PBP: P01135809 Trump Espionage, Coup, Conspiracy, Racketeering, Fraud & Obstruction Trial Thread

soccernutter · Feb 22, 2024

diablodelsol said: ↑

Not only does he not have it on hand….I’d bet that’s more than his net assets.
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As I've been saying, the merger of Digital Acquisitions (a SPAC) and Trump Media was approved by the SEC last week. Trump has 78m shares which at a price of this posting (45.51) gives him a bit more than $3.5b. Now, he can't sell for 6 months unless given special permission by the board of Digital Acquisitions (DWAC), but while his cash on hand is almost certainly less than $550m, in six months with all is properties as well as the shares in DWAC, he will have plenty of assets.

https://www.reuters.com/markets/dea...way-merger-with-trumps-media-firm-2024-02-15/

The value assigned to the deal by the stock market has jumped more than threefold since January, as Trump tightened his grip on the Republication nomination for president. Trump will own between 58.1% and 69.4% of the combined company, depending on the extent to which investors back the deal.
...
Digital World shares rose 16% to $50.49 in afternoon trading in New York on Thursday. At this stock price, and assuming no Digital World shareholders exercised the right to redeem their shares, the combined company would be worth about $10 billion and Trump would own a 58.1% stake worth about $4 billion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2024/02/15/truth-social-trump-merger-sec/

The approval is a victory for Trump, who will hold more than 78 million shares in the post-merger company, a filing shows — a stake that, at current prices, would be worth nearly $4 billion. Trump, who would own between 58 and 69 percent of the company, and other investors could earn tens of millions more shares through a provision, known as an “earnout,” tied to the stock’s performance, a filing said.

Someone is going to buy him. Probably openly. And Republicans still won’t care.
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I suspect this is probably true, but that it has not already happened does raise questions for me. In this context, the issue I think Trump has is not just that he is toxic, but that he will bring in incompetent people who will end up being just as toxic (if not already toxic). That is the huge difference with Biden, who does and will continue to have highly competent people around him.

soccernutter · Feb 22, 2024

superdave said: ↑

Just within the last week, someone posted in this forum that Trump got billions from the selling of stock in one of his companies. Might have been the one behind TrithSocial. I am not “vouching” for that just pointing out you may be wrong.
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Hi

ceezmad · Feb 22, 2024

Yoshou said: ↑

I have no idea how he could have gotten billions worth of stock for TruthSocial... that thing is worth approximately $1.
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Could be a way for a billionaire to buy him.

The Jitty Slitter · Feb 22, 2024

IIRC trump's financial position was put into evidence. He has sold a number of assets recently.

soccernutter · Feb 22, 2024

The Jitty Slitter said: ↑

IIRC trump's financial position was put into evidence. He has sold a number of assets recently.
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I assume one of which is E Jean Carroll Tower, located at 725 5th Ave, New York, NY 10022.

diablodelsol · Feb 22, 2024

soccernutter said: ↑

Hi
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Saw it previously but didn’t get a chance to respond. At best he can use this as collateral to secure a loan to post bond. The individual(s) that do this will either be 1)incredibly ********ing stupid people who ain’t getting it back (and will deserve it) or 2)people who want to buy trump. Either way…those people have toe more Fridays to make their decision.

The Jitty Slitter · Feb 22, 2024

lol

Earlier in 2019, U.S. intelligence had warned the white house IN WRITING that Giuliani, in his drive for information about the Bidens, was communicating with Russian assets. 6/
— Mueller, She Wrote (@MuellerSheWrote) February 22, 2024

Yoshou · Feb 22, 2024

The Jitty Slitter said: ↑

lol

Earlier in 2019, U.S. intelligence had warned the white house IN WRITING that Giuliani, in his drive for information about the Bidens, was communicating with Russian assets. 6/
— Mueller, She Wrote (@MuellerSheWrote) February 22, 2024

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This brings me back to whether the Bidens have a defamation case against Republicans. Even if Joe’s bar is higher, it is extremely clear that the Republican lies are done with malicious intent and that they knowing spread false information about the Biden’s.

