Hamas Attacks, Israel Responds

I mean I just never heard it's simple. Nothing in life is really simple, not in diplomacy and not in the Middle East. I mean there are countless jokes about a genie granting any 3 wishes except peace in the ME. In any case, it was a silly point on my part to debate.

 

That probably depends how far you go in history. After all, we live in the least violent time in the history of the world.

 

This is a map of the supposed final proposal. It definitely looks more like 70-75% which is what has me confused about this 95% number.

https://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/map-of-the-israeli-offer-for-west-bank-final-status

 

B/c if it was easy, it would have been done already. B/c multiple peace deals have failed. If either the what or the how was easy, then the entire process would be easy. If any of the components is hard, the whole thing is hard.

 

I am a bit conflicted on this. On the one hand it's not Chad's job to call out all jew haters equally. But on the other hand the wider failure to say one word about the actual nazis around the likely next president calls me to doubt the good faith of some of the rhetoric - and if you actually vote for those people - well good night and good luck.

 

I get arguing about borders is popular in these parts but that is not what is under discussion in current talks. We are just nowhere near that place. What Biden is trying to pull off is something to de-escalate the current war and regional tensions, so that years from now, such discussions could even happen. It's important to realise there are. only bad options on the table right now - so they look for the least bad one

The Biden deal places all the costs on the regional actors, but the problem really is the political pill that Bibi is unlikely to want to swallow

Israel is thought to want the Saudi normalisation which is the carrot. The problem is a lack of offramp. Bibi needs a political win to declare victory and go home. Especially seeing as he can't deliver on his foolish maximalist war aims. There is a split in leadership on whether to free the hostages via a political solution (clearly the only way to do it).

On the other side the deal requires a cease fire and a definitive pathway to statehood hence the early international recognition plan. I think people are confusing this with the idea that there would be a state anytime soon. Obviously there will need to be stability and security long before that becomes possible

One of the big problems is that in reality, Hamas or some form of it, will remain and politically Israel's leadership obviously can't 'reward' them.

As usual with wars, it is hard to get either side to face up to their strategic defeat.

 

Following up on my question from October - will Trump let Mike Johnson pass the Israel Aid through the house?

Soon it will be 5 months of waiting. Seems bad. I guess the GOP isn't a great friend of Israel these days.

Guess who is sending weapons to Israel. The leftists Biden and Scholz.

As noted anti-semite Bill Kristol wrote, the left has never been more supportive of Israel.

 

It's hard because even if an Israeli leadership that is willing to do a 2 state solution, they'd need very good guarantees that all attacks from a Palestinian land would stop. Attacks from the West Bank would be hard for Israel to defend and leaves them exposed. Mind you, they are coming from a place where multiple Palestinian leadership (and the Arab neighbors) have stated that Israel should not exist. That was the starting point and status quo for a long time.

 

That's exactly what I mean.

Many times there is no way to force political leadership to acknowledge strategic defeat - so it's easier for them to simply continue along even though they can't achieve their objectives via military means.

 

You've been following what happened in Cal and UCSB over the last few days? My niece (through 2nd cousin) is a student body president there and what she describes is pretty horrific.

 

Last night at @UCBerkeley, Jewish students were threatened, assaulted, and prevented from attending a speech by a Jewish speaker on campus. Campus police shut down this private event when it became clear that they could not protect the students. Multiple students reported being… pic.twitter.com/FKidts1FvZ

— JCRC Bay Area (@SFJCRC) February 27, 2024

In California Jewish students were rushed to safety from pro-Pals protesting an IDF reservist giving a talk. One student was called “Jew, Jew, Jew” and spat at. The windows were smashed while the protesters chanted “long live the intifada”. Madness.pic.twitter.com/lrEUNhnsOE

— Heidi Bachram 🎗️ (@HeidiBachram) February 27, 2024

https://www.latimes.com/california/...t-organized-by-jewish-students-at-uc-berkeley
https://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local/east-bay/berkeley-gaza-protest/3465723/

I realize some posters here think all Pro-Palestinian protestors are only there to call out for peace and injustice, but the facts paint a completely different story. I'm not saying all of them are anti-semitic, but a LARGE portion of them are indeed that.

There are incidents of pro-Palestine crowds invading synagogues in Florida and interrupting services. We kind of stopped posting these links here, but the amount of Semitic attacks hasn't decreased at all.

 

I am fully fine with expelling all bigots, nazis and fascists who engage in this kind of behaviour.