Kansas City vs Real Salt Lake (Sat Mar 26th, 6:00PM CT) [R]

Discussion in 'Sporting Kansas City' started by vividox, Mar 21, 2022.

  1. lukeD

    lukeD Member+

    Jul 7, 2011
    Olathe
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My expectations for this season were low and I listed my concerns with the roster multiple times in the offseason thread. I didn't (and still don't) believe enough was done to improve what was (and still is) a retched defense. Until that is addressed, they are going to have to win games by scoring 2 or 3 goals. Without the main threats up top, that isn't happening, but it might when they come back.

    I'm not freaking out, probably because I didn't think this roster offers much more than middle of the pack in the West as a ceiling.
     
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  2. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    so you don't think the sky is falling because it had already fallen, and this is just the inevitable and very messy aftermath? I agree, it's not worth freaking out over. but it does look like a long season of mediocrity. I was convinced out cieling to floor would be 3-7, but it's more like 7-11
     
  3. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    We had a great team last year and they invested in some crucial areas in the offseason, including a lot at the back line. It seemed like things would be trending at least pretty level... But Pulido is out and Ilie, who I've been a critic of for a while, is proving me an idiot.

    I know the quality of the midfield and the health of the forwards are the biggest questions in a lot of ways, but to me this season is going to hinge a lot on whether or not Pierre steps into the RB position and plays at an MLS level. And maybe we can get a bit of cheap reinforcements in the midfield in the summer window when there are more free agents floating around?
     
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  4. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    absolutely, unless Logan can also play RB.
     
  5. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I'm generally incredibly leery of fullbacks playing on the wrong side. Even top tier guys struggle on their far side.

    While Ndenbe and Duke might be able to spot RB, I don't see either as a long-term solution. And that's why I really feel Pierre hit his stride is the key to having a really good team balance. But who knows! I'm quite often very wrong.
     
  6. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Word is that Shelton, Salloi and Russell are training today. That doesn't mean they will be ready for the RSL game, but its a good sign they will be back soon.
     
  7. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    The other thing I have been wondering is ..... where is Voloder in his training? Is the guy anywhere near ready to see the field?
     
  8. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I don’t see why he wouldn’t, his been on the bench for every game this season.
     
  9. lukeD

    lukeD Member+

    Jul 7, 2011
    Olathe
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Objectively, SKC overachieved last year powered by career seasons from both Salloi and JFR. The defense was bad, and they overcame that by scoring a lot.

    The 2022 roster is basically the same as last years. They invested almost nothing in making the defense better, so you still need the offense to carry you. Our best attacking player is on IR. Unless Salloi and JFR both have career years again, I was/am fully prepared to watch what I have seen so far (multi goal losses).

    The start to this season, while disappointing, is not surprising. They still can't defend, PV still won't adjust to help his defense, and we don't have Salloi and JFR scoring goals because they are injured. When they come back, things will probably go back to looking more like last year.

    I include the No.6 in my backline. They "invested a lot" in the back line how? They got rid of the starting 6 and brought in a worse version of that same player. They are starting 3 of the same 4 from last year. The LB position is slightly improved but this is still a very unathletic and very below average group. How is this "investing a lot"?
     
  10. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    In that case, the way SKC has been leaking goals, I don’t think it could hurt to give him a try.
     
  11. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I think a problem we have is that the SKC possession game, and while it's not working Vermes clearly wants it to, depends upon Fontas. Look at all of our games, they run through him (though, i know, using run and Fontas in the same sentence is dubious). In all four games he has been connecting with at least 8 others, and with all 11 on at least one occassion. There really are not a lot of MLS players able to do that. His range of passes is kind of stunning, esp given his incredible completion rate. I can't imagine that Voldemort isn't a better defender, certainly if running is involved. But Fontas is central to everything we do with the ball. Take him out for a better defender who is okay with the ball, and our possession game collapses and we're left without an identity.
    I cringe every time Fontas has to run, but I'm not sure he alone is the problem. The problem is that he's so slow, but Roger isn't covering the ground he once did, and Kinda isn't there to cover ground, and Zusi has slowed to a crawl (faster than Fontas) and Walter isn't a speed merchant, but Uri is dead slow. Hernandez speed is meh. We've all played on a team that had to hide a slow guy, and it is possible. but you can't hide a slow 6 guys, and you really can't if you play a high line and try to hold possession, etc.
     
