Ok then...that Derby County was his best choice says quite a bit as well. Benny looks like a decent player. And he shows flashes of being a very good player. But only the USMNT seems eager to play the guy at this point. And I don't have much faith in the possibility that the USMNT knows something the EPL and Bundesliga doesn't.
Sorry to speak for "most of you" but it's pretty clear that the most vocal among us have been bullish on Benny for quite a while now. Maybe there are lots of people like me who weren't overly excited by what they saw in him but quietly sat back and hoped for the best.
I meant I don't know how good is "how good" not how many are most of us. Hamburg were pretty keen on Benny. He moved to get PT and it was an ill conceived move in my opinion. I don't know how we will know how good he is until he get regular PT someplace. But he clearly has promise. He was very good in Holland and has obviously shown the ability at times, but without a good spell of first team action there is no good way to know.
I would have thought that a manager willing to sign him would also play him when the team has been abysmal. Maybe Benny's not that great; maybe he could come into form. Who knows? Apparently, Davies would rather go down with the ship than give him a few games. [Cue mighty rams telling me not to question the gaffer and Jaypro just an echo behind.]
Howard didn't have anything to do. Did he even get his jersey dirty?! Comfortable victory, hopefully the same again against Luton Town on Wednesday and we'll be in the Carling Cup Quarter Final. And to whoever said Baines is crap! Erm, why?!
if you want to play Neanderthal soccer, Benny is not too good. If you want to play possession, cultured soccer, he is very good.
His problem is, however, that he goes for the killer pass too often when the simpler short ball to a supporting player would be better. Also, as was abundantly revealed in the game against Switzerland, his tight space possession skills are highly flawed. This is where the frequently applied appellation that he is the second coming of Claudio Reyna absolutely falls apart. It will, of course, be argued that Feilhaber was out of position on the flank. Of course that is true, but it's also beside the point. Playing there completely revealed his inability to work under tight pressure. Playing elsewhere would not improve that ability.
I think this comment is overdone, but so was Bruce S.'s comments as well (shocker! ) He's a work-in-progress, and we don't know how good or bad the movie will turn out. Like a lot of good young players, he needs to make a leap or 2 here within the next year, or red flags (as far as how far he really can go w/career) will be raised. Too soon to judge definently- different players have different growth curves. I will agree that if we are having a similar conversation about Feilhaber a year from now...his ceiling will be much more clear to us. We should see good progress in the next 12 months.
Maybe they picked up Benny with an eye to next year? Davies has called him a "project," and he must have known as well that, without a lot of money, they'd have been a longshot to stay up.
But Davies penchant for playing players he knows is exactly the point. Oakley's his captain and Pearson played for him in Scotland. Just like Lewis, he likes to go with guys he knows. It's pretty natural. And the bottom of the EPL is still a crowded place. Davies can go down and it's no great disaster as they really hadn't planned on going up just yet. So he's not going to punch the panic button yet, esp. since he's kept it fairly close in the last 4. As the pack starts to open up there will be more pressure to try something, but even then that "something" may not be Benny. I have no idea how Benny has been doing in training, but even if he's been as good as the best of Benny, he doesn't really fit into the Derby line-up easily and his best skill set are not the things Derby is looking for right now. When Davies bought Benny he might have had some illusions of being able to play a fluid midfield with Benny playing an inside right/holding spot on an unbalance 4 or might have thought he would be able to play Pearson outside or platoon his team as he went deep into the cup ... or who knows. But the reality is, Benny at this point is cover and until things really get to the point that Davies has to gamble and has little to lose, I don't see Benny playing a big part. Maybe Davies will trade him for a striker in January with someone who can use him. Or maybe Benny will learn to get stuck in and disrupt and he and mikey will rule the midfield in ankle-breaking fashion.
I wouldn't be surprised, although Pearson's only 25 or so, Jones is young, Barnes is young (and another guy with Davies history - look for him to get minutes before Benny too. But Oakley is around 30, Lewis (while not direct comp. obviously) is not young. Is Teale still on the squad, he's old too, so sure, maybe Davies was thinking of Benny for the future, but my point would be that if you're Benny, why pick sitting through a relegation campaign to play in the Cola? If you're looking to play Cola, or even lower end EPL in 08-09, why not go straight to the Cola today where you're going to start? Confidence is a nice thing and I'm sure Benny thought he was going to come in a earn a spot quickly, but when Davies already has 3 players in the middle of the park that he's got history with, and the three are fairly highly rated, I don't really understand the move. Oh well. I'm pretty much beating a dead horse here. Derby will play out the season and end up where they end up and Benny will have to figure it out for himself.
