Gm #26: Chicago v LA - 7 September, 7:30 PM CDT [R]

Discussion in 'Chicago Fire' started by NotAbbott, Sep 4, 2002.

  1. Fanaddict

    Fanaddict Member+

    Mar 9, 2000
    streamwood IL USA
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States


    Except close only counts in horseshoes.

    We lead the league in hitting the post and coming close to scoring. It doesn't mean a thing, give me one guy who actually puts the ball in the net not looks good, comes close all the time.
     
  2. All four woodwork shots last night bounced down or across the goal.

    You don't watch us much, do you? :)
    In '98 Razov hit the post three straight games, Game 2 against LA, MLS Cup '98 & the USOC Final. Back in those days we won those kinds of games. Razov has to be far and away the MLS all-time leader in woodwork struck.

    Also we hit the post twice in MLS Cup 2k, without Razov.

    You must have been getting a beer or taking a whiz - in the second half Razov hit the post.
    Thanks, if only the FIRE players on the field could finish games so well . . . .
     
  3. jdm2662

    jdm2662 New Member

    Aug 6, 2002
    Hillside, IL
    For the record, I sat through every Bears games during all those seasons in the 90s when they were awful. It was painful to watch, but I still did. When it comes to my teams, I am no fair weather fan.

    As for my comment about last night, well I'm that pissed off. It doesn't mean I'm going to stop being a Fire fan. I just might opt to watch the Bears game instead that day.
     
  4. BrianJames

    BrianJames Member

    Jul 30, 2000
    Chicago
    -I just don't understand why Bob Bradley can't make a sub before the 75th minute. Marsh, Nowak, Hristo, Vaud...old, old, old, old...so where's the fresh legs to protect the lead and rest the old men?!?! Game after game we blow early leads, and game after game Bob refuse's to make the needed sub.

    -Kovalenko has peaked as a player unless he grows a brain in the offseason.

    -Not much else you can complain about this game, this one of the best games I've seen the Fire play this year. Some bad luck along with some superb clutch finishing by Ruiz did us in.
     
  5. GoHawks4

    GoHawks4 Member

    Apr 24, 2002
    Chicago
    Club:
    Liverpool FC
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Now let's not say things we can't take back.
     
  6. Pyro

    Pyro Member

    Apr 18, 2000
    Fulton River District
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    My .02:

    Dema, enjoy the bench, Grey enjoy the start.
    - Isn't this overdue? Bradly sits Grey after 2 or three lackluster starts and stick with Kovalenko for the entire lackluster season?

    I think Bradley's personnel decisions HAVE to come into question now.
    The Grey/Stiotch sub was idiodic. Curtin should have come in. With all the free kicks and corners the FIRE had in the last 15 minutes, a fresh Curtin would have been a potent weapon. Subs have been questionable all year, especially when our side became healthy and Bradleys hands were not tied. I trace this shortcoming back to the questionable start of Henry Ring in goal for the Milwaukee Open Cup games. The lack of Zack in that one was the difference.
     
  7. TravisMinor_23

    TravisMinor_23 New Member

    Oct 16, 2001
    United States
    Honestly? There need to be some wholesale changes in the offseason. The first needs to be saying goodbye to Hristo. The biggest mistake Wilt made was trading away Guitierez and keeping Hristo (one of them had to go for salary purposes). It is also time for Dema to go, he had some fine days here, and I'll bet there are a few teams who would gladly take him off our hands (although personally I'd rather see him go play in Ukraine and the Fire get a big allocation, say, ohh, the next Donovan). Something also has to be done about the forward situation, obviously Hristo is over the hill, but even before Wolff went down the offense wasn't exactly a machine. I think either Razov or Wolff have to go (I really don't care which), both have a decent amount of market value and would help us clear some more cap room. Whitfield coming back will help, Boca and CJ are solid, but I wouldn't mind us bringing in another big time defender to play the left side (please, no more Perez) and having Curtin rotate in at the middle spots.
    I hear Gooch had his contract voided with Metz, my dream scenario is that we miss the playoffs (honestly, we'll get killed there anyways), Dema transfers to a Ukranian team and we claim Gooch with our allocation pick....ok, ok, but I can dream can't I?
     
  8. Bayernfan

    Bayernfan Member

    Mar 7, 2000
    Atlanta, GA
    Anyone who watched that game would've been able to tell you that Dema wouldn't make it past the 60th minute. Even after he picked up that yellow card, he continued to play like a maniac; Dema has got to be the stupidest player in club history. I was hoping that Bob would realize that and sub him out at halftime for Gray. This way, we would've been able to hold on to the one man advantage.

    Dema has really become a cancer and has contributed almost nothing to the club this season. I can remember at least 9-10 times watching the Fire this season and not even realizing he was playing until 65-70 minutes into the action. He's either non-existant or pyschotic, but rarely a positive contributor to the Fire's efforts.
     
  9. genpabloescobar

    Feb 17, 2002
    After watching the game and thinking about the game, all I can think of Blake's immortal words in Glengarry Glen Ross, "Coffee is for closers."
     
  10. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    I too was in Section 8 and I didn't think for a second that he was offsides.

    But then again we decide that the 85th minute of a 1-1 game is the best time to "get those 15 flags up" so who knows. Absolute stupidity on and off the field.

    I just don't want to get led on. The losing is one thing. The carrot on a string of MAYBE finally playing with a freaking clue is what gets me.
     
  11. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    I agree on both.

    Dema is a god damn head case. As soon as he hit the crossbar in the 13th minute he was out of it.

    Maybe if he hadn't been running late to the game he would have gotten his head in gear.
     
  12. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    on the contrary, someone like DMB was given the golden opportunity to use some of his speed and he didn't do a damn thing.

    the ref was VERY consistent in calling all jersey pulling and arm rips all night. on both teams.

    ask Ezra Hendrickson.

    yet we didn't do a damn thing with it. surprise surprise considering who we had out there.
     
  13. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    No I am too. While for some reason everyone was cheering him when he left, I was cheering him BECAUSE HE WAS LEAVING.
     
  14. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    very good post with very good points.

    at some point there has to be some blame put on a coaching staff that has and has always had a reputation for fielding teams that give up the most goals in the last 15 minutes of games.

    unacceptable. simply unacceptable.
     
  15. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    having the guys ready to play and having them ready to pick it up over the last 15 minutes are 2 totally separate areas of team preparation.

    just ask Bob Bradley.
     
  16. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    I think we have severely over-estimated many of the personnel associated with this team.

    Players and coaches.
     
  17. quarterUltra

    quarterUltra Member

    Sep 10, 2000
    Stillwater, OK
    Club:
    Chicago Fire
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    [bitter rant]
    ARGH! Screw it. We don't deserve to be in the playoffs.
    Fire all of 'em.
    ARGH!
    [/bitter rant]
     
  18. jdm2662

    jdm2662 New Member

    Aug 6, 2002
    Hillside, IL
    I was cheering when Hristo was taken out, for the same reasons. He was no longer going to be on the field.

    I'd keep Gray, CJ, Zack, Boca, and Curtain. I'd let Nowak play one more year to finish his career with the Fire. At this point, I could care less if they got rid of everyone else.

    As much as Dema is dumb, I still think Razov is dumber. Dema has never been tossed from a game when he wasn't even playing!
     
  19. NotAbbott

    NotAbbott Member

    Oct 11, 1999
    My Own Little World
    While I agree that close shots don't win games, you're begrudging guys on misplays of maybe an inch or less, on the shot side. I'm hesitant to condemn anybody on those grounds.

    Later,
    COZ
     
  20. kebzach

    kebzach Member

    Dec 30, 2000
    Greenfield, WI
    I'm not.

    Rule #1 is put shots on goal that must be saved. In that regard, I'm less upset at the 8/24 dribbler that Kelly Gray hit in the 89th minute than I am at any of the 4 players (Dema, Boca, Ante, Peter) who hit the post/crossbar last night.
     
