PBP: P01135809 Trump Espionage, Coup, Conspiracy, Racketeering, Fraud & Obstruction Trial Thread

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by The Jitty Slitter, Jun 10, 2023.

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What will be the outcome?

  1. Guilty

  2. Not guilty

  3. Pardons himself

  4. Goes into exile in Snowden's flat

  5. Some other fascism

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  1. chaski

    chaski Moderator
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    Mar 20, 2000
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    #7301 chaski, May 16, 2024
    Debate could be held in Sing Sing.
     
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  2. Dr. Wankler

    Dr. Wankler Member+

    May 2, 2001
    The Electric City
    Club:
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    #7302 Dr. Wankler, May 16, 2024
    My prediction is that juror #2 (IIRC) will hang the jury.
     
  3. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    Tottenham Hotspur
    Aug 22, 2001
    Near the mountains.
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    #7303 soccernutter, May 16, 2024
    Just found an excuse to post the trailer.

     
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  4. JamesA

    JamesA Member+

    Dec 7, 2004
    Victoria
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    #7304 JamesA, May 17, 2024
    If they convict, I think Trump gets a shortish sentence. A year to 18 months type thing.

    But, I'm concerned this will be a hung jury and retrial, after November.
     
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  5. Sounders78

    Sounders78 Member+

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    #7305 Sounders78, May 17, 2024

    I would be very surprised if he goes to jail. House arrest maybe, but not jail.
     
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  6. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    Tottenham Hotspur
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    Near the mountains.
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    Tottenham Hotspur FC
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    #7306 soccernutter, May 17, 2024
    I think when we all say jail or prison, it is some alternate to what we traditionally think of as jail or prison. He may be under "house arrest," but I can imagine, it being New York, that may not be a house of his choosing, and his movements will be restricted. As will be his access to a cell phone.
     
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  7. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    Jun 16, 1999
    Big City Blinking
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    #7307 yossarian, May 17, 2024
    Arguably, the prosecution could introduce a video clip of the statement directly into evidence, and then recall a witness who previously testified about the NDA for impeachment purposes. As for admissibility, it's not much different than situations in which a criminal defendant gives a voluntary statement to the police about the alleged crime but then doesn't testify at trial. That statement is admissible.
     
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  8. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
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    #7308 Yoshou, May 17, 2024
    I was watching TikTok last night and a criminal defense attorney that defends cases in the same building Trump is being tried in said that for an elderly, high profile, first time offender, that is convicted of a non-violent felony, she expects AT MOST community service and something like a deferment for jail time/probation that disappears if he keeps his nose clean for a year.
     
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  9. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    #7309 diablodelsol, May 17, 2024
    Is that a typical sentence for someone who goes to trial, takes zero responsibility for the crime they are convicted of, repeatedly attacks the judge, jury, prosecutors, their family etc before, during and after the trial? Cause most people that get low sentences don’t act like this….no?
     
  10. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    #7310 soccernutter, May 17, 2024
    Has that attorney worked in Merchan's court? It has been reported that Merchan is relatively tough on white collar crimes.
     
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  11. soccernutter

    soccernutter Moderator
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    #7311 soccernutter, May 17, 2024
    In this case, I think it is Daniels who testified about the NDA already. If the statement was admitted into court, would she need to reappear, or would her previous testimony be good enough to impeach Trump?
     
  12. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
    Seattle
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    #7312 Yoshou, May 17, 2024
    Dunno about that. Just that she is an experienced NYC defense attorney and has experience with NY sentencing. It sounded like the big things with Trump is that he would be a first time offender and the crime is non-violent.
     
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  13. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    Jun 16, 1999
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    #7313 yossarian, May 17, 2024
    It depends on how her testimony was framed in the initial direct. Often, the witness would be recalled if for no other reason than it drives the point home to have them testify again, specifically rebutting what TFG said in front of cameras.
     