Agreed.. I don't even think the raving about Benny among US fans would be nearly as high if it weren't for his wonderstrike against Mexico.
Let's simplify this. I think Feilhaber is good enough to play regularly for a low to middle Prem team. I think he is better than Eddie Lewis right now. The fact that he doesn't play at Derby tells me: 1. I am wrong; 2. Davis is wrong; or 3. the fit isn't right (e.g. Javier Mascherano can't play at West Ham but can't be dislodged from the lineup at Liverpool?). Time will tell.
The problem I have is that Benny is 22. It's OK for Szetela, Nguyen, Adu, Zizzo, Ferrari, etc. to come off the bench, play reserve matches and learn their craft. (Well, Nguyen is getting to the point where he needs to play somewhere). These guys are 18-20 years old. Feilhaber is 22, and has played in 11 professional games. He's also never scored a professional goal. Period. To put things in perspective, Arturo Alvarez is also 22 and has played in 96 regular season MLS games (4790 minutes of experience). People in the schizo USMNT forums have been blasting Bob for playing Michael Bradley so much. The real question should be, what has Benny Feilhaber done to become an automatic starter. The guy scored one great goal in the Gold Cup Final, and that's his career. Sure, I think he's a kid with some potential. But right now its just potential. It was telling to me what Benny's options were after the summer tournaments.
I always wonder why he didnt stay at Hamburg... I think he had more of a shot there than he is showing now at Derby...
That is something that he should work on, and from the Switzerland match, it looks to me like he is improving in that area. I just have no idea how one could naturally come to that conclusion from watching that match. How many times did he have a giveaway that was caused by this "highly flawed...inability to work under tight pressure"? Let's switch gears for a second. In the Mexico match (GC final), Benny made a nice play against two defenders and the sideline which freed Bornstein for his, uh, "famous" shot into the side netting. How many players in the current US pool have the ability to make that play. Wasn't that tight enough pressure for you? The second coming of Reyna? No, he is a different style of player. Those who've made that comparison (and I may have even said that in the distant past, but if so, I was mistaken) are wrong, but not for the reason you cite. As for his form since Copa America, I think that his playing out of position is not what has led to his problems. I think it's much simpler than that: he needs playing time. In my view, his play has actually improved over the last two friendlies when compared to the Sweden match. I thought he was pretty awful that day, but he's been able to play much tidier football against Brazil and even moreso, in my view, against Switzerland. As an aside, I think he could play on the right and even be an effective contributor from there. In other words, it looks to me like he's not in form because he's rusty, and this is the ultimate reason why this move may not be good for him. Of course, it took Dempsey a long time to break into a relegation-battler, as well, so I'm inclined to wait it out for a while. He may never break into this team, but we can't be sure of that right now or anytime in the immediate future, in my opinion.
I think you're confusing the ravings of a very small but very vocal minority with the general consensus, as is easy to do on the internet. I, for one, have been a believer in Benny's potential since the Netherlands U-20's, but I don't think anyone could honestly say that what I've typed and said about him could be taken as the kind of over-the-top hyperbole which you seem to reference. As an aside re: "the goal", I don't believe many are taking that as the source for their enthusiasm. I know for me, at least, that it was a great moment for US Soccer, but not at all the kind of play that I expect from Benny. More like a bonus, and not the reason that you have him on the field.
I do, too. Or that it could still be a while before Davies knows how best to use him, and before Benny knows what Davies really wants from him, et cetera. Again, a lot of players have taken a long time to settle into a new situation, especially if that new situation is a new league and new country, and then gone on to have great years at those clubs. As you say, time will tell.