  12. Inca Roads

    Inca Roads Member+

    Nov 22, 2012
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    I don't know that you should. That's sort of just moving the goalposts to me. I totally agree they flubbed hard on the 6, but that's a problem in the midfield, not the backline.

    They signed a 3rd and 4th CB as well as a 1st and 2nd LB. Both Fontas and Isi are totally deserving of starting spots based on last year's performance and general quality, so I'm not gonna complain that they haven't been supplanted yet. But there is still plenty of time in the season for Ford or Voloder to step in, and I am positive they will do better on their 15-20 starts than Smith ever did (jury is out relative to Puncec, but I'm optimistic there too).

    It's early days, but the skill, attitude, and athleticism of Ndenbe are streets ahead of who he replaced, and calling him a "slight improvement" is a bit too blase. And I feel like I've been harping pretty hard on the excess of Zusi so far this season, though we absolutely know for a fact that he is being leaned on for his experience while the team find its footing. I said a few posts above that the success of this season depends pretty largely on if Pierre (or whoever steps into the starting RB position) really breaks good.

    I just think it's funny to look at Ndenbe or Isi and call them "very unathletic," or to find a player like Fontas "below average." I dunno, I think they spent well on the backline, and I think that will show in some ways. But I also think the backline quality will be frequently dinged by the softness of the midfield--no back line looks good when they're constantly getting turned and poached by second runners and free-running 10s. So we'll see on that.

    It's the midfield I'm very worried about, particularly if Pierre shows up. You're right that the 6 is a nightmare, and while I do like Walter and Kinda... there's more needed to be a defensively-competent squad.
     
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  13. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    For instance, insert a Joao Paulo level d-Mid, and we're having a very different discussion. If we had anticipated the Mauri implosion ( btw, is he still officially on the roster?) and snagged a Gregus on someone of that ilk as an 8, meaning Walter is a perma-6, the discussion would be different. If roger were five years younger, I'd feel okay about coming out of this.but right now, with Kinda still out, we lack a 10, and either an 8 or really a 6. Plus the right back issue you've addressed.
    Totally agree that Logan is a really nice addition, and I'm happy about Sweat, and our CB depth is really solid.
    One idea, and it's probably bad, but I agree that Fontas is needed in the 11. he played some D-Mid in Spain. Move him forward and we're not watching him mosey back as a last defender as often. He's still looking at the entire field in front of him, he can still run our possession show, and Isi gets a more athletic partner, in Forde or Voldemort.
     
  14. kcfooty

    kcfooty Member

    Feb 16, 2011
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Agree. The lack of speed and quality in the midfield is damning to our fairly skilled, but tortoise-racing backline. It's almost the perfect negative compliment to their most glaring weakness.
     
  15. KCFutbol

    KCFutbol Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jun 14, 2001
    Overland Park, KS
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well how about that. Muhleeuh with the clean sheet. Suhloy was unable to score though. Those TUDN announcers are "interesting".
     
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  16. Buzz Killington

    Buzz Killington Member+

    Oct 6, 2002
    Lee's Summit
    Club:
    Kansas City Wizards
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I’ll take the 3 points but that’s another unimpressive 1-0 home game.
     
  17. kcscsupporter

    kcscsupporter Member+

    Apr 17, 2002
    D17
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    yeah. we at least looked competent, but it was largely uninspired.
     
