Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart, Liverpool...

Discussion in 'Yanks Abroad' started by Hobo, Nov 16, 2011.

  1. Grumpy in LA

    Grumpy in LA Bringing It Since 1807™

    Sep 10, 2007
    Chicago
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Huh. I thought he had a few games under his belt by now. Guess not.

    My basic point, though, is that it's nice for Agudelo and US players in general to get some high-level training, but that it's misguided to assume that "European" coaches are going to be a step up from MLS coaches. The top European coaches, sure. But the average European coach? Meh. Hardly a slam-dunk. For one thing, Agudelo's club coach IS a European coach with a fairly impressive resume who still hasn't done much in MLS despite having a lot more money at his disposal than most MLS coaches. The only guy with equal financing has been Bruce Arena, and that's a pretty stark contrast.
     
  2. Jazzy Altidore

    Jazzy Altidore Member+

    Sep 2, 2009
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    OK, so one poster once said something ridiculous to you on bigsoccer in some other thread about MLS, thus justifying an unprovoked anti MLS attack by a different poster on a different subject altogether. Got it.
     
  3. sidefootsitter

    sidefootsitter Member+

    Oct 14, 2004
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    One thing that is very impressive with AZ and other Dutch teams is the amount of attention that is given to the individual training (though, for the tactical purposes, of course, team training and movement is very important).

    Gert Verbeek mentioned that Altidore has to work with the "forward coach". Harry Redknapp, once a Sounders player, mentioned that much like the American sports, soon Euro teams will have a coterie of coaches for the various positions on the field.

    For MLS to make a jump upward - and, to give it credit, it has made many over the years - coaches have to work on the same details that these Dutch coaches work on and work just as diligently and with as much dedication and skill.

    As to Juan's stint with Stuttgart, two weeks with Pavel Pogrebnyak better not turn him into another Pavel Pogrebnyak.
     
  4. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 19, 2008
    Colorado
    Club:
    FC Metalist Kharkiv
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart



    I just vomited in my mouth.
     
  5. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Tell that to German coaches. If you think fitness is not a dominating factor then you know little about German training. It is ALL about fitness. They spend most of the summer on fitness. They spend the majority of their training sessions on fitness.

    Technique comes AFTER you are fit enough to play the game.
     
  6. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    I was asking you because you specifically mentioned "fitness".

    Care to name any American fitness coaches employed by clubs in Europe? I can only think of the guys JK brought with him to Bayern from LA who are no longer employed there.
     
  7. SecludedMonkey

    SecludedMonkey New Member

    Mar 1, 2011
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Is Agudelo's contract a typical 2 yr+2 MLS deal?
     
  8. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    AC Milan, a fairly well known club, had an American head of fitness--William Tillson.
     
  9. IndividualEleven

    Mar 16, 2006
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    For MLS clubs to make that jump they'd have to increase the size of the coaching staffs. Stuff costs money.
     
  10. prowazekii

    prowazekii Member

    Jun 21, 2008
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    A few years ago, Everton hired an American who was previously the strength and conditioning coach for the Columbus Crew. I created a thread on it at the time, but it didn't draw much interest. I don't know if he is still there.
     
  11. Real Corona

    Real Corona Moderator
    Staff Member

    Jan 19, 2008
    Colorado
    Club:
    FC Metalist Kharkiv
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    I don't remember making any comment about fitness, but here is what Juan said....


    Which goes along with the biggest problems our players have which is technical ability, not fitness.
     
  12. ielag

    ielag Member+

    Jul 20, 2010
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Homegrown contracts are usually similar to Generation Adidas deals, so wouldn't be surprised if he signed a 5 year deal.
     
  13. Jacques Strappe

    Mar 24, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    With all due respect, I think that the poster you are questioning probably has more knowledge about what goes on in German training grounds these days than any 3 of us put together. I appreciate your translations and input regarding our Yanks in Germany, but I think you might want to back off of that statement a little.
     
  14. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Unless you know *my* background then that's a bold statement.

    I spent my youth in the German academy system and played there until I was 19. My family still coaches in two very prominent youth systems there. My best frined from school is with one of the BL's finest scouting teams. So, its not like I am whistling Dixie on this.
     
  15. comoesa

    comoesa Member+

    Aug 13, 2010
    Christen Press's armpit
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    LoewenBoy:

    You really think MLS clubs/academies are focusing on more skill related training than clubs/academies in Germany?

    Is that your argument? Or are you saying that they are focusing more on fitness and skill than any MLS club/academy is doing with either? If it is the latter it would not surprise me, but, our players really need the skill related training especially at the academy level and lower.

    I think fitness training is fine, but most of our players have no trouble going 90 minutes. A couple of them are absolute freaks in that regard.
     
