News: Impact Sub - OGS The New Gaffer Thread

This is the first manager in a very long while we’ve achieved security under. There’s a direction — on and off the pitch. That’s my United.

Yes, there are doubts & improvements needed but Ole is great at placing a system for brilliant players to flourish. Give him the players.

— Maram AlBaharna (@maramperninety) July 24, 2021

Pretty much captures where I am at - he has brought the Man Utd culture back, you know we will likely broadly end up where we should in the league, the environment is positive to get the best from the players. The channel from the academy is back.

Needs to start winning some cups. Needs to be given a CB and DCM so we can fully compete.

 

The tweet resonates with my feeling towards Ole.

Good news

 

I’ve said it before, but what I like most about Ole - besides him Ted Lassoing the ******** out of our toxic dressing room whilst getting us back-to-back CL qualification - is that any signings he makes are for the good of Utd, not for his short term success. And not only is he signing excellent players who won’t be a huge task for the next manager to clear out, he’s also doing so much to integrate the academy into the first team - building up players he won’t be managing if he goes in the next couple of years. He’s a manager but he’s also a custodian, of our squad, our club and our history.

 

Wouldnt be surprised

How long until José makes a comment about contract extensions and not winning trophies?

— UtdArena (@UtdArena) July 24, 2021

Where we were when Ole took over (Pogs minutes hides fact that Mou had effectively dropped him).

This is the league table and squad minutes when José Mourinho left in 18/19: pic.twitter.com/VuwPdHRdnE

— UtdArena (@UtdArena) July 24, 2021

 

Not feeling the joy of others regarding Ole's extension. He's a good man and a club legend but we'll be plagued by head-scratching tactics and odd rotations that have been constants during his tenure. We'll be in a 2nd-6th purgatory as long as he's leading the team. Really hoping to be wrong but "Meh May" has been a tradition at seasons end and I can't see that changing while he's leading the team.

 

I don’t understand why you put much stock in it. Our seasons are still better than what they were prior to ole. And if the form dips and they lose trust in his vision he’ll be gone just like his predecessors. What’s it hurt to let it play out? Also, Arteta got 4 years on his first deal. It’s a market/below market offer.

 

Unlike Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho, Ole is seen as "one of us" and he'll be given more time than most to succeed. Van Gaal has an FA Cup and Mourinho has a Europa League title so I guess "still better" is relative. I get what you're saying, but I can see the trigger being pulled very slowly to replace him and he's managing with no sense of urgency like he always has. If we win the League with Ole as manager, I'll keep an open tab at Finn's until you pass out

 

You think there's a manager that gets better results in the league since Ole's been here? You think Pep wins the league in his first full season with that squad?

Ole absolutely has flaws and the squad was deeply flawed when he became manager and he's set about fixing them. He's really good though. He's not the best manager in the world but we weren't ready for the best manager in the world when we hired Ole.

He's absolutely put us back in the conversation where a top manager would be intrigued by the prospect. There's a chance he's not the guy to take us to glory but nobody was taking us to glory with that squad. He's definitely on the right track and deserves a shot. There will be performance riders in there and if he doesn't meet the standard, he'll be gone but he absolutely deserves a shot.

 

When does his "shot" start? It will be 3 years in December since he took over. We finished second but never seriously sniffed first place the whole season. Go back and read this thread and and highlight the bad team selections, poor tactics and crap results against bad teams since he's been here. He's not a motivator and one too many times the team has slept walk through performances and his relegating of Van Der Beek was baffling. I said it before and I'll repeat it, he manages like a man who doesn't fear losing his job and it shows. Again, hope I'm wrong and this post can be thrown back in my face at seasons end.

 

The mindset that a manager has only two or three years to win something otherwise they’re a failure isn’t one I can agree with. Context is everything. That’s why I keep going on about the return on investment you got from Jose & LVG’s signings - all of e.g. Pep’s signings have been building on top of a platform, whereas Ole has had to spend around 2/3 of his outgoings just trying to get us the sort of squad he should have inherited in the first place.

