Ok, who thinks Stockton will be back???? http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060413/SPORTS/60413003
Gotta love this line from it: “Simply stated, we’re not profitable,” [California Cougars owner Darrell] Petray said. “We’re not into this for a hobby, it’s a business. It only makes sense if you’re profitable.” If that is the case, it only makes sense to do research before you start a franchise. Through out the years I have only heard of two MISL (new and old league) turning a profit, Cleveland and Baltimore. Expecting a first year team to turn a profit is really setting the bar too high. Guess the writing was on the wall before the team even had its first home game: http://www.recordnet.com/apps/pbcs....15/SPORTS11/512150312&SearchID=73229562286291 "We'd be very pleased to average 5,000 people per game," Petray said. "I think the market is there to do even more. I'd be disappointed if it was under 4,000." They averaged 3,169.
No one should expect anything to be succesful in it's opening year, that is just unrealistic in any business venture. I do feel for the ownership though, when they signed on they had San diego, Monterrey and Dallas a bit closer than Chicago and St. Louis. I hope they give it at least another year. One year just is not long enough.
Well that is what the Storm organization wanted aswell, and you'd figure we would average that since this is CHicago, but no dice if you dont market. If Stockton is out next year what will it be used for? A barn for farm equipment? If they only built the stadium alittle, just a tad closer to a real city more people would show up. I mean its in the middle of no where, SanJose and Sacramento are like over an hour away.
But at least the Storm are putting up a bit of a fight and trying to get more seasons in instead of giving it a year and saying 'oh well'. I really hope Chicago makes it to next season despite what may have been reported on the board. With the Stockton Thunder having their first season this year and leading the ECHL in attendance could put negative thoughts in the Cougars' owners minds. http://www.echl.com/stats_archive/index.shtml Click on 2005 - 2006 Statistics link. The Thunder was able to draw 6,343 average per game. The Cougars were able to draw just over half that. Maybe, if they make it to next season, they can have a "Beat the Blast" promotion like the Thunder did against the Blades.
No surprise here. Quite frankly though now is not the time for a California team. Too much travel. At least Detroit will replace them. *Crosses fingers* ~King
Again, nothing new here. This goes to the lack of leadership from The Great Commissioner Steve Ryan. He's an idiot. Look for the same type of article to come from the Chicago Storm after the post season, and the Detriot Ignition after next season. You just can't have poor ownership in any sport. Ryan must have said something to the effect of turning a quick dollar, because new investors will always show up for the MISL. Probelem is, they won't stay around. The fact that BALTIMORE and Cleveland has been successful throughout the years is predicated on good ownership, that takes what Ryan says with a box of salt. The time for a new commissioner is now. Impeach that fraud Steve Ryan. SHAME
Cleveland? They are history. If Chicago goes, that's it. It's just a pony league now. Bring on the Syd league!
Funny how the Storm was predicted not to even begin play last season yet they did. SanDiego, Monterrey fold....Storm survives 2004-05 season. KC and Cleveland fold at season's end....Storm survives off season The Storm are predicted by many including the honorable Ed "GOD" Hale to fold just before or during the 2005-06 season and yet they survive and make the playoffs. California threatens to fold the Steamers have problems paying their players and yet the Storm is the brunt of all that is wrong with the MISL according to some "insiders" and not so insiders. The Storm is looking forward to playing in a new stadium next year closer to their target fanbase and yet they are liars. Anything that is positive coming out of the Storm camp is a lie according to the Blast...err I mean "insiders" on this board. Bottom line is that Chicago is looking forward to next season at a new arena and it will be make or break for them. I have never seen the Storm owners publicly cry about attendance and threaten to pull the plug. Who cares what Hale says. Hale should worry about beating Milwaukee in the playoffs and not worry about the Storm. California is on the verge of shutting down and we still see idiotic threads like "Chicago is an embarassment"....It is the idiots on these boards who spread false rumors and half-truths that are the true embarassmant! The Storm will be at the Sears Centre next season while the Blast play in their hell-hole of building. Go Storm
Say what you want about "their hell-hole of a building," because it is the most profitable arena in the MISL. And the way Mr. Hale has things set up, that will continue for a long time to come. I've said this before, but it's worth repeating. The actual newness of any arena is a nice touch, but it doesn't neccessarily translate into success or profit. Just ask the California Cougars (those frauds). Ask the St. Louis Steamers (Family Center). Hell, ask the Pittsburgh Pirates and the Milwaukee Brewers. New Stadiums/arenas are no longer a given for success. Therefore, that "hell-hole" that the BLAST play in draws big crowds and brings in lots of money. That's called having a buisness plan for success, something the pitiful Chicago Storm knows nothing about. SHAME
Yes, but aren't you the same person who argue that the Storm was a failure because of their lousy arena in a lousy part of town in other posts? You can't have it both ways
Actually the Pirates have turned a profit every year in PNC Park. They have not had a winning season there (or the last 13 seasons) but they have turned profits. Profits in the millions of dollars also. This year they will go even higher since the All-Star game will be hosted in Pittsburgh. From the owners point of view, yes the new stadium is a success.