  21. Thomas Flannigan

    Feb 26, 2001
    Chicago
    I can't remember the last time the Fire had a PK awarded. Can someone refresh my memory? I can think of at least 8 that were let go. I was too far awayto see if Dema dived, but there was one right in front of us in Section 8 where a Fire player was about to cross the ball, inside the box, and was two-handed out of bounds. No PK.
    I could not tell if the winning goal was offside. My angle again was not good.
    Section 8 rocked. We have some new faces and lots of old ones as well. Thanks to the leaders to get rid of the YSA for now. We heckled Hartman anyway. He turned around and looked at Marcin just before he shanked the goal kick out of bounds. Still, a strong game by Hartman.
     
  22. NotAbbott

    NotAbbott Member

    Oct 11, 1999
    My Own Little World
    But look what he's had to work with. The mind may be willing, the bodies may be weak. Who is our best player, historically, when it comes to 90 minutes of focused intensity? Chris Armas. Or a two-games-back-from-injury Peter Nowak. Jesse's still giving his all, but he's only one guy, and still isn't up to the level of Armas. Vaud worked his butt off last night as well.

    We've always had guys who are prone to lapses in concentration, but there are two major differences this year. First, we've also had other guys to compensate. On top of Armas, Daniv and Whitfield also apply a lot of pressure in the midfield. Which leads to the second point. If memory serves, we've faced more shots this year than ever before. Which means we're not stopping attacks in the midfield nearly as often as we're used to. If you look at the game summary, L.A. strung together three or four passes before springing Ruiz for the game-winner. Our defense is under attack a lot more, and that lack of midfield support may be a bigger factor than we realize.

    The only thing I think we can do right now is to take advantage of Dema's absence on the right side of midfield by getting a smarter defensive player in there who can still push into attack. I know a lot of people would like to see Gray, but I'm actually thinking Vaudreiul is the best option right now.

    Later,
    COZ
     
  23. genpabloescobar

    Feb 17, 2002
    Here's my thoughts on why the Fire doesn't get PK's...and, as much as I hate to blame the refs, I have to give them partial responsibility. I think the big problem is that Fire players have a reputation for diving. Dema got called for it yesterday, and like other posters said, Hartman didn't get a hand on him, and he's been called for it before. And Stoitchkov and Nowak and others also have a repuation for embellishment. So the refs are really making sure that the Fire earned it.

    I think the other problem is that our offense isn't conducive to drawing PK's. Our typical offensive set up is bringing the ball to the 20, then passing it around trying to break through the bunker. There isn't much opportunity to draw blatant fouls that would be called. I bet most of the PK's the Fire has drawn over the years have been on the occasional break-away counter.

    But, maybe I'm wrong...that's just my impression.
     
  24. jdm2662

    jdm2662 New Member

    Aug 6, 2002
    Hillside, IL
    I think the Fire have had three pks this season. One was pretty shaky call, one was a handball, and one was a break away that Wolff had. I'm a ref, and you have to earn your PKs.

    Here's a memo, quite diving in the box and finish the play.
     
  25. jjayg

    jjayg New Member

    May 9, 2002
    Rolling Ghettos, IL
    Everythings been covered here. No sense in drudging most of it up again. Mac I met you before the game with my kids outside of Jimmy's when I was picking up tickets. So you have my ugly mug to remember.
    Thanks to the big guy who was standing next to me in section 8, I hit some serious depression after the second goal and was ready to give up but the guy next to me kept on singing and after a minute or two I was able to carry on. I can't take much more of this, but of course I will. That's what being a soccer fan is about. Love it or leave it.

    The only additional contribution I will make is speculation on why Jim Curtain didn't play. He is one yellow card point away from missing a game and the Crew game is much more important then the Galaxy game was. Perhaps Bob held him out to have him for Columbus. Just a guess. I asked Jim after the game if that was the reason and he said "nah, I donno the reason" but I still think that was it. It's all I can come up with. We need these last two. Six points nothing less, or it's not worth it at all. I want the team to make the playoffs and make a strong showing, just like section 8 always makes a strong showing. See you all in Columbus.
    Beerman, I want to make at least one trip to Champaign this year, I will say hello in C-bus and we can see what we can see on that idea.

    Soccer is a cruel, cruel game. That's just the way it is. One more agreement, that first half was absolutely wonderful to see.
     

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