Sounders78 · Feb 22, 2024

Yoshou said: ↑

This brings me back to whether the Bidens have a defamation case against Republicans. Even if Joe’s bar is higher, it is extremely clear that the Republican lies are done with malicious intent and that they knowing spread false information about the Biden’s.
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Not to mention being done specifically because of Biden's position.

yossarian · Feb 22, 2024

The Jitty Slitter said: ↑

Could be - i only dimly remember my torts class

But in this case Engoron states that the plaintiff was not required to show it. I'd cut and paste the relevant bit but scribd sucks

What i was mostly getting at is all the dorks posting internet lawyer takes where they clearly didn't read the judgement - which as we know is pretty much a cardinal sin of actual lawyering
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This Supreme Court case explains the difference...

In one sense, the Government is correct that the fraud statutes did not incorporate all the elements of common-law fraud. The common-law requirements of “justifiable reliance” and “damages,” for example, plainly have no place in the federal fraud statutes. By prohibiting the “scheme to defraud,” rather than the completed fraud, the elements of reliance and damage would clearly be inconsistent with the statutes Congress enacted. Neder v. U.S., 527 U.S. 1, 25 (1999) (footnotes omitted. ).

diablodelsol · Feb 22, 2024

Yoshou said: ↑

This brings me back to whether the Bidens have a defamation case against Republicans. Even if Joe’s bar is higher, it is extremely clear that the Republican lies are done with malicious intent and that they knowing spread false information about the Biden’s.
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Are statements made on Fox News covered by the speech and debate clause?

diablodelsol · Feb 22, 2024

New: Nathan Wade seeks to block his former attorney, Terrence Bradley, from providing further information to Judge McAfee behind closed doors.

Wade says that Bradley may “unlawfully” disclose attorney-client communications during his meeting w/ McAfee. https://t.co/fWpl8oEOGb
— Anna Bower (@AnnaBower) February 22, 2024

I remember reading this last week but forgot to ask….assuming Wade’s former partner tells the judge stuff that is 1)privileged, but 2)is sufficient to warrant his removal….can the judge really incorporate that information into his decision? Just doesn’t seem right. At a minimum shouldn’t another judge be the one reviewing this (similar to a special master)?

The Jitty Slitter · Feb 22, 2024

soccernutter said: ↑

As I've been saying, the merger of Digital Acquisitions (a SPAC) and Trump Media was approved by the SEC last week. Trump has 78m shares which at a price of this posting (45.51) gives him a bit more than $3.5b. Now, he can't sell for 6 months unless given special permission by the board of Digital Acquisitions (DWAC), but while his cash on hand is almost certainly less than $550m, in six months with all is properties as well as the shares in DWAC, he will have plenty of assets.

https://www.reuters.com/markets/dea...way-merger-with-trumps-media-firm-2024-02-15/

The value assigned to the deal by the stock market has jumped more than threefold since January, as Trump tightened his grip on the Republication nomination for president. Trump will own between 58.1% and 69.4% of the combined company, depending on the extent to which investors back the deal.
...
Digital World shares rose 16% to $50.49 in afternoon trading in New York on Thursday. At this stock price, and assuming no Digital World shareholders exercised the right to redeem their shares, the combined company would be worth about $10 billion and Trump would own a 58.1% stake worth about $4 billion.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2024/02/15/truth-social-trump-merger-sec/

The approval is a victory for Trump, who will hold more than 78 million shares in the post-merger company, a filing shows — a stake that, at current prices, would be worth nearly $4 billion. Trump, who would own between 58 and 69 percent of the company, and other investors could earn tens of millions more shares through a provision, known as an “earnout,” tied to the stock’s performance, a filing said.

I suspect this is probably true, but that it has not already happened does raise questions for me. In this context, the issue I think Trump has is not just that he is toxic, but that he will bring in incompetent people who will end up being just as toxic (if not already toxic). That is the huge difference with Biden, who does and will continue to have highly competent people around him.
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obviously he would not be able to dump large parts of his shareholding or it would collapse the price.