Most baseball teams do make money mostly because they stiff the fans and put out a terrible product. The Orioles are an example of this though Angelos blabs on about losing money (though most doubt he really does lose). As far as the MISL goes, a new arena doesn't do jack squat. ~King
Not true. As I've said before, the Brewers nor the Pirates turn a legitimate profit. What they call profit, is actually unspent PAYROLL. Both teams are amongst the bottom 5 in payroll; THEY DON'T SPEND MONEY. You can call it profit, but you're just misleading yourself. The BALTIMORE ORIOLES doen't turn a profit. But they do have a $75 million dollar payroll. If they used the Pirates or the Brewers plan, they would would have a profit of around 30 - 40 million. Do the math. Those teams won't spend money. Hell the Florida Marlins will also make money this year. They have a payroll of $17 million. Now, the ORIOLES can go that route and be profittable, but who are you fooling. Only a smart buisness plan will make you money in sports these days. New stadiums/arenas are nice, but doesn't translate into turning a profit and success. PS: New stadiums/arena doesn't translate into turning a profit, unless you do some bootleg accounting, like the Brewers and Pirates.
Soccerman, it's still profit even if it is unspent. Business people in all walks of life will cut payroll to increase profit, or won't add people when they should. ~King
Maybe, but you do see my point. If the Pirates and the Brewer even attempted to act like a marginal major league team, they would lose the shirts off of their back. Downsizing to upsize the profit margins is a poor accounting trick to make money. The catch22 of the whole thing, is that by doing this, you are only alienating one of your future sources of income...................................the fans
Hey I would love to see the Pirates spend more, a lot more on pitching, but until MLB comes up with a minimum amount required to spend on payroll what you say is untrue. There is no requirement for a team to spend $100 million on players. To turn a profit you want to make more money than you spend. Though I am not happy with it, that is what the Pirates have done. It is not "bootleg accounting". It is doing what they have to do to get the owners the result they desire, the "smart business plan" you mentioned. In this case, they would rather make money instead of fielding a winning team that might have a chance for the playoffs. No matter how you cut it, there will always be teams in the bottom 5 in payroll. With your theory, even if a bottom 5 MLB team makes money, maybe even win the World Series, they will not turn a legitimate profit. That would be false. Profit is profit, how they do it is moot. I totally agree with you about new stadiums/arenas will not generate profit. It is up to the teams in those stadiums/arenas to field teams that are competitive to draw in fans. Or cut expenses to the point that they can turn a profit with the income they generate.
Hey, if paying major league prices to see AA baseball is your thing, have at it. The ORIOLES are bad, but at least they are a bad major league team. A salary cap? OK. I highly doubt that a bottom 5 payroll team will win the World Series. You know better than that. Come on now, you arguement have been fairly intelligent up until this point. Now, will a new arena help the pitiful Storm, with that business plan (or lack there of) they have. I think NOT.
I don't know what the Storm's business plan is but the new arena is probably going to help at least in the short term. Teams usually experience better attendance in a new arena. The Sears Centre will help publicize the team, and the Daily Herald, a newspaper that reaches many suburbanites, is far more likely to cover games played in a new suburban arena. Of course, once the novelty of the Sears Centre wears off, attendance is likely to diminish. I do see some hopeful signs with the Storm. Attendance picked up in the second half of the season. Many youth soccer groups were coming out to see games. The team had a mailing list and they were contacting people on the list by e-mail and sometimes by phone in an effort to sell tickets. There were also some pretty good promotions. No question there is still a long way to go, but at least there were some positive signs during the second half of the season. I give credit to Brian Loftin and his staff for their efforts.
That is one of the most stupid things I've ever read in my life. Please show me the guidelines on what a professional sports team should and shouldn't spend on payroll.
Except for the fact that the Brewers drew more than 2 million in both 2004 and 2005, and they had sold over 1 million tickets for the 2006 season as of Thursday, March 2nd (1 month before the season even started).
It's only stupid, because it's YOU that's trying to decipher it. Well, I'll try to restate my point, only slower this time, so you can keep up. OK, here we go. The Brewers and Pirates do not spend money. Therefore most of what they generate will be profit. They annually have payrolls in the bottom five of the league. No, they won't win because they don't spend for talent. They choose not to operate beyond a AAA level team, therefore they pocket money that MOST teams put back into operating cost. Now I know that baseball doesn't have any set rules, so it's not illegal, but it is transparent, cheap and a slap in the face to the fans. I don't know how to make that any more clearer.
Actually the Pirates spending is right in line with there attendance average, 27th in payroll (2006) and 27th in attendance (2005). Looks like proper front office management to me. Now with the Brewers, yes they are screwing their fans, in a way. They are 25th in payroll (2006) but 18th in attendance (2005). Then again, it is the owners and front office staff to decide how much they wish to spend. Payroll figures are from http://blog.sportscolumn.com/story/2006/4/6/71549/05924 and attendance figures are from http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/attendance?sort=home_avg&year=2005&seasonType=2 The team that is making the biggest killing is the Marlins. Last in payroll and 28th in attendance. If the Pirates are making a profit spending only $40,234,833 on player payroll, the Marlins must be rolling in money with paying only $14,998,500 in player payroll.