Judith Miller just got out of Jail

Discussion in 'Politics & Current Events' started by Northcal19, Sep 29, 2005.

  1. Northcal19

    Northcal19 New Member

    Feb 18, 2000
    Celtic Tavern LODO (
    Because Scooter Libby said she doesn't have a confidentiality agreement. Apparently she is going to testify before the Grand jury tomorrow. Amazing. Things are happening.
     
  2. JBigjake

    JBigjake Member+

    Nov 16, 2003
  3. Calexico77

    Calexico77 Member

    Sep 19, 2003
    Mid-City LA
    Club:
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    Hmm. Why is Libby (and don't think that I don't giggle when I think of the importance of THAT name, thank you very much) so calm though?

    I mean, I think the White House was VERY smart. It's officially "take out the garbage day" now. With Iraq, bad polling numbers, Katrina, etc., this is a drop in the bucket - UNLESS, Libby was indicted and/or convicted. Who can follow this case with all of the other crap flying around?


    I'd like to see the newly-invigorated press corps really ask Bush if he's willing to stick to his guns and fire Libby.
     
  4. nsa

    nsa Member+

    New England Revolution
    United States
    Feb 22, 1999
    Notboston, MA
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    Right-wing media conspiracy? :)
     
  5. BillQ

    BillQ New Member

    Oct 11, 1999
    Chicago, IL
    Wonder too if Libby decided to cut a deal?
     
  6. Revolt

    Revolt Member+

    Jun 16, 1999
    Davis, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
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    ******** Judith Miller.

    Oops. Achmed Chalabi already did that.
     
  7. Northcal19

    Northcal19 New Member

    Feb 18, 2000
    Celtic Tavern LODO (
    So now she says "Scooter" released her from confidentiality a year ago? So why was she in jail? This story makes no sense. With the Bush admin and there toadies in the media it is just incredible the crap they come up with.

    One thing for sure: Judy Miller hasn't been in the clink for 3 months because she is a principled journalist. This story is pure BS.
     
  8. Ray Luca

    Ray Luca BigSoccer Yellow Card

    Feb 2, 2005
    Maybe we can produce an Aprentiss for her?
     
  9. Matt in the Hat

    Matt in the Hat Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 21, 2002
    Brooklyn
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    She was there for her own, and possibly her newspapers own self interests. She wanted to be the champion of the first ammendment and now she is a chump
     
  10. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
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    There's been a theory on some lefty blogs that she was there to protect herself. I never really understood the theory, but it's been out there. Maybe I'm naive, but even Miller...I can't believe she, personally, would do something illegal. For a journo (as opposed to a gvt. official) it'd have to be something practically treasonous and/or involving espionage.
     
  11. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Chew on this hypothetical.

    Judy Miller has been working on the WMD beat for years. She knows everybody. She talks to everybody. Everybody talks to her.

    Because she knows everybody, she knows what everybody does.

    And, so, she know what Valerie Plame does. And, so, she tells others what Valerie Plame does.

    In other words, SHE'S the source.

    Fitzgerald knows this. He's wanted to get her into the grand jury room for months, ostensibly because of her conversations with White House officials. The premise of the subpoena was to get her to reveal details of her conversation with Libby; and Libby has no problem with her discussing it.

    But Judy (and her lawyers) know the Pandora's box will be opened up once she's in the Grand Jury room. So Judy, under the pretext of 1st Amendment martyrdom goes to jail for 3-4 months (because, last I looked, 3 months was better than 5 years) to simply wait out the grand jury.

    With time running out, Fitzgerald negotiates with Miller's lawyers to circumscribe her testimony (while secretly hoping he can still nail her on testimony). The "public " reason for her agreeing to testify is that Libby has given her an unambigous waiver -- which is crap, because he already released her.

    So, there you have it. As I said, hypothetical...but it connects the dots.

    Onto the last act of the drama. Stay tuned.
     
  12. DJPoopypants

    DJPoopypants New Member

    I'd say you're at least 75% accurate. Whether she was the source, or was afraid that grand jury's ask anything questioning would lead to disclosures about how she wrote her stories and made contact with administration insiders that would lead to her complete loss of credibility as a neutral journalist (perhaps she does not want to be known as the Used Tampon of Liberty?)...well...we'll find out.

    She wasn't talking because she was trying to hide something personal. That's the simplest explanation
     
  13. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Grand jury testimony is secret...so if she's afraid that, hypothetically, it's going to reveal she had a lesbian affair with Cheyney's daughter....um, not much of a risk there, I think.

    The lack of credibility thing is interesting, though even that falls into the purview of personally damaging, yet not criminal...though if she felt she had to lie on the stand to protect her journalistic credibility...well, THAT would be a problem.

    Nope. I think it boils down -- hypothetically, I would again add -- to the fact that if she testifies truthfully about her discussions of Valerie Plame with others, well, she's cooked.

