Ok then, so lets take Pauleta's goals from this world cup's qualifying round. Would Portugal have made it to where it is now? A big fat NO right people?
Ah...so Rui Costa is immune from being questioned on his goal scoring abilities but when he scores...ah yes.
I think that Pauleta being the best EVER Portuguese NT player is a little too extreme. I mean, he is a great goal scorer, we can't take that away from him, but take a guy like Eusebio - he never got the opportunity to pad his stats by playing against the Liechtensteins, Luxembourgs and Eastern European nations that once comprised the Soviet Union. It kinda depends on how you look at their careers. If you take it strictly on a goal scoring mechanism, then Pauleta is your guy, I suppose. Then again, you could poll 100 people and ask for their top 10 all-time NT players, and you'd get 100 different lists, for sure. Different strokes for different folks...
Now your getting carried away ,,,an inform Jorge Cadete over Pauleta.....Yeah ok..... Cadete was great in one team only,Celtic Glasgow,and were not exactly talking about the most competitive league ,are we? We did garbage at Celta Vigo ,did very little in Italy ,useless at Benfica....Grabage at E.AMADORA....... Pauleta great goal scorer every team he played ,except his second season at Deportivo.....
That summed it up for me. WC2002 He killed a shell shocked Poland outside of that game every other amjor Tourney has resulted in no goals for Pauleta. Sure he's got the most goals.....But he did it in more games vs far weaker teams then what Eusebio had to deal with. He's playing extremely well right now and I can honestly say I've never had as much faith in Pauleta as I do right now. But I would put him in the top 10 all time for Portugal not #1.
I actually would say YES!!! He scored 1 goal in the 2-0 victory against Latvia. We would won 1-0 He scored 1 goal in the 7-1 victory against Russia. We would have won 6-1 He scored 2 goals in the 3-0 victory against Latvia. We would have won 1-0 He scored 1 goal in the 2-1 victory against Liet. We would have tied 1-1 He scored 2 goals in the 6-0 victory against Lux. We would have won 4-0 He scored 2 goals in the 5-0 victory against Lux. We would have won 3-0 He scored 1 goal in the 2-2 tie against Liet. We would have lost 2-1. He scored 1 goal in the 4-0 victory against Estonia. We would have won 3-0. So intead of 30 points we would have finished with 29, still first in the group.
I don't know about "We would have won" in the above games. Sure the 7-1 and 5-0 victories ok but without Pauleta's goals in the above who knows how it might of influenced the team. Scoring a second goal in a 1-0 game changes it a lot.
You are the one that said if we removed the goals, would we be in the WC? So that is what i did. It's not my problem you don't like the stats. All his goals were against small teams. Even Postiga or Nuno would have score had they been there. I just showed you the facts and against facts there are no arguments.
It just seems Portugal's greatest goal scorerer doesn't even get a top 10 ranking by some. Yet the only hard facts seem to be that Eusebio has a better strike ratio. Other than that it's just opinions by mainly Benfica fans. Such as Rui Costa is a midfielder and hence immune from comparison or Eusebio played tougher opposition without naming who the opposition was. It seems Eusebio is ranked number 1, god knows who's ranked 2-10 and Pauleta somewhere outside our galaxy.
Well in that case can you also add Eusebio's 66 world cup qualifying stats so that we can take his goals away according to your logic. Where are these stats for Eusebio by the way?
first you can't compare the teams we play for the world cup and Euro with the teams we face in the 50's, 60's, 70's early 80's the East bloc nations didn't exist, also in those years the national teams played around 6 to 8 games a year, compare to today 12 to 18 games , because of travelling costs. if Eusebio had played against Latvia, Estonia, Liechestein, etc he would had score another 100 to 200 goals.
Pauleta is worth top 10....but not number one. You also have said Pauleta is n1, just because of his goals, and i have showed you that without them we went to the Euro final and we would have been in this WC06 anyways. This is your opinion, i respect yours, so respect ours. p.s. By the way you forgot to say that we don't like Pauleta because he is from Acores. You missed that in your previous post.
by the way Eusebio was not even a striker, in his day he had, Jose Aguas, later Jose Torres, Artur Jorge, I would pick any of this guys anytime over Pauleta here goes my top 5 1. Eusebio [Benfica] 2. Jose Aguas [Benfica] 3. Peroteyo [Sporting] 4. Matateu [Belenenses] 5. Fernando Gomes [FC Porto
Eusebio's opposition was Brazil and England in 66 and the best teams in Europe during Benfica's championship runs. As far as Rui Costa, he scored 26 goals in 94 games as a midfielder (not a striker) for Portugal. In my opinion, that's much more impressive since it's not his primary job to score. Then you take into account that as far as skill and overall play, he's was miles better than Pauleta and has won bigger trophies.