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  14. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    #7314 diablodelsol, May 17, 2024
    But that’s the thing… I thought the defense was trying to raise doubts about whether Trump was actually party to the NDA (it was executed under a pseudonym). That this was all a rogue underling attorney trying to impress his boss and Trump had no idea what was going on. Trump stated on camera that he was. How would the prosecution get that in now?
     
  15. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    Jun 16, 1999
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    #7315 yossarian, May 17, 2024
    Admit the tape into evidence and play it for the jury.
     
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  16. diablodelsol

    diablodelsol Member+

    Jan 10, 2001
    New Jersey
    #7316 diablodelsol, May 17, 2024
    Ok. So nobody needs to be testifying about evidence? You can just roll tape? That makes sense and I have no idea why in my mind that isn’t a thing. Dick Wolf skips over shit like that.
     
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  17. song219

    song219 BigSoccer Supporter

    Apr 5, 2004
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    #7317 song219, May 17, 2024
    It doesn’t make for great tv drama.
     
  18. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    #7318 taosjohn, May 17, 2024
    Any tape that once and for all pins Donald Trump to something he said or did and then denied would be the greatest tv drama I could ask for.

    "Greatest" as in biggest, "greatest" as in best, "greatest" as in most historic; make tv drama great again, please please please.
     
  19. ElNaranja

    ElNaranja Member+

    Houston Dynamo
    United States
    Jul 16, 2017
    #7319 ElNaranja, May 17, 2024
    If there were a tape of him talking about he was in active coordination with the Proud Boys to assassinate all members of Congress and Pence for not supporting him, I still wouldn't believe that would send him to jail. The system just ain't set up to send a former president to jail. And all the corruption in the judicial system and DoJ's institutional bias.
     
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  20. yossarian

    yossarian Moderator
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    Jun 16, 1999
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    #7320 yossarian, May 17, 2024
    Last edited: May 17, 2024
    Usually you have a witness testifying about the evidence you're introducing, yes. That's why in my reply to Nutter, I said the prosecution could recall Daniels or anyone else who was privy to the NDA, to rebut what TFG says on the tape. But there are situations in which demonstrative evidence speaks for itself.

    Edit: I'll add even without Daniels, you'd have to have a witness authenticate the tape, but that's very nuts and bolts procedural. Q. Mr. X, did you film said remarks by TFG? A. Yes. Q. Is this video an accurate depiction of what you saw/filmed? A. Yes. Q. Your honor, I move to admit.....
     
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  21. Yoshou

    Yoshou Fan of the CCL Champ

    May 12, 2009
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    #7321 Yoshou, May 17, 2024
    If the defense wanted to counter it, they could have Trump testify to what he meant..
     
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  22. The Jitty Slitter

    The Jitty Slitter Moderator
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    Jul 23, 2004
    Fascist Hellscape
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    #7322 The Jitty Slitter, May 18, 2024
    as Yoss says, usually you need the correct witness to admit the exhibit. eg a police officer will bring in a whole lot of exhibits of stuff they amassed during the investigation. but frequently to streamline criminal trials a bunch of these things are agreed before hand to avoid wasting so much time on things that are clearly coming in.
     
  23. superdave

    superdave BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
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    United States
    #7323 superdave, May 18, 2024
    Rudy Giuliani has been dodging process servers who have been trying to give him docs related to his indictment in Arizona for election rigging. He finally got served, at his 80th birthday party. Heh heh heh
     
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  24. taosjohn

    taosjohn Member+

    Dec 23, 2004
    taos,nm
    #7324 taosjohn, May 18, 2024
    To paraphrase Swift (Taylor, not Jonathan) "Look What You Made Us Do!"
     
  25. superdave

    superdave BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
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    #7325 superdave, May 18, 2024
    Can this story get better? Yes it can.

    He was served a few hours after tweeting that they couldn’t arrest him if they couldn’t find him that day.

     
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