    One other thing. If it turns out that a New York Times reporter, working for the paper that editorialized about the need for special prosecutor and investigation, gets roasted for the very act the paper railed against....then the irony is truly astounding.
     
  14. nsa

    nsa Member+

    New England Revolution
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    Feb 22, 1999
    Notboston, MA
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    http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory?id=1173266

    This thing is just too weird. Who is she really protecting?

     
  15. vivzig

    vivzig New Member

    Oct 4, 2004
    The OC
    It certainly would shoot some holes in the theory of monolithic liberal journalism.
     
  16. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
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    I may have to take Karl off ignore to get the answer...but Karl, wouldn't that make Robert Novak a terrible, terrible liar? Your theory does tie up a number of loose ends, but not the main one...Novak's original piece.
     
  17. peledre

    peledre Member

    Mar 25, 2001
    Sioux Falls, SD
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    She must've finally gotten the card I sent her:

    [​IMG]
     
  18. lurking

    lurking Member+

    Feb 9, 2002
    Club:
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    This theory is interesting, but its missing the key piece. In this scenario she would be a target. She will testify, which means that the prosecutors office probably cut her a deal providing her some immunity. That indicates he must think that there is a bigger, better target out there. I think your right, that there is a certain amount of self incrimination out there in her case, but I dont think thats the end of it. I think someone else is going to be going down because of her testimony, which is why the prosecuters office was willing to cut her a deal.
     
  19. peledre

    peledre Member

    Mar 25, 2001
    Sioux Falls, SD
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    I think douchebags of liberty are able to lie, but i'm just wondering what his motivation would've been.

    We're still waiting to hang somebody over this whole deal aren't we?
     
  20. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Here's how it goes -- hypothetically.

    Miller knew who Plame was and that she was the one who sponsored Wilson's trip. "Jeez, Judy, I am Cheyney's chief of staff, and I know he didn't authorize it?'

    She, with her extensive knowledge, tells him.

    Nowak talks to Libby and Rove. Asks them, "Was Cheyney responsible for this trip?" "Why," they say, in RESPONSE to the question, "it was his wife, she works at the CIA. Wilson lied in his NYT article" They didn't out her; they simply answered the question, and did not communicate her role to him, if they even knew what her role was. In fact, all they wanted to do was point out the Wilson lie.

    If the extent of the conversation was "she works at the CIA" the White House boys are in the clear; remember, breaking the law is just like a handball: the revelaton of the name needs to be INTENTIONAL. Also, it has to be done done KNOWING she is covert with information from classified sources.

    Judy Miller is by no means a "classifed" source.

    Then both of them say, "You have to corroborate this information from the CIA, and clear it with them."

    Novak calls the CIA to confirm. Here is where it gets dicey. There have been conflicting accounts -- Novak has said he called and they told him don't use her name, but, according to Novak, DIDN'T say she was covert. The CIA, in contrast, said they were adamant that she was covert and that her name shouldn't be used BECAUSE she was covert.

    Then, it all boils down to a he said-she said at the Novak-CIA level.

    And Judith Miller is original source.

    Another variation on the theme:

    Rove and Libby knew who she was, told Novak, but then said, "Don't publish that" but he did:

    http://www.prospect.org/print-friendly/webfeatures/2004/02/waas-m-02-12.html

    See also:

    http://www.prospect.org/web/page.ww?section=root&name=ViewWeb&articleId=10363
     
  21. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    From Miller's remarks after her testimony. Emphases mine:

     
  22. lurking

    lurking Member+

    Feb 9, 2002
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
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    So if a person who works at the DEA tells a hooker, whom he knows drug dealers visit "hey, Joe Schmidt is a DEA agent, but dont tell anyone," the leaker is not going to get in trouble because he told her not to pass that info along?
     
  23. Karl K

    Karl K Member

    Oct 25, 1999
    Suburban Chicago
    Bad analogy.

    (1) IF Rove and Libby learned it from Miller (law says you have to learn it from classified sources)

    (2) and IF they told Novak only after he asked them about it (you have to know the agent is coverg and intentionally reveal it) and

    (3) and IF they told him to "confirm and clear" with the CIA

    Then these guys simply have not violated the law.
     
  24. HerthaBerwyn

    HerthaBerwyn Member+

    May 24, 2003
    Chicago
    What is the sound of one hair splitting?

    Its all about preventing anyone in this administrating from EVER having to take responsibility for their behavior. All in the name of the culture of personal responsibility. Bush is a gold medalist in the Olympic Backpeddle.
     
  25. Samarkand

    Samarkand Member+

    May 28, 2001
    Another reason to consider is that there's every indication that Fitzgerald would ahve sought a 2nd grand jury had Miller not spoken, thereby extending her time as a full time guest of the government.
     

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