuck in. But he brings nothing offensively. Once he get into the final third he has zero ideas and immediately looks to get rid of the ball (usually with a backwards pass). Which is too bad, because he has great strength to hold off defenders and speed to take advantage of open space.

    Johnson was essentially invisible in his appearances (apparently also seemed to be invisible to teammates) and rarely gets enough service.

    Meram has been poor. His free kicks and corners have not been dangerous. He's not warranting the playing time he is getting.

    Rusnak. Maybe the injury was more serious in the SJ match. But it still seems like he can and should be producing more than he is.

    Rossi. See Johnson. Essentially invisible in his appearances.

    Beckerman is fine for his age. He does seem to be getting forward a little more. The red card was just stupid.

    Freddy is just makes poor use of his substitutes. I'm not sure what the game plan is. What we're trying to accomplish. The offense is unimaginative. It was frustrating to watch our guys look tired and sluggish and then see no fresh legs brought on. The offense being boring and not dangerous and nothing being done to change that.

    My expectations going forward are very low. I just don't think Freddy is the answer. And I fear that we're going to be a mediocre team for too long before making a change.

    But who knows? Maybe I'm completely wrong about everything above?
     
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  8. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    I think SpiffCoug is pretty accurate with most, if not all, of his thoughts on the team above.

    Ultimately I believe that this is all on Freddy. I think a coach with actual MLS caliber experience would have this team in much better shape. An experienced coach would have an actual philosophy on what the team is trying to accomplish and would create a culture around that philosophy. That hasn't happened.

    There is no way on gods green earth will Freddy ever get this team to that point.

    RSL is in quite the rut when hiring coaches. After JK it's been pretty much amateur hour.
     
  9. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I've had the night and (an awful work) morning to think this one over. I also had the RSL show on in that time. So apologies ahead of time for some ****s and such. This is long winded so I'll break it into parts. This is part 1. I'll do part 2 later this evening.
    1. This whole MLS is Back thing really set itself up to show teams/coaches that know how to manage in tight timeframes and, more importantly, who has the ability to execute a vision/plan. One of the biggest knocks on coach Whittingham, for the longest time, was that he was really really good when you gave him time to prep for a game but not so great when he was in the thick of it (see November results vs Bowl Game results until the last few years). Freddy is showing a lot of those same problems. We were all really pleased with the cRapids match. The team came in and showed some really promising things and had very obviously scouted the cRapids weaknesses (mostly, they suck). However, as the tournament wore on, we looked less and less like a team with a plan and more like a bunch of dudes that got back together 3-5 days later to play more soccer. That falls on the coaching staff. Say all you want about individual performances (and there is plenty to be said, believe me) but this team lacks a consistent thought/ideology/identity. It's not something new we've said about this team, either. Since Kreis left, we've pined to be a team with an identity. Part of that comes from how badly a lot of us (myself very very much included) wanted to shake the club from being soooo predictable and single identity. The diamond was great... until it was scouted. Seattle broke it down for the league, we gave it one last hurrah in 2013, Kreis left, and it all went to shit.
    2. Wow, that was a big first point... so, as it relates to this game, we came out and were soooo much the lesser side in the first half. I do not know why it took San Jose so long to score on us, honestly. Anyone who thinks this game was "even" in the first half watched something completely different from me. Yes, it was obvious that if you could pick off San Jose up high then we could spring a counter very fast... but we weren't doing that. We gave San Jose 2/3s of the pitch almost constantly and they spread us out with ease. Toia looked like a really fancy mobile red cone and was destined to be the defender who got beat on the goal. Again, that it took so long is the only shocking thing to me. Oh, and MacMath's "attempt" on that ball made David De Gea blush.
    3. Kudos to the squad, and especially Baird/Douglas, for sparking an instant (almost literally) comeback for the team. I'm still going to say that is a big error by the SJ CB, but the ball from Baird was creative, nonetheless, and Douglas chipped the ball like it was a training session.
    4. Again, though, San Jose took over the game from there. We couldn't get to halftime soon enough. The only thing that was "balanced" when they flashed the stats was the scoreline (granted, that is the only stat that truly matters) - everything else was heavily leaning in SJ's favor. Something had to be done about the left side of our defense and midfield. Espioza was destroying us. He was on track for a hattrick, easily. The thought of making a sub at halftime made a huge smile come across my face. Yes! Freddy is trying shit! Whats that? He's taking off a defender!? oh man, he's really going for it, huh. Who are we putting in to change our approach. Jones? Who the hell is... another left back? That hasn't played all season? Oh, uh, ok... Lets see what he has to offer then... (2 minutes later...)
    5. Well thank god we took off Toia, or else we would have just given up that goal in the run of play instead of a pk. That looked like the mistake of a guy who hasn't played in a long time and was thrown into a very competitive match without much prep. Not saying Freddy is to fault there - that certainly is on Jones for some poor ball watching and even worse recovery decisions - but give the guy minutes earlier in the tournament, maybe?
    6. MacMath should do better on the pk, given he guessed right, but I'll never get mad at a GK for a pk unless they literally throw it in from going out. Still, lets take this moment to talk about MacMath. For years people have felt bad for him for getting pushed over on starting jobs. The Howard/cRapids one especially comes to mind. This was his chance to really come out and show that those guys were wrong. Like Melia has at SKC, prove that you aren't a career backup GK. You just have been in the wrong spots and finally take your chance. This tournament for him? Yikes. We knew we were gonna miss Nicky's distribution, but god, even with those lowered expectations I'm underwhelmed there. And, based purely on body language and speculation, I do not sense that the guy has grown any form of connection with the backline. Saves are met with a "good job" nod. No celebratory stuff. No comradery like you'd hope to see. That's asking a lot, I know, but it helps when the guy has down moments. To talk about De Gea, again, the guy is having a rough go lately but the players support him on the team. You can see that. MacMath? Everyone seems indifferent. Ochoa needs to get fit and be given the starting spot. It was MacMath's to lose and he lost it.
    7. The defense through the first 3 games was lauded for being the best in the tournament. Statistically, this was very accurate. We only gave up 2 goals. But we didn't exactly face teams with firepower offenses. The cRapids are lost up top, like us. The Minnesota game was an exercise in just hitting each other and playing defense. The SKC game then exposed us for not being able to handle dynamic movement from an opponent. Which SJ has a whole hell of a lot. They spread us out with ease and found gaps far too regularly. Even more than that, though, our "press" wouldn't stop a u10 team with 2 players that could pass and move.
     
  10. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    pt 2
    1. Lets talk about this RSL "press". It sucks. Flat out. It is awful. We have numerous moments where a coordinated press would cause a turnover in a dangerous spot and we don't have the cohesion to pull it off. Either Douglas isn't pushing hard enough at the point, or Kreilach and Rusnak are jogging into the second part of the press, or even worse our defense has left a gap that allows the opponent to break the first 2 lines of our team. Nobody covers themselves in glory on this. For all the hustle Everton brings, even he doesn't consistently apply the press when he should/could. And it's infuriating because this team is built to press, if nothing else. I don't see us as a possession oriented side like the diamond years. I don't see us as a sit in and counter team, either, despite seeming like maybe that is what we want to do at times. We should press teams. We have loads of young athletes on this team, the difference seems to be desire and/or coordination.
    2. This is on Freddy and Elliott Fall. If this team isn't going to accept the identity of a press, then things need to massively change on the roster and in player selection. Asking this team to do something else doesn't make sense. Though I'm not sure what else they're being asked to do (see pt.1 point 1). I look at this squad and see a striker in Douglas (and Johnson) who want to stretch their legs and run. They aren't hold up slower players like we've cycled through. They are athletes and can at least put on a forwards version of defense. After that, the attacking midfield 3 are where I get the most confused. Kreilach is the weak point in us doing a press. He's also a big culprit, IMO, about why this team struggles so much offensively (see later point). Rusnak doesn't give pace consistently. he did in the cRapids match and in the Minn match until injury, so possibly that is it. However, I'll talk about him a bit with the Kreilach point later.
    3. One player I actually went away from this game with a higher opinion of was Pablo Ruiz. Lets be honest, I've said some really low things of the guy so this isn't some massive leap. But, the kid played really well and showed to have the engine to play the dmid role next to Everton and be effective. It is so frustrating that Petke kept trying him at LB when we could have been grooming him for KB replacement. Just like Besler. Speaking of Besler, wtf? How does Ruiz jump him this quickly? I will stick by my opinion that Nick Besler is a bottom of the roster MLS quality guy. Nothing wrong with that, but never expect him to be as good as his brother.
    4. Glad and Silva both had polar games in this one. They had some incredibly strong moment where it was making me not miss Nedum so much. But then both showed why Nedum is the clear and obvious number 1 CB on this team. For Glad, that play in the first half where he gets held up on the top of the 6 is simply inexcusable. MacMath made a really good save on it otherwise we're all talking about how soft Glad is. Because he is. And that's who apparently he is always going to be, because after this many years of a pro and having that same feedback you just gotta call a spade a spade. Silva, on the other hand, was having some really strong moments in keeping the glue together and then on the 3rd goal it's like he raised his hand and had his brain leave his body. With VAR, there is ZERO reason to do that anymore. Just play through. If the player is off, even if the AR misses it, we'll get it fixed 99 times out of 100. And the tackle for the red? That screams an extra game or two.
    5. Speaking of extra games... KB, way to end the tournament in the most professional fashion. Very captain like bro. The guy needs to be relegated to the bottom of the gameday roster. I'd rather see us give minutes to young players. Have him be a locker room presence and nothing else.
    6. It is flat out unacceptable that Freddy didn't give 2 players an appearance after the game went 4-2. These players have a lot of appearance bonuses in their contracts. If I'm an agent of the guys like Illoski and Schmitt I'd be blowing Freddy's phone up asking what in the ******** it takes for my guy to get even a handful of minutes. If/When we get back to the RioT the first coordinated tifo needs to happen at the 75th minute that simply shows how many subs Freddy has used and how many he has left. Section 35 would be perfect for this. This has to be fixed. If we had press worth a damn they'd grill him EVERY SINGLE GAME about it. It's like losing an american football game for mismanaging your timeouts. Coaches have damn near been fired for that alone.
    7. To my point about Kreilach and Rusnak. They can't exist on the same team, I'm convinced. 2017 was Rusnak's best year with the club, by a pretty decent margin, and has progressively got worse each ensuing year. In 2017, Rusnak scored 7 goals and assisted on 14(!). In 2018 that dipped to 10 goals and 7 assists. 2019 was 10 goals and 5 assists. Those are decent numbers on their own, but are not the numbers of the highest paid player in club history. Further, he didn't take a single PK in 2017 and has taken more each of the ensuing years to account for his increased goal count. The thing that jumps out to me so very much in those is his dramatic drop in assists. He isn't the guy we build through like we did in 2017. Who is to blame on that? A lot has been said there, but a guy I don't hear mentioned enough...Kreilach was brought to the club in 2018. He came on with a bang of 12 goals and 8 assists that year. Though last year the well went dry and he only had 6 goals and 5 assists. Confusingly, in 2019, Kreilach was played more at the striker and 10 position. Why? These numbers don't justify that. I'll go off on this a whole lot more later, but it is my "hot take" that this club HAS to get rid of one of these two players to figure out the offensive side of the ball. They are like playing Mathis with Javi and Andy Williams. Are they (Rusnak and Kreilach) both good players? Yes, obviously. But do they work together? I think the answer is a resounding no. The only other way to address this, to me, is to move Kreilach back next to Everton like was intended but the club has shown absolutely no desire to do that. So... part ways with one.
    8. Lastly, it was really nice to watch MLS again. But this tournament didn't win any casual observers over, i guarantee that. The play was choppy. The game times were... strange (but understandable for the location). Even as a fan of a team in the league, I'm struggling to find a reason to continue to watch this. maybe I'm in the minority with this. Maybe it was the prolonged Euro seasons (how about my Milan boys!!!?!) showing us the gap that still exists. I dunno. I just... can't find a reason to see this as really good for the league.
     
