I'm not blaming the league for our showing this year. But look at the guys that were supposed to be the big guns: Cunningham-drafted McBride-drafted Buddle-drafted (3rd round, nonetheless) Martino-drafted Hejduk- Allocated, after the rest of the league passed on him In fact, I challenge you to name the guys who've been allocated to Colmbus in MLS history. Just about everyone of importance in Crew history came because we did the work to find the guy and get him here.
What's this crap that the league is so gracious towards us and that we haven't been shafted. Everything that Columbus has on the field that is worth having there is due to Columbus' own work, not MLS. Let's take a look, huh? As already mentioned: BMB-we drafted him Cunny-we drafted him Buddle-we drafted him Martino-we drafted him McCarty-we drafted him Akwari-draft day trade, so it cost us a draft pick Hejduk-got him in a lottery... we certainly weren't first in line, but few teams had the cap room, and those that did passed on him... no favors shown there, unless you mean MLS didn't favor another team by giving them some "salary help". Don't forget, he wasn't even starting with a Swiss 2nd division team at the time... so he was a potential risk. Chacon-done as a favor to LA so they could clear the space to pick up Serna when we wanted to use the spot on Gibbs or Williams (who has disappointed) Busch-we drafted him Clark-we drafted him Denton-drafted too Walsh-drafted him Oughton-drafted him Williams-signed as a discovery player, and all we've discovered is a load of crap. Mais- allocation... from the innaugral season! retire already Garcia-discovery player...who has discover the INS Paule-traded w/ NY West-assigned as innaugral P-40 player Presthus-traded w/DC... should have kept the No. 3 overall draft pick, maybe. Should I bother to go over our DP's? So you see, chumps, we don't exactly have a load of favors cashed in from the league. Go take your crap elsewhere since you can't argue with any facts.
Hey smart guy--speaking of fact checking, are you aware our "salary help" cost us our first round pick in the draft last year? I defy you to come up with any instance where the league has bent over backwards to help the Fire. The fact is, your team has been together for a while and is a bunch of massive underachievers. No, you haven't gotten a ton of assistance from the league, but neither have we or most of the other teams outside NY and LA. How about getting a real coach, for a starter?
In fact, in our history we've had two "big names" on the Crew: Brad Friedel, who told MLS he would only play in Columbus, and Stern John, who nobody had heard of but whose cousin was Ansil Elcock. Elcock told Fitz about him, and we invited him into camp in Florida. Even so, after we asked MLS to sign him for us, Bruce Arena filed a later claim and it was np and tuck for awhile, but they just couldn't figure out a way to give him to DC so we ended up with him. In neither of these cases did the league do us any favors. Until we got Williams, we weren't starting a single SI. Tell me how many other teams use the SI crap the league gives them to populate their bench. Nobody is blaming the league for what's happened this year. We're blaming the league for the last eight years.
To be fair you can't count Martino and Buddle. Their playing time is almost insignificant. I agree that the reason we have had a bad season is because of the coaching, nobody here denies that. But I do agree that we are shafted for being a "small market".
I knew as soon as this article was posted it was gonna turn into a pity party for ourselves. It's sad. Again I ask, look through the Crew's history and you find teams that were good enough that for one reason or another just didn't get it done. There are plenty of things to blame. MLS's lack of favoritism towards Columbus is bottom of the list in my opinion.
So you kept a very strong team together for a full year more when in essence you shouldn't have been able too? Seems like the league helped ya, and ya pissed it away last year. You lost a first round draft pick this year. That's fine, I think it's fair. If you read my posts throughout this thread you'll actually see that I agree with you that MLS should be the last place that the Crew places blame for their lack of success.
I'll tell you one thing, I wish Bob Hunter would write more Crew articles. He's always one of my favorites and when he does write an article, it always seems to create a lot of discussion on these boards. He's certainly a better writer then CBC and his fluff pieces. As far as MLS greivences go, I think it has little to do with what is wrong with this team now and in the past. However, I will say I don't understand the whole Corey Gibbs thing. It sounded like the Crew did their homework, contacted Gibbs, got him interested in coming to play for us, then the league said no because we had to have an allocation to pick him up. There could have been other factors in this as well. Doesn't an allocation also come with money for a transfer fee and other things to get the player signed? Maybe that's what they meant by we needed an allocation to get him. If that's true, that's part of the real problem here. The "perception" that we get slighted by the fans is really the worrisome factor here. It could really turn people away from MLS who would otherwise come to games if they think it's all rigged in favor of one team or another or another team gets more then one team. Things like there being no explanation for the Gibbs situation from the league and tieing of the hands of Smith to discuss it when he was on the our chat or the Stern John transfer money seamingly going to buy LA and the Metros high named players, makes fans of this team believe they are being slighted. There needs to be some explanation for weighted lotteries that always seem to go to the Metros and how some teams afford to stay under the salary cap while still adding high priced players. I think fans of this team can take "we didn't get this player because...." or "we did this because....", what they can't stand is the secrecy and silence.
