Dude, we've been down this road before. And what you're banging on about has nothing to do with the issue at hand. You know, there was a time when both western continents were known as America. In fact, there are those who still view them as one continent. Well, back in the olden days, several British colonies were set up in an area that the Europeans referred to as America. Virginia, Massachusetts Bay Colony and Providence Plantations were but a few of those many colonies. Georgia, the Carolinas, New York, Pennsylvania and Maryland were others. Those colonies were distinct political entities, though governed and overseen by Britain. And then one day, many of those colonies declared their independence. Rhode Island and North Carolina declared their independence before the other colonies. Anway, after they united to fight their war for independence, they decided to unite. (Our country was unique in the New World in that regard; before Ecuador, Venezuela and, eventually, Panama broke away from Gran Colombia, colonies in British North America were uniting) And they chose a name for their new state that reflected its confederate nature, The United States of America. They were states, they were united and they all were located in America. Through the decades and then centuries, a national identity finally developed. To make a long story short, we ended getting stuck with being called Americans because the name of our country was a bit vague, but reflective of the continental and federal nature of the growing nation. It wasn't done to crank up people in Uruguay. So, just as a Yankee can be someone from the United States, more specifically someone from the North, more specifically still someone from New England and even more specifically someone descended from the settlers of New England, "American" has several uses and meanings. I know that it pisses you off and that it's a perennial gripe down there, but I think you're going to have to live with it, just as we have to live with "gringo" and "anglo". Bom. It's time for the Mexicans to stop pointing the finger at others and start dedicating themselves to improving their behavior and image. Various Styles' friends over in England and Holland have set up supporters' groups with ambassadorial missions. What's stopping Mexico from doing the same?
Fine, you want to treated like an animal, you do that. What do you want me to say to the Mexican woman sitting behind me who needed medical attention because she was hit in the shoulder with something? Passion is one thing. Before the showers began, as the stadium was screaming "MEXICO MEXICO!!" my wife turned and said this is how soccer is supposed to be. That is great. That is one reason I went to the game. The debris showers I could do without. If you want barbarity, YOU stick to bull fighting. Two more points. (1) I know it was not everyone at the game. But there was alot of debris coming down. The Urugyuans could not even take a corner kick. How is that soccer? (2) With respect to refering to citizens of the United States as "Americans" -- the use of the term actually predates independence. Johnathan Swift used it in the 1710s to refer to an inhabitant of the English colonies of the Eastern seaboard, and may have even been used in that context before that. I am also informed that it was also used by the Spanish, but the Spanish tended to have a large number of terms for the inhabitants of Spanish America, based on where they were born and social class. The English tended to lump all "colonials" into one big group.
It appears you are talking about most any NFL stadium on any given Sunday, especially in the endzone seats after the visiting team scores a TD. Or, you could be talking about more than a few baseball crowds, especially near the visiting team's bullpen. You're right. . .it's a pattern of behavior by a certain group of people!
And people who do that? I call them animals too. In 1973, during the NLCS, Pete Rose slide very hard into Bud Harrelson. The next inning, as Rose went out to play left field, the Mets fans (and I am a Mets fan) began to shower Rose with debris. Security put a stop to it, and Tom Seaver also went out to left field to tell the fans to stop. That kind of behavior has not place in civilized society. And one more thing, let's cut the hyperbole about the Soldier Field getting "trashed." It was not trashed.
Somebody had to christen the place. It is now a full-fledged futbol stadium. You know, this sort of passion occurs so infrequently here you should relish the atmosphere when it does. God knows you're never going to experience it at an MLS match. I wish I was there, even if I am getting tired of watching Mexico lose. Hugo Sanchez, where are you?
I was at the same match and had to step in to help a Salvadoran kid whose sister was being subjected to the same treatment by my fellow American fans.
Sorry, but passion was the crowd reaming "MEXICO MEXICO!" Throwing debris such that the Uruguayans could not take c orner kicks, throwing thingsd such that a woman behind me needed attention to her shoulder is not passion, it is barbaric and animalistic behavior. Stop trying to defend the indefensible.
The most ironic thing of all is that Mexican fans in Mexico don't act nearly as barbaric as here in the US. Now, I've watched Argentina kick Mexico's ass time and time again in the LA Coliseum. Just like I expect Argentina to win every time, I expect the beer showers to come near the end of the match. Those of us who will continue to show up to games where Mexico (or Mexican teams) play in US venues, bring an umbrella with you because I guarantee 'showers' in the forecast. Now, on the 'American' issue, well, I don't expect anything from ignorant people. The same people who think everything south of the border, is Mexico.
Anthony, I completely agree. My point is, that kind of behavior is no where near restricted to Mexican soccer fans, although, from reading various posts, one might think otherwise. For another example, read todays USA Today (October 22).
Nacos????? We can watch euroteams fighting, trowing garbage, burning cars, been arrested , but and I repeat but, they are not NACOS they are not scumbags, they are not dregs...perhaps are we using a different standart to evaluate the situation or perhaps is because they are whites and live in Europe ? lets hear the experts now...
Re: Nacos????? Who are you kidding? What double standard? They are called hooligans, and civilized people find them repugnent.
When I go to a match I go to see the players play. I go to get excited, and yell, and cheer, and sing. At national team matches, I wear the flag. Now that I have moved to Canada, I wear a Canadian flag to Canadian games. I still wear the American flag to the USA's games. I am proud of my country, err countries. I'm not going to bring disrepute onto it by exceeding the bounds of reasonable behaviour. I've been at several games where fans did act unreasonably. I'm all for multiculturalism. When you are in Mexico, do as the Mexicans... When you attend any soccer game in the USA, any professional sporting event in the USA, you are expected to abide by the rules of the society you are in. It doesn't matter what they do "back home", whether back home is Guadalahara, San Juan, the swamps of NC, or Jolly Old England. If you break the rules, then you deserve the consequences. The players are not thugs, they don't want you throwing beer and whatever. They want to win on the field. They do not want what you do in the stands to be the difference. A home team advantage is enough, they don't want violence. Throwing anything is a violent act (except streamers, confetti and the like). If you throw things onto the pitch, not only do the players not want you there, we the American soccer fans don't want you there. And the American soccer establishment, such as it is, doesn't want you there. All MLS (or any other organization) has to do to is stop the game. If the corner taker gets a shower, clean out that area. Throw them right out of the stadium. Cause a riot? No way, the vast majority of the crowd came to watch the game and will be happy to see it continue. Fight in the stands? Arrest them. Multiple offender? Ban them. Violent fan behaviour has become a feature of too many matches. If the trend continues I hope MLS/US Soccer/FIFA will have some nards and step inj to clean it up. I don't believe MLS will have any choice, the league will fold shortly if the 'bad' fans run the kids and moms out of the stadium. It's sad to see the offenders identified as Mexican Fans, or Ticos, or Metrostars Fans. What they are, well, no use calling names. When they are fighting, throwing or abusing they are not fans. Fact is the fans are watching the game.