  16. Jacques Strappe

    Mar 24, 2005
    Atlanta, GA
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Fair enough. I just think it's extremely inaccurate to state that trophy case would "know very little about German football" and the way training is conducted there.
     
  17. Plainsburner

    Plainsburner Member

    Jun 23, 2011
    Orange County
    Club:
    Los Angeles Galaxy
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    http://www.evertonfc.com/match/coaching-staff.html?page=2

    Steve, yes hes still there.

    I personally can't wait till we no longer have to have this argument though. One day our system will be comparable to the Europeans, we just need to give ours a chance to thrive. Will take a while, and many adjustments are needed, but i believe we are on the right path.

    I believe that Europe is the way to go at the moment though, especially if you have that extra bit of class. I also agree that, after watching some MLS play, fitness is not the issue of our players. We are severely lacking in game intelligence and technique in general.
     
  18. trophy case

    trophy case Member

    Feb 8, 2008
    new york
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    The fitness is during pre-season but they still work with the ball.
    During the season, most of the training is technique and tactics. I stay in Germany 4 months out of the year and I am in close contact with Bayern, Stuttgart, Hoffenheim, and couple of top English clubs. I just saw Perry Kitchen
    at Freiburg training with the U-23's. I go to games and training sessions all the
    time because of my relationship with all the players and the coaches.
     
  19. alky13

    alky13 New Member

    Jul 29, 2009
    Manchester/NYC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    Unless we eliminate pay to play and our focus on winning at the youth level, we will continue to produce mediocre to poor foot skilled players.
     
  20. LoewenBoy

    LoewenBoy Member+

    Aug 25, 2004
    Giesing, Muenchen
    Club:
    TSV 1860 München
    Nat'l Team:
    Sint Maarten
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    I did not say that. I said they focus on fitness over and above technical skills for much of the summer. During the season they even out their fitness training with tactics and technique.

    Not saying they cannot go 90 mins. Saying German clubs focus on fitness. Typically more than other nations. See Magath as an example. Even Germans complain he is too tough. :D

    True. But the statement about fitness and German training seemed off for anyone familiar with the German system.

    Agreed, but I never said they didn't. I merely pointed out that the emphasis is on fitness. And when comparing German teams like Bayern or BVB or Hoffenheim -- when compared to the likes of Chelsea or Barca -- the German teams are noted for focusing far more on fitness than tactics or technique.


    I would agree. The reason for that is that they heavily emphasized fitness during the summer. My experience suggests the ratio is 70%/30% fitness to technique/tactics during the first three weeks of summer camp, then evening out to 50/50 by mid-July. By late July, and for the rest of the season (except winter camp, perhaps) it tilts 40/60 or even 30/70 the other direction.

    Of course, that depends on your coach and team. Magath is famous for "too much" fitness.
     
  21. Ironkick14

    Ironkick14 Member+

    Sep 29, 2011
    Chicago, IL
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    This is not necessarily true. If the pay to play coaches know what they're talking about, as opposed to now where some(not all) barely are qualified to coach rec, then it won't matter if people are paying, they will still be getting good training.

    I'm not saying pay to play is a good system. It's not.call I'm saying is that the first priority is to educate coaches, not eliminate pay to play. If we eliminate pay to play and the coaches that don't know anything are now coaching more kids because everyone can afford it, all that happens is we produce more bad prospects, and while more depth will be created, we'll be hard pressed to produce any more top prospects than we do now, which is to say 0.
     
  22. trophy case

    trophy case Member

    Feb 8, 2008
    new york
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    I would agree. The reason for that is that they heavily emphasized fitness during the summer. My experience suggests the ratio is 70%/30% fitness to technique/tactics during the first three weeks of summer camp, then evening out to 50/50 by mid-July. By late July, and for the rest of the season (except winter camp, perhaps) it tilts 40/60 or even 30/70 the other direction.

    Of course, that depends on your coach and team. Magath is famous for "too much" fitness.[/QUOTE]

    I agree with this.
     
  23. jond

    jond Member+

    Sep 28, 2010
    On My Squatty Potty
    Club:
    Levski Sofia
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    I agree with this.[/QUOTE]

    I could agree Germans work more on fitness during the summer, but their "summer" really isn't that long. It's still 10 months out of the year tech/tactics take priority, which is much different then what goes on stateside.

    They have to work more on fitness during a shorter off season.
     
  24. Gorky

    Gorky Member+

    Jul 28, 2006
    NYC
    Club:
    New York Red Bulls
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    When Hans Backe came to MLS he thought the Red Bulls were not doing enough fitness.
     
  25. soccersonoma10

    Apr 26, 2007
    Re: Juan Agudelo training with VfB Stuttgart

    I love how every player thread in YA automatically becomes some silly debate instead of focusing on the player.
     

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