Here's how the Fire built their current roster. Amazing how many have been acquired since 2000. Have fun: Chris Armas #14: Acquired via trade with Jorge Campos from the Los Angeles Galaxy on January 27, 1998, for Kevin Hartman, Danny Peña and an allocated player to be named later. DaMarcus Beasley #7: Acquired on 2-6-00 from Los Angeles for the Fire's first-round draft pick in the 2000 SuperDraft (6th overall) and Chicago's first-round draft pick in the 2001 SuperDraft (11th overall) Carlos Bocanegra #4: Drafted in the first round (fourth overall) of the 2000 MLS SuperDraft. Jonathan Bolaños #22: Acquired as a discovery pick Aug. 2003. C. J. Brown #2: Drafted in the first round (1st overall) of the 1998 supplemental draft by the Chicago Fire. Craig Capano #19: Drafted in the second round (17th overall) of the 2002 MLS SuperDraft by the Chicago Fire. Jim Curtin #5: Drafted in the third round (29th overall) of the 2001 SuperDraft. Ryan Futagaki #24: Drafted in the sixth round (54th overall) of the 2003 MLS SuperDraft. Kelly Gray #6: Drafted in the first round (5th overall) of the 2002 MLS SuperDraft by the Chicago Fire. Nate Jaqua #11: Drafted in the first round (third overall) of the 2003 MLS SuperDraft. Jesse Marsch #15: Acquired via trade with D.C. United on January 5, 1998, with future considerations for A.J. Wood and a second round pick in the 1998 MLS College Draft. Logan Pause #12: Drafted in the third round (24th overall) of the 2003 MLS SuperDraft. Orlando Perez #20: Acquired via trade with D.C. United on July 18, 2002, for a second round pick in the 2003 MLS SuperDraft. Damani Ralph #8: Drafted in the second round (18th overall) of the 2003 MLS SuperDraft. Ante Razov #9: Acquired as a marquee replacement for the injured Josh Wolff and allocated to the Fire for future seasons on August 3, 2001. Dipsy Selolwane #17: Drafted in the third round (36th overall) of the 2002 MLS SuperDraft by the Chicago Fire. Didn't sign with MLS until 2003. Zach Thornton #18: Drafted in the sixth round (11th overall) of the 1997 MLS expansion draft. Nick Walls #28: Signed to Developmental contract on 3-11-03. Evan Whitfield #3: Drafted in the first round of the 1999 MLS College Draft. Played for KAA Gent in 1999 and didn't sign with the Fire until 2000. Andy Williams #16: Traded from MetroStars on 3-27-03 for a conditional draft pick in the 2004 MLS SuperDraft.
Ease up there fella, I was jokingly picking categories in a hurried post before I went out to get food to stuff my face with, not striving for accuracy or making a political statement. I thought conservatives were supposed to have a sense of humor...
Re: Here's how the Fire built their current roster. I remember laughing when that happened. Whatever happened to that "marquee replacement for marquee player injury" rule. I wonder if Cunny sat out the rest of the season if we could have brought that back from the dead.
We also should remember that: Other teams have done better with similar rosters as far as drafts/allocations go. Other teams have been also disrupted by MLS for parity (the DC dynasty comes to mind) In the long run the Crew organization can only blame themselves for their choices and MLS for a few choices forced into secondary ones. If I were to ask MLS for help, as Hunter suggests; I would place a much better coach high on the priority list then look for another quality player to add to the roster to replace some of the "old guard" that should be retiring/leaving/chased out of town. I guess what upsets me the most is that a single-entity managed league that strives for parity has two markets that seem to get "fixed" more often than others.
Re: Re: Here's how the Fire built their current roster. This one: REPLACEMENT PLAYERS Should the League determine that a player has, beyond a reasonable doubt, suffered a season ending injury, that player’s team may be provided with roster relief. However, in such cases, the club in question will only receive only roster relief and remain responsible for the full amount of the injured player’s salary. When this occurs, the injured player will not be allowed to compete for his team for the remainder of the season in question (including MLS Cup Playoff or Lamar Hunt U.S. Open Cup matches). The above shall apply to both Senior Roster and Developmental players. The Fire burned an allocation on this deal (actually, the allocation they got for Razov leaving in the first place). It came back to bite them, though with the great salary cap burn off of 2003.
Unfortunately, the feeling that the Crew - and other markets - gets the shaft isn't limited to just the fans. I have read and heard comments from people I trust that in conversations with Crew staffers, including some "higher ups," Crew personnel have stated the same concerns that the league is looking out for others and not Columbus. I've heard comments that Crew personnel have been told directly that "X player isn't going to Columbus because X should be in a bigger market." As I said, I trust the people who told me these comments, but I wasn't there so I don't worry too much about them. Hunter's columns have been slammed on BigSoccer before, but I personally find them useful. Hunter, I suspect, doesn't have the day-to-day interaction with the Crew and the league like Merz has (although his "Rumblings" column usually includes some interesting information); Hunter's is more an outsider's view, the view and thoughts one might expect from someone who, unlike those of us here, doesn't "live and die" with this team. When I read Hunter's columns I get the feeling that this is what the non-diehards are thinking (if they give it any thought).
CUS: In that rule, why would MLS have any jurisdiction over who can play in the Lamar Hunt US Open Cup? That's not an MLS event... that's a USSF event.
Don't ask me, I only cut and paste. I would guess though that MLS does have jurisdiction on which player is eligible for being carded to a team. And this in essense takes that card away.
true. the sentiment exists, and it's not whiny. it's more resignation than anything else. there's truth to it as well. overall this topic is not a zero-sum argument. hang is right too. we have shot ourselves in the foot many times -- as have the metros, which is why "if we've been given so much help why haven't we won any hardware" argument doesn't hold water. at the league-wide level, the goings-on are much like the game itself: you can only plan, guide, prepare, and shape things so much. when the whistle blows, other factors take over and the best-laid plans can be flushed down the crapper. on an unrelated note, i'm back in town and the honeymoon was great. then i come back to this BS. this team has way too much talent to be putting all its playoffs hopes in arrowhead stadium this weekend. fookin 'ell.