Fallujah pictures

No, I must be a typical Dutch non moslem citizen at this point in time. Pretty soon I suspect the streets of Amsterdam will look like that.

 

There, there.

 

What about those who had nowhere to go and were too poor to go there anyway?

 

You assume here a complete sense of helplessness. It sounds laudable, but it is condescending in the extreme.

I don't buy it. You've got to find options. Relatives of in-laws of relatives. At worst become a shelterless refugee if only for a time.

Get out.

Or hiding in places that are deserted (of which there appeared to be quite a few) that you know are not rife with jihadists, then surrendering to passing American troops to show you are not a threat.

Look, this is not as through we sprung a surprise attack.

 

There is some miniscule support, yes. Troops returning home have to stay on-base for awhile, and some psychological effort is put into bringing them back to normalcy - encouