It was a reply to the comment about the importance of managing a game early. Yes you could argue he should have issued more later, but that match is hardly remembered as one that spiraled out of control or resulted in a melee. Not hesitating to issue a yellow just 6 minutes in to a WC final takes some confidence, IMHO.
No, I really don't remember any (top-level) match with 2 or more yellows in the first 10 minutes and then none afterwards. But this is getting off topic
Your points are all accurate. But did Brisard do really anything different in managing the game than pretty much any run of the mill/competent UEFA or international referee on any game in Europe or the world? Was he that much worse managing the players than Andre Marriner or Anthony Taylor? Was he doing anything differently than what those guys? The issue is that essentially the powers that be don't want referees to get involved in matches. They WANT the referees to indulge the players and let the dissent go and not punish borderline tactical fouls and not punish delay of restarts, etc. They don't WANT the "signs" to be addressed and punished. I didn't watch the game so I can't comment on how inadequate Brisard was in managing the game, but I can't imagine he was so much worse than Makkelie was in managing the Europa League Final. Makkelie ignored blatant dissent. When players mobbed him, he didn't do anything to stop them from doing that again. He just gave them hand gestures to go away and rinse and repeat for 90 minutes. When it was a borderline or even obvious tactical foul, he just called the foul. When it was borderline reckless or obivious reckless he just called the foul. The only difference is that Brisard got "unlucky" in his game blowing up or that Makkelie was "lucky" in his game not blowing up. Leagues and confederations have come to the conclusion that the players have enough self-discipline and professionalism that games like this are few and far in between. They believe that the players will police themselves and games won't turn into riots and thus have told the referees to indulge and put with players' excesses. They feel that a game blowing up like this every now and then is worth the other games not being ruined by an early send-off when appropriate. That's the risk that the leagues are taking with the management of these games. We and everyone else has discussed Howard Webb's World Cup Final in ad nauseam and he, along with everyone else, focuses on the missed De Jong tackle. Webb talks about that tackle as the one incident he would like to have back in an otherwise "perfect" performance. I believe Webb genuinely believes he managed/refereed that game well apart from the De Jong tackle. But the reality is he failed that match from a refereeing perspective way before that tackle ever happened. He saw the game spiraling out of control way before and he did nothing about it because that's what he was trained to and encouraged to do from his superiors.
Got it. Also, just messing with you a little. Clearly I have no problem creating new tangents. You actually can't argue he should have issued more later. There really weren't many other yellow card opportunities. There was just a clear horror tackle for a red card. Also, both early yellow cards were pretty obvious based on standards then. My point in bringing that up is that the missed SFP led to absolutely nothing later in that match. Whereas the allegedly missed SFP in the PSG-OM match, along with a myriad of other issues, helped lead to a brawl. So no two matches are alike. Plus, the context--a historical derby in an early season league match versus a World Cup Final--helps to shape a match, too. Neither did Howard Webb. And look how that went. Again, no two matches are alike.
Oh. I missed the context of "no more for the rest of the match," sorry. I thought you meant "I don't remember two early yellows in the first 10 minutes of a World Cup Final," which is why I presumed sarcasm! I hear what you're saying. I still think it's happened often enough depending upon how you define "top-level," but sure, it's rarer than the alternative.
Without seeing Brisard's full performance, this is where my mind started going, too. So would be very interested in your take on this, @allan_park. Seems like an interesting discussion.
Well, you are entitled to your own opinion, of course, but in answer to that question, I can honestly say "Yes", he did. Watching the game as a neutral Observer, I would have to say that I genuinely felt far less comfortable - for the Referee and his game control - than I did during the Europa League Final. Just my personal opinion.
Wow. Faulty memory today. I could have sworn the Van Persie and Van Bommel yellows were really early. But clearly, they weren't.