I’m not that enamoured with going back and reading people’s takes during matches either tbh. There was a lot of negativity here even when we were playing well. I’m pretty sure we were beating somebody 6-1, then they scored a 2nd consolation and people in here were saying “and there it is. Pathetic.”

!!!

It took a long time for people here to realise that Maguire is an excellent-to-elite CB. I’m not exempt from that, but it was more when I started talking with people elsewhere that my stance softened on him and I started to realise just how good he is for us.

I’ve been up on Ole since 19/20 kicked off, even if I’ve wavered once or twice, because I think a Utd that wins trophies and continues to be fundamentally broken is not a Utd that wins trophies often. Yeah, Ole hasn’t won anything, lol etc. But Ole is the first manager we’ve had who (a) gets that, and (b) isn’t actively making us more broken. Any tactical shortcomings we have had over this past season feel like they can be explained by how mental 20/21 was, and by how we still had gaps in our squad that we at least knew he was trying to fix.

And ultimately it’s all about progress towards sustained success. Under LVG and Jose we were winning trophies in isolation, without making progress. By contrast, last season our biggest weaknesses were our right half of the pitch, our ability against the low block, our aerial duels and our set piece defending. This summer we’re signing a RW, a RCB, potentially a RB and a RCM. Sancho is elite in possession vs low blocks, and was the signing intended to work closely with VDB who is also excellent vs low blocks. Varane is brilliant in the air, and we have hired a set piece coach to fix us defensively.

There can be / has been a bit of a fug in here over the past couple of years, where everything and everyone is shit and people miss what’s actually going on. This mentality that ‘we are Man Utd’ and the expectations around it is powerful when used correctly, but toxic when it isn’t. It takes a conscious mental effort to shift that, especially when we were sold the idea of backing a manager long term and then hired three of the worst candidates possible for that long-termist vision.

 

First of all, nobody got us anywhere near first post-Fergie. There's literally one spot for first and a bunch of teams who are vying for it. The sooner the Ole-outers understand that we aren't entitled to titles or trophies the better this will be for you.

Ole hasn't competed for the league but he's absolutely competed for cups. The thought that we should be able to win the league within a season or two of appointing a new manager is what led to poor purchases and multiple appointments in a short space of time. For the first time we are building towards something that isn't next season.

To answer your question, his shot starts now and barring really bad results, probably lasts 2 seasons unless he wins something. To this point, he's done his job. He stopped the freefall, he made us competitive and cleared some dross and made us attractive to quality players.

If we land a CB and a DM/DLP this window, we'll finally have a squad to compete and he should be challenging for the league and hopefully winning it within 3 seasons.

Pep - widely considered to be the best manager in the world at the time (probably now too by many) didn't win a trophy his first season with the club and that team was stacked. He would win a league but a year later but fastforward 5 years and he hasn't won the CL despite a) inheriting a tremendous squad b) spending assloads of money in transfer fees and wages and c) being an elite coach/manager.

I think Ole has done a good job. It is time for him to kick on, but anyone who thought that literally any ********ing manager in the world was going to win the league with our team any of the last 3 seasons needs to have their head examined. If that's the case then you can only be mad that we haven't won a cup. You'd be right to be disappointed but winning a cup requires more than just execution, it requires luck. As dissapointing as the Europa final was and going out in the semis of the FA Cup was, that's part of cup football.

 

Every year since his arrival he has made positive changes for the club.

The player-coach/keeping around senior players/hiring coaches where there is a need/targeting players that would instantly improve us and made sense financially.

 

Whether you are for or against, I think the signings along with integrated players from the academy should be a lot more suitable to whoever follows than the flip-flopping we had before. Especially if we have a good window this summer.

If you look at the previous signings and whether they subsequently stayed or were fully utilized it shows an interesting picture (eg only 2 of LVG 11 signings still here!).

For me it both highlights the waste as a consequence of our approach since SAF left and what a good job Ole managed last year considering we had such a nothing window last summer (something a lot of people forget).

Each to their own, but for me he deserves a proper shot with the players he should receive to fill the gaps this summer. He has had to spend a lot of time and energy on turning around what was a sinking ship when he took over. Now it is broadly pointing in the right direction he deserves some time at the wheel

Moyes - Fellaini, Mata

LVG - Di Maria, Falcao, Blind, Rojo, Shaw, Herrera, Martial, Schneiderlin, Depay, Darmian, Schweini

Mou - Pogba, Mikhi, Bailly, Ibra, Lukaku, Sanchez, Matic, Lindelof, Fred, Dalot

Ole - Maguire, AWB, James, Bruno, Ighalo, vdB, Diallo, Telles, Pellistri, Cavani

 

Fair enough, all points you made are valid. I have always respected your opinion as one of our more informed posters and continue to do so. I just don't think Ole is in his element to get us back to where we were as a club but as with anything, time will tell and the Glazers will give him time for sure.

 

Some people have short memories. During LVG & Mourinho years our play was dire. Many times I had to turn it off because it was simply awful to watch. I know Ole hasn't won any trophies yet but at least he's got us playing positive, attacking-minded football. It's not there yet but we are improving.

 

Only downside is that He doesn’t rotate the squad the way he should. Especially during pandemic packed seasons. And our football, and subsequently fans, suffer at the end of the seasons because of this.

 

I think that is a fair point. I also think that Ole is not "THE" guy to get us a CL and a league, but what he's done to date to me warrants an opportunity.

I think what Ole suffers from is the improvements he's made to team spirit and squad quality and results and people are saying with that base level manager x would do better, but the truth is they would have had to get to this point first. If you separate the rescue job from the building job then Ole has had 2 successful periods thus far. The next task is to win. If he does that, then he has to sustain and then he has to rebuild.

Any manager coming in when Ole did, would have had to stop the bleeding THEN try to build something. Moyes never acknowledged that. LVG did, but what he was building was slow and old and painful to watch. JM didn't try to rebuild, he just tried to win right away. He did, but he ruined morale and the squad had no continuity.

 

Overall I am pleased with the job Ole has done with steadying the ship. My biggest gripe has been the lack of rotation and his hesitation to make subs when the game is crying out for fresh legs or a different approach. It's almost as if he is afraid of making a mistake.

With our new signings he will likely need a trophy and top 4, but I'd also like to see some positive signs that he has evolved as a manager.

 

Spoilt brats? We pay for entertainment. We expect it to pass the eye test.

 

Yes, LVG did his job. I think he'd be looked on a lot kinder if we hadn't ********ed up hi successor. On the back of the FA Cup and a middling league performance with promising young talents, we should have then got a manager to match.

Two knocks against LVG only 1 of them his fault. 1. The football was so mindnumbingly boring to watch. 2. Nobody knew the enormity of the job he had given a) how shattered confidence was post Moyes and b) how much of the good he'd undone by firing everyone in sight the ********ing mope.

 

I'm in a similar boat.

My two biggest gripes is his in game management and his conservative nature when it comes to making changes to change games.

And, his inability to solve out set piece issues to date (going back awhile now).

He appears to acknowledged point 2 I think - with the recent coaching addition he made. I give him credit for that and his self awareness. I hope it works.

I hope he can now fix his in game management.

I don't knock him too much for his rotation, because frankly, we haven't actually been that deep of a team in recent years. He hasn't much to even rotate in with. Perhaps this too explains his conservative nature to in game management?

 

I can agree about the lack of rotation, but moreso with the lack of subs. The thing is, there's a clear mitigating factor for both of those though. The overall squad depth/quality was piss poor. This season, hopefully we'll see a bench that features:

Tony/Marcus, Amad/Mase, VdB/Scott/Fred, VL, Telles.

If we stick with the 4231 then Pogba being able to play the pivot and LW will mean even more quality depth. Jadon's arrival as pivotal as it may prove to be at RW is just as crucial to ease the creative burden of the guys who do most of the creation now.

Jadon & Pogba in the XI probably gives us similar level but different type of creativity as Bruno/Pogba. That means there's more of a chance we can rotate Bruno. If we swap to the 433 then that's even more likely as it will suit VDB more.

We need quality at DM but aside from that area, there's quality back up everywhere and improved quality in the first xi as well. That's huge for being able to rotate week to week. If that improved best XI can put teams away that means more rotation within the game as well.