I think that here it's constructive to look at the careers of Reyna and O'Brien. It was right around Benny's current age that Reyna really became a legitimate first-team player in Germany, with his loan to Wolfsburg. He was able to step right in and take control of that team's midfield, so the comparison is flawed, but we should remember that he had been training with a much better squad and playing in the reserves and making the first team's bench in the same league before this time, so the adjustment period would have been much shorter. O'Brien's case is a little trickier due to his residence in the Ajax youth system, but followed a similar trajectory in terms of senior clubs. He was about 21, if I remember right, when he was loaned to Utrecht, where he made his senior club debut. He made something like 20 appearances there before returning to Ajax and really breaking into their first team at the age of - you guessed it - 22. As far as the questions surrounding Benny's and Michael's playing time and your claim that the goal against Mexico "is" Feilhaber's career, remember first that many wanted Benny to be first-choice before that goal ever happened. Since most of these people were basing their opinion of him solely on national team appearances (you know, it's tough to get Regionalliga Nord games on the telly in the US ), there must have been something else to his play other than said goal. Secondly, it's also worth noting that before this season, Benny and Michael's professional careers were much more alike than unalike. Michael had more matches, but in a team with a much shallower roster, and he had basically disappeared from Heerenveen's first team by the end of last season, making very few appearances in the second half of their campaign. This season, Mike has established himself as a first eleven player, but Benny was in a different situation and transferred to a new club. I just don't see how, by your standard, either one of them "deserves" to be a first-teamer for the US. As for me, I think each of them, based on their play for the US and not on their professional careers, should be among the top three at center mid. Now, of course, your concerns about his age aren't answered by the discussion of his and Michael's careers, but I think the question of whether either is deserving of their place in the US squad is. Michael isn't more deserving just because of his age. It gives him a longer potential career with the nats, but it really doesn't mean anything with regards to who should be playing now. All of which can be summed up by saying that I think if there is one great flaw among those on BigSoccer (including me), it is reactionism. We should probably be more willing to see how things play out with YA's club situations before deciding that one player is better than another or more deserving or whatever. This season might be a make or break year for Benny (then again, it might not). Let's all see how it plays out.
regime change http://football.guardian.co.uk/News_Story/0,,2201706,00.html Pearson back Davies (who, of course, backs the other Pearson.) He's sanguine about going down and believe even if they do Davies is the guy to bring them back up. And, off the top of my head, I think Mikey was still doing ok for apps in the 2nd half, it's just his minutes went way down - basically he became a 20 minute Bosvelt ... but I could be mismembering. He ended up with what, 25 apps or so and maybe a half dozen starts. So it was a much more active year than Benny, for a lower level club to be fair.
Or, 4) He's not Scottish (which is not the same thing as "he's crap!") Davies has surrounded himself with guys he knows. Benny is not one of them. Oakley and Pearson are good enough players that until Davies feet are really to the fire (which will be soon enough) or unless Benny does something extraordinary in his reserve, training or lucky 1st team minutes, he's going to be outside looking in. The one place that DAvies seems unsure is outside RM but I don't think Benny's going to be the guy there.
Looks like you're more right than wrong. I did a little research. I remembered a stretch where he didn't dress or at least didn't make an appearance for over a month, which did happen, but he appeared in 6 of the last twelve matches (starting on 2 February). Mostly as a late sub (his last start was the 2 February game). I still think the differences in their careers pre-2007/08 are way inflated by most, given the totality of their respective situations. But I do admit I was speaking from memory without checking for sure and mistakenly overstated that particular claim.
To be clear I wasn't trying to be a dick about it or anything (for once!). I think their situations were, for the most part, similar, or at least Benny's lower apps were evened out by degree of dificulty, tho Mikey is younger. The big difference is Bosvelt was on his way out and Mikey was in the plan to potnetially step into the midfield (Hansenn getting hurt didn't hurt Bradley either.) whereas Benny was facing more competition. But I agree with whoever thought Benny should have stayed at HSV. I think he had poisoned the waters a bit to much, despite HSV saying they wanted to keep him. Strasbourgh is lovely this time of year, but to be honest I don't know enough about them to know how Benny would fit in. Anyway, Pearson supposedly had a virus Sunday. Maybe he's down and out for a week or so and Benny gets a shot. Davies was pretty down on the "quality" last weekend. (Although I still think Oakely and Pearson are among the last Davies changes.)
You know, that Pearson sure runs a lot. I honestly don't know what anyone sees in him, but I should note that I've only seen him like 5 or 6 times. Oakley is a gritty bastard (as is Pearson), but I think an acceptable if far from transcendent Prem midfielder. As for the situation at HSV, it's tough to ever know what is really going on. One minute, the team are saying a player is done at the club. The next, they're saying he's in their plans and will feature in the first team. And before you know it, he's transferred. It does appear that HSV's midfield was about to break wide open. Had all this gone down 6 months ago, I think he would still be in Hamburg. All the references to Derby being Benny's only choice or best choice, I think, are also misinformed. Unless those posters are a lot more connected than I am, I just don't know how they know that. I'm pretty sure there were offers from Basel (which could offer UCL play) and Racing Strasbourg (which plays in the better league. If Benny chose Derby, it was his (and HSV's) choice. It may have been a mistake, but to claim that nobody wanted him is overzealous. As for your first paragraph, no offense was taken. I thought you were perfectly reasonable (as you say, for once ).