Boy, that's a tough one to answer without being able to do a proper review/debrief, but I will try. One thing to say right up front is that Brisard did not try to "mange the game without using cards" - he has a reputation of issuing more cards than most (I think 6+ per game in Ligue 1) and this game was heading that way from early on. But, his choice of which things to sanction, and which to "manage around" was what was flawed. Usually, when you see one of the "top guys" not go to his pocket when many others would, you understand his rationale, the risk he is taking, and can see how he is trying to mitigate that risk. You don't always agree with it, but you can "see" it. But, in this game, it was just so inconsistent. He would completely ignore a couple of niggly cheap fouls of the type that professional players hate, but then penalise/caution an offence that no one cared about. And, that is what gets players frustrated - we often criticise their knowledge/understanding of LotG, but they KNOW the types of challenges that need to be dealt with. So, it was not that he was missing things, or letting "stuff" go; it was that he was missing the "wrong things", the things that players need to see getting picked up on.
In his last 23 Ligue 1 games, Brisard issued 6 or more cards in only two of them (including this PSG - OM match).
Apologies, I got my wires crossed - I have too many balls in the air, obviously! Domestically, Brisard's average is actually closer to 4 cards per game. It is in UEFA competition that he is at 6+ - having issued 64 cards in 10 games.
I realize that USYS Midwest Conference U 16 girls is a world away from a Top 5 league derby, but I can only use my own experience. In this game, I had three hard challenges in the first five minutes. First one was clean, but definitely physical. The second one was a foul, and I said something to the players around the foul that things needed to be cleaned up. Third foul happened about two minutes later. After checking on the injured player, I cautioned the third offender. The team's coaches were beside themselves about a card being issued, but the game was noticeably calmer all the way around after that. Honestly, I probably could have cautioned the second challenge, but I tried to manage that. The managing didn't work, but the card did. I didn't come close to issuing a caution the other 75 minutes. For me, two lessons were 1) be ready for chippy stuff from the first whistle you blow and 2) if the card is needed, use it. Again, I know I'll never do a PSG-Marseille match in my lifetime, but I learned it again on Saturday.
Thanks for the WC 2002 shoutout! Collina obviously had quite excellent competencies as a referee, but like Rizzoli I find it hard to forgive them for closing their eyes in their respective WC Finals. Anyway... I watched the Paris - Marseille game, I'll copy-paste what I sent to someone about it: - A game like this is quite impossible to referee, we shouldn't blame the referee too much. - Brisard's manner unfortunately tripped him up, not arousing respect nor trust from the players, who stopped seeing his refereeing as a force for good on the pitch (see López Nieto in CMRGER). - Brisard's confidence in his own perception wasn't high anyway (first YC was wrong) but it visibly lowered after 15mins, and it made him look like an idiot (Neymar's dive for one caution was clearly to try and visibly (show he could) f*** Brisard, and the referee obliged). His technical accuracy was too low, especially in the first half. - Neymar and the Marseille defender involved in contretemps would both have been sent off at WC 2006 (DtR and then AB push), which would have prevented the mass confrontation; in the event, Brisard saw (nearly) everything very well. - Dí Maria had to be sent off for his tackle as an attack at 75', he was only booked. - A missed freekick (and consequent SYC to a Marseille player) for handling in the 2H, correctly not given penalty at 2'. - VAR François Letexier incorrectly confirmed the decision to disallow an onside Marseille second goal! FFF have confirmed that Letexier was too quick to confirm. What a mistake... To improve -> develop confidence in your own perception (time!!!), his style is perfect for a manner comparable to Wolfgang Stark, but a Stark-ish presentation without confident manner / decisions is always going to leave you isolated and in danger of a result as happened here.
Yes this is an excellent point. It seems people forget how doctrinal this is - currently it's the CL / EL Qualifiers, of course UEFA don't sell the rights to these games, but people are surprised that clear SFPs still don't result in RCs, the same as CL KO stage. UEFA's (it was FIFA's first) vision trickles down even where it is not really helpful or even needed. But that actually wasn't the problem this time (France's officiating is one of the best IMO, not afraid to eject players even nowadays) it was of course the players, plus Brisard's manner and then decisions.
The reverse fixture will be led by Benoit Bastien. He has handled the Clasico five times, resulting in five defeats for Marseille. http://www.leparisien.fr/sports/foo...-agace-les-marseillais-05-02-2021-8423462.php
Make it six. He almost got through this one with a red, but he had one in the 90th minute on a no-doubt karate kick and only three yellows outside of that.