  11. 15 to 32

    15 to 32 Straw Hog

    Jul 1, 2008
    Salt Lake
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Bonus point:
    This team is hard to watch as we have found the line of a physical team and a dirty team and CONSISTENTLY cross it. I love the bulldog nature of Luiz, but he does at least one tackle a game that makes the former player in me want to rake my cleat over his Achilles. The Donny Toia school of tackling involves hitting the player for apparently no reason whenever their back is to goal. Marcelo Silva does marcelo silva things. Herrera is talented as hell, but his physical nature is going to get him blown up by a few wingers. And that kind of play at the next level (which I think he's capable of) will be met with a lot more cards unless he can find a way to fix his timing.

    My point is this team has shown it's cards a bit to be the team that is overly aggressive for seemingly no reason. I thought the cRapids game was due to the rivalry of the teams. SKC too. But it existed in all 4 games and we are the common theme among them. I'm not asking the team to play soft and completely tone it down, but I really don't like the style of overly aggressive soccer we seem to want to implement.
     
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  12. Ismitje

    Ismitje Super Moderator

    Dec 30, 2000
    The Palouse
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  13. SenordrummeR2

    SenordrummeR2 Member+

    Jul 21, 2008
    Layton, UT
    Club:
    Real Salt Lake
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I was fully onboard the hype train when we signed Meram. He showed better with Atlanta, so maybe Orlando was a one off and he would get back to similar success he had in Columbus. But man, he did not show anything in the tourney to give me hope that he'll produce anywhere near the same level. He didn't even perform in a super-sub capacity. Bad first touch, poor decisions, poor passing. I'm not really hopeful it'll get better.

    And Rossi. Oof. He had several months to recover from injury and get in shape to come off the bench as a first sub and provide a second half spark. Instead, he comes on for the final 15 minutes if he's lucky and looks tired as soon as he un-tucks his shirt.
     
  14. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    For Meram how much of it is him?

    I personally think that a lot of the struggles for some/many of the players could come down to Freddy.

    If you don't have a system, philosophy, culture, that everyone knows, understands, and has bought into I think you end up with play exactly like what we see with RSL.

    When your coach says go and make something happen then that's what you do. You try and make something happen. Like dribble into four players all of the time or you continually make selfish decisions because everyone knows your system doesn't work and the only way you score is by individual effort.

    It could also be that the players for RSL just aren't that great but good coaching makes players better. Good coaching gets the most out of every player. But even the best players often can't overcome the lack of quality coaching.

    RSL hasn't had quality coaching in a very, very, long time. I doubt it changes any time soon.
     
  15. SpiffCoug

    SpiffCoug Member

    Nov 10, 2004
    Orem, Ut
    Kreilach is in his final year, I bet he doesn't resign and goes back to Europe to finish his career.
     
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  16. evilradar

    evilradar Member

    Real Salt Lake
    United States
    Apr 4, 2019
    (x) doubt.
     
  17. goobx1

    goobx1 Member+

    Jul 9, 2007
    Salt Lake
    I wouldn't be surprised if he stayed in MLS just not with RSL. He could end up with a team with an actual offensive philosophy that plays to his strengths. What would that be like?
     

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