Yoshou · Feb 22, 2024

diablodelsol said: ↑

Are statements made on Fox News covered by the speech and debate clause?
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That is a great question that I don’t know the answer to! The clause specifically mentions speech on the floor of the House (and committees), so it could be argued that speech outside of the Congress would not be protected. On the other hand, they could also argue that they were performing their legislative duty to keep the public informed…

Yoshou · Feb 22, 2024

diablodelsol said: ↑

Are statements made on Fox News covered by the speech and debate clause?
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Although, it is worth noting that Republicans censured Adam Schiff and kicked him off the House Intelligence Committee for holding Trump's feet to the fire over things mentioned in the Steele Report.. I can only assume that in the next Congress, Republicans would be okay with Democrats censoring Jordan and Comer and stripping them of their Committee memberships since they have been relying upon information from the FBI form that was provided by Russian Intelligence.

The Jitty Slitter · Feb 22, 2024

Yoshou said: ↑

Although, it is worth noting that Republicans censured Adam Schiff and kicked him off the House Intelligence Committee for holding Trump's feet to the fire over things mentioned in the Steele Report.. I can only assume that in the next Congress, Republicans would be okay with Democrats censoring Jordan and Comer and stripping them of their Committee memberships since they have been relying upon information from the FBI form that was provided by Russian Intelligence.
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they should be investigated for treason!

Yoshou · Feb 22, 2024

The Jitty Slitter said: ↑

they should be investigated for treason!
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I think that wouldnpretty clearly be covered by the speech clause.

The Jitty Slitter · Feb 22, 2024

Yoshou said: ↑

I think that wouldnpretty clearly be covered by the speech clause.
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yeah i just wanted to go full resistance twitter for old times sake

The Jitty Slitter · Feb 22, 2024

yossarian said: ↑

This Supreme Court case explains the difference...

In one sense, the Government is correct that the fraud statutes did not incorporate all the elements of common-law fraud. The common-law requirements of “justifiable reliance” and “damages,” for example, plainly have no place in the federal fraud statutes. By prohibiting the “scheme to defraud,” rather than the completed fraud, the elements of reliance and damage would clearly be inconsistent with the statutes Congress enacted. Neder v. U.S., 527 U.S. 1, 25 (1999) (footnotes omitted. ).
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thanks that makes sense.

Yoshou · Feb 22, 2024

All of this being said, it does show how much the US relies upon honest actors in the government.

diablodelsol · Feb 22, 2024

So they judge shopped and re arrested him on the same charges? That doesn’t seem like that’s how it’s supposed to work

Smirnov back in custody... is the 2nd arrest warrant in response to Weiss' application for review of his release? https://t.co/6eFtkzuUkT
— Mueller, She Wrote (@MuellerSheWrote) February 22, 2024

taosjohn · Feb 22, 2024

diablodelsol said: ↑

So they judge shopped and re arrested him on the same charges? That doesn’t seem like that’s how it’s supposed to work

Smirnov back in custody... is the 2nd arrest warrant in response to Weiss' application for review of his release? https://t.co/6eFtkzuUkT
— Mueller, She Wrote (@MuellerSheWrote) February 22, 2024

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Really just variations on the stuff Brummie forsaw, no? He can be turned into a human ping-pong ball by opposing sides' judges...

soccernutter · Feb 22, 2024

diablodelsol said: ↑

Saw it previously but didn’t get a chance to respond. At best he can use this as collateral to secure a loan to post bond. The individual(s) that do this will either be 1)incredibly ********ing stupid people who ain’t getting it back (and will deserve it) or 2)people who want to buy trump.
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Yeah, that is my thinking as well.

Either way…those people have toe more Fridays to make their decision.
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I think he would have $550m in assets, so it seems strange he has not yet put up the money. Maybe it just takes more time than I am thinking. Or maybe nobody wants to do business with him.

soccernutter · Feb 22, 2024

The Jitty Slitter said: ↑

obviously he would not be able to dump large parts of his shareholding or it would collapse the price.
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I was thinking he could use it as collateral.

dapip · Feb 22, 2024

soccernutter said: ↑

I think he would have $550m in assets, so it seems strange he has not yet put up the money. Maybe it just takes more time than I am thinking. Or maybe nobody wants to do business with him.
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Or maybe he really doesn’t want to lose more money.