Look may dad's a Benfica fan and Eusebio means the world to him but I can't ask him to show me stats because he doesn't have that type of know how so it would be disrespectful of me. In a forum such as this I do however expect something more tangible other than blind faith. Goal ratios, total goals scored...anything as long as it's consistent data so Pauleta and any other Portuguese player can be compared to. Otherwise it's all blind faith. Is it fair that one day Cristiano is remembered as a great player because of his flair while players of a different style like Pauleta who actually get the job done receive no recognition at all?
Pauleta has failed to score goals in important games: Up till 2004 ,or actually before the Euro 2004 Pauletas only 2 important goals were vs Holland... He scored in the 2-2 game in Porto for the WC 2002 . And scored 1 goal in the 2-0 win over Holland in Rotterdam...If he hadnt scored we would of won the game anyway..... He than scored 1 goal vs Brasil in a friednly also in Porto ,and 3 goals in the Wc vs Poland.... Heres a list of games he has failed to score up till April of 2004. Armenia 3-1 win -1998 wcq Germany 1-1 tie in 1998 WCS Northern Ireland 1-0 Wcq Israel 1998 ,2-0 win Friendly Holland 0-0 tie friendly Liechstein 5-0 win Euro 2000 qualification Azerbaijan 1-1 tie Euro 2000 Romania 1-1 tie Euro 2000 Hungary 3-0 Euro 2000,SAW A RED CARD Denmark 2-1 win ,Prior to Euro 2000(how can i forget that Figo goal on Scheimchel) Italy 2-0 loss Wales 3-0 win Germany 3-0 win ,Euro 2000,Conceicao hatrick Estonia 3-1 WIN wcq Ireland 1-1 tie WCQ Israel 2-1 win friendly France 4-0 loss -friendly ireland -1-1 tie WCQ 2002 mOLDAVIA 3-0 WIN Angola 6-1 win Spain 1-1 tie Finland 4-1 loss Usa 3-2 loss South Korea 1-0 loss England 1-1 Sweden 3-2 win Italy 1-0 loss Macedonia 1-0 win Holland 1-1 tie Paraguai 0-0 tie Bolivia 4-0 win Cazaqastan 1-0 win Spain 3-0 loss Norway 1-0 win Italy 2-1 loss Plus 0 goals at EURO 2004 Pauleta has only scored on 2 really powerfull teams .Holland 2 goals and Brasil 1 goal.....
Yes but some say Rui Costa has been mediocre since his arrival at AC Milan. On the other hand Pauleta has been consistent for PSG many years running and has been voted French player of the year twice.
here are some stastics check about Jose Aguas, he lift the CL twice, Eusebio once https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=88763&page=3
"Receiving recognition" and saying he is the greatest Portuguese player is very different. Everyone here respects Pauleta and have all agreed he is good striker. He is not however, the greatest Portuguese player.
Well his career is winding down but if you actually watched Milan play, you would see that the old man still has a lot of quality and could still be a starter on most teams in Italy. What keeps him out of the starting lineup is an amazing player named Kaka. Also Serie A >>> Ligue 1
Rui Costas 1st year at AC MILAN was a disaster,in the 1st game of the league he broke his wrist and hand...Ws never the same after that for the entire season,played in the wc ,scored 1 goal vs Poland.... Has gotten a lot better at Ac Milan,but dont forget hes in his 30s and the arrival of KAKA didnt exactly help,however everytime he comes off the bench hes very influential...... I have all the stats for Pauleta ,as i just got done reading his autobiography,any questions just ask.....
Do a search in on this forum, you'll find Eusebio's career stats, Frank Cunha has posted them before.
Thanks Frank, now we're talking. See I never knew Jose Aguas lifted more CL cups than Eusebio. This is what I'm talking about. Where is Jose Aguas ranked in Portugal's greatest players ever and why? Is he 2nd, 3rd. All you hear is Eusebio and stuff every other Portuguese player.