  18. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    Overall, it was better. We had 61 percent of the possession, but actually made quite a bit of that happen in their end of the field, which is a first for this year. We had a much better passing accuracy, 78 to 62 percent, and that was on 518 passes.We won more duels, lost more tackles. But I would agree with the announcers, SKC was controlling the tempo, RSL looked more dangerous, though that's not really fair as the xG was a 1-1 game (though about half of that was JFR's goal, so before that they were more dangerous).
    Individually, we had a couple bright spots. IMO.
    1. Shalloy had his best game of the year. He was a smidge off in the actually scoring dept, but he had at least three passes that brought me off the couch, though only two were counted as key passes (passes that could, or should, have led to a goal) I'd argue it was more. His dribbling was back to near his best, though his best has a plan when he sets off on a mazy run, and here he ran himself in a dead end a couple times. Look at this activity map and he was all over both sidelines. His feet were working well. His eyes were working well. I was really happy to see him play that well, for the first time since last year, IMO. he plays that for the rest of the year and he's back near 16 and 7.
    2. Sweat. I really liked his one touch game. his activity map indicates a very active day along his sideline. He connected, and received, passes from 8 other starters, so not himself, not Isi or Zusi on the far side. He looked fast I liked his defense and his ability to cover ground. Again, why can't either he or Logan play right side?
    3. Hernandez. I thought this was his best game of the year. His work with the ball was okay, but his movement without it was strong, and his hustle saved us on a couple occassions. Issues, he wasn't quite right positionally and his passing was limited, but his running made up for a lot of that, IMO.
    It was not all roses. Problems:
    1. Espinoza was gassed by the 20th minute. His yellow wasn't a classic Roger yellow, it was a guy who isn't moving at the speed he's used to. he made himself part of the game, connecting passes with 7 starters. But right after we scored, he found himself inside the box without a player in front of his, and stopped, then put a weak ball across the middle. WTF. maybe he thought he was off, but the flag was down.he was just not peak roger.
    2. Shelton/Vujovic. Maybe Shelton is still injured? Despite being a late game sub, he seemed to give us about 8 minutes of effort, and then was walking around. He completed 4 passes, missed on 4 passes. He won 2 of 3 dribbles. he did give us 4 recoveries, but I am convinced they came in that first several minutes. OTOH, not sure that was a step down. Actually, Vujo had a couple very nice moments, which was a couple more than last week.
     
  19. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    The MLS stats page tossed up the following: "Johnathon Simpson Snedden Russell"
    Is that actually his name, or was someone messing around with the whiskey before deadline?
     
  20. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Probably both
     
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  21. lukeD

    lukeD Member+

    Jul 7, 2011
    Olathe
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    As with many other topics, we should just agree to disagree. The 6 is a defender in PVs system. His primary responsibilities are provide cover to the CBs, help posession, and switch the point of attack. It's this way in any inverted 3 man midfield. If fact, you will often see the 6 drop and become a third CB when the outside backs push forward. If you can't see this then I can't help.

    So signing backup defenders and one starter, when the defense in 2021 was plum awful, is "investing a lot" in the backline? Again, agree to disagree with you.

    Oh look, JFR and Salloi came back and the sky suddenly isn't falling. Whoda thunk it?
     
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  22. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    I think the correct usage is JFSSR
     
  23. BenDover

    BenDover BigSoccer Supporter

    Aug 4, 2010
    Rio Verde, AZ
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can’t really comment much about the game since it was shown on F-ing TUDN which I don’t have. The other option was a twitter stream which failed. I got ESPN+ because it was supposed to be the way to see MLS games outside of the broadcast areas. BS. When is soccer going to stop being the red headed step child of broadcast sports? F-ing BS! Ok, rant over.
     
  24. KopRules

    KopRules Member+

    May 31, 2011
    Beautiful South KC
    Club:
    Sporting Kansas City
    Probably one of the most incompetent broadcasts I’ve ever heard. The PBP guy calling a non goal a goal, and then interrupting/explaining his justification for why he was wrong to his partner was chef’s kiss bad broadcasting. Also, the halftime show dedicated to Charlotte that was then interrupted by the start of the second half felt very early 2000s MLS. Also, why does every SG that gets interviewed for an MLS social piece have to be wearing a scarf indoors while being staged with a full glass of beer. These are all things I don’t understand.

    As for the game itself, I was overall encouraged. I didn’t see RSL with many clear cut chances. The game never felt beyond reach despite the fact we are working in new faces and a number of guys coming back from injury. I just… nit picking starting XI aside for a moment… I’m at a loss for asking for anything more from this team during this game at this particular point.
     
  25. mschofield

    mschofield Member+

    May 16, 2000
    Berlin
    Club:
    Union Berlin
    Nat'l Team:
    Germany
    It's stunning that it's easier for me, in Germany, to get every MLS game than you, in Arizona. There's a fundamental problem there.
     

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