newt or cap: could you move the VAR-related posts form this tread to everyone's favourite thread? things getting mixed up ... muchas gracias in ...erm ... advance-o.
Yup if you can't support us when we lose (or don't play up to your vast expectations) don't support us when we win. We've got yoots and newer/fringe players being asked to step up / do more. Ain't going to work well all the time. Some people just have to deal with it. We're going through a tough stretch.
The good thing about this match is jut how farcical the implementation of VAR is in England (and not necessarily the rest of the world.) And it's not just that but the inconsistency of its implementation across a number of games.
Let's hope Neco has half a brain (or has someone advising him with half a brain) and doesn't read anything on social media. I know I've beat this horse to death but I'll never understand celebrities who read social media comments. Hell, there's a good argument that no one should read social media comments. That's why I'm glad sites like this still exist, so we can have a (semi) civilized conversation without random trolls and bots weighing in. Lastly, before I turn the page on this bitter pill of a match, does anyone else (besides tips) feel like Minamino might be as useful as a chocolate kettle?
agree 100%. it's at the point where the downside is > upside IMO. I don't use any of the social sites except this. in the first 15 mins yesterday I was very impressed, but he then seemed to disappear. he does that a lot but to be fair so does Bobby in many games. hard to see him clicking any time soon, but he's gonna get minutes to prove us wrong in the next few weeks anyway until Ox is fit - then Mini will be on the bench big time.
I think Taki is probably too lightweight for the premier league. Technically he's got all the right skills but he loses most 50/50 challenges and is regularly muscled off the ball by bigger stronger defenders. In his defense he's not been given a proper run of games to prove himself but having said that he's yet to shown me anything to convince he's good enough for Liverpool.
It's more mental than physical, I'd say. He just lacks conviction and seems not to know what to in may situations. He's a good player and will get the chance to press is case soon. I still think there were worse [individual] performances yesterday than him (and Williams, for that matter.)
I understand your frustration Sam but until VAR is dealt with, the players need to adjust. Hendo actually asked his team mates to adjust to the new reality. Make a conscious effort not to invite a review, while in the box, learn to play with your hands close to your body. As for Robbo, he did catch Welbeck's foot, sans VAR it would not have mattered but here we are. If a player falls, they will check, period. Slow motion makes every foul worse, contact happen all the time. I actually blame the ref, he could have said I saw it and did not deem it significant, he was not forced to call a pen.
He did not but congratulating Des Kelly on Milner's injury is OTT. He also needs to totally turn a deaf ear to Sheffield United's manager, he is not worth it.
Another point about Neco... If you would have asked Klopp and his staff before the season, what is the plan if Trent gets hurt? I doubt the answer would have been Neco Williams. I bet the plan would have been to solve the issue with our abundance of central midfielders. Not just Milner, but it could have been Hendo, Gini, Ox, or even Fabinho. We started the season with Thiago, Fabinho, Henderson, Wijnaldum, Keita, Milner, Oxlade-Chamberlain, and Jones as central midfield options. You could come up with hundreds of different combinations for a midfield 3, and none of them would have been Gini, Milner, and Minamino. We are already using Fabinho to solve the problem at CB, and all of the injuries don’t allow us to use a midfielder to solve our problem at right back. That means that a 19 year old who isn’t ready is being thrown into the role.
Lol, are you saying Robbo did nothing wrong? Without VAR, yes but with it, no. Penalties happen in a game but being cognizant of the fact that VAR is watching, should make defenders extra careful and that includes their hands placement in the box.
Blues and Spurs 0-0, the table tightens but we remain level on points at the top. I feel a little better that I did yesterday, lol.
yes I'm saying he did nothing wrong. I'll ask for the third time .... are you saying Robbo should have not cleared the ball, for fear of an attacker getting touched?
Like I said earlier penalties happen. he cleared the ball but unfortunately for him, there was contact with the player. Pre VAR good D but with VAR, when a player goes down, there is a check and slow motion confounds everything. It does not reflect the intensity. I am not sure what we are arguing about, lol. My point was players need to be more aware in the box to avoid penalties. If the Brighton player from the Fab incident was onside, that would have been arguing about another pen. VAR called Robbo's a penalty and whether we like it or not, it is over and likely to be called again in the future as long as VAR remains. Lets agree to agree that VAR is useless but players need to adapt till it is fixed or removed.
Still, he played a game winning ball yesterday to Salah, which due to the vagaries of god giving people different length feet for video referees to measure we were disallowed .... So, jury's out for me. He actually played okay yesterday.
I've re-watched this a few times. The more I see it the more I can see that the ref is conning himself as well as the rest of us. If anything, Welbeck fouls Robertson. Welbeck is aimlessly attempting to touch the ball from a very unnatural angle which must be obvious to himself that he has to get in Robertson's foot's way. (That for me makes it a 50-50 likelihood of a collision where a ref might call a foul). The reason a clear thinking ref then wouldn't call a foul when viewing the monitor is that he can see that Welbeck couldn't possibly gain control of that ball's trajectory without interfering with Robertson. However, the added problem is that he (the ref) didn't initially see anything which would have been worth contemplating further (until the idiots up above informed him otherwise). If anything that's a foul by Welbeck on Robertson. But for me it's nothing but a 50-50. The subsequent falling down helped con the ref. It raises another question- What is the rule now subsequent to this? That it's now okay to just try to block any swinging leg whenever a player feels like it - then fall down and get afree no matter where the ball is. Don't even go for the ball? Nuts. OR Think of it this way - if Welbeck did that same move to Robertson on the ground in between robertson's dribbling touches in a robertson run, it would be called ... wait for it ... a trip. Also known as putting your foot in the way of the opposing player's locomotion. Why is it any different just because the ball happens to be under Robertson's arc of control in the air - which it most definitely was? Very bad call. And a ridiculous assist to the badness by VAR, as any half-trained ref should have seen that that incident was not necessary to further assess. It's obvious unless you start to twist it about in your mind. The problem is that they don't seem to be able to take the required length of time that it would take to come to this conclusion (that there likely has been a clear/obvious error) before going ahead and notifying the on-field ref .... So, they instead react almost immediately, and throw a likelihood of possible decision (which they haven't actually made) at the on-field ref who has earlier made what he believes is the opposite decision to what they are suggesting ..... It's a Catch-22 of bullsh!t....
I'd agree with that in general Lem, but for the fact that there is no way to be more aware when swinging your leg to clear a bouncing or airborne ball, other than to not swing it.... Which is silly. See my post above for more detail on why I think it's not even a foul anyway, as if you do the same to a running player (interfere with his foot's trajectory to reach the ball) you are 99% of the time fouling him...... The ref here wasn't capable of thinking clearly about what he was viewing IMO.
But he couldn't get any advantage or control of the ball by touching it - and this is the point that really matters when someone is sticking his foot into a pointlessly dangerous situation like that. If I do a high kick near an opposing player's head and touch the ball it is still a dangerous high kick, whether I touch the ball or not. By the same token I don;t think I've ever see a slide tackle not called as a foul if it was done between the foot and ball (usually to get away with a slide tackle you need to get the ball on the side or the front), this would be irrespective of whether the fouling foot managed to touch/push the ball before tripping the player or not. It's the same principle - or it should be.
Not worried. Same as Sane’s rant last year. It’s all good, he wants to play and win, and he thinks if he’s playing that is more likely to happen, that’s all
Have to say, I agree... I imagine he may be trying to run interference for his players, but he needs to focus on the VAR nonsense, when warranted. Yes, the schedule is insane, but this affects all EPL teams. We have more games, which affects us more because we haven’t invested in the same size of first team as others. So I understand why he’s bitching about it. Unless he’s making a stink to free up more funds for reinforcements, I don’t understand why he’s doing this. Bad luck is bad luck. Other teams will suffer as well.
Listen, VAR, in theory is fine - I’m all for it. Correct adjudication of controversial calls... who might oppose that? VAR in practice in the EPL, is not the same. VAR in the EPL is a disjointed application of video review, that apparently is dependent upon the subjective decision of the VAR official’s inclination to intervene in the on-field decision of a fellow referee. Upon that tenuous foundation, there is the question of whether the referee then looks at the replay, or decides to rely default on the already subjective decision for the VAR referee to report a potential disagreement. Based on this completely flawed foundation, is there any reason to believe this addition to existing adjudication is going to simplify, or, justify, refereeing decisions? Again I say, either get rid of the referees that are afraid to contravene their peers (or admit miscall). Or get rid of VAR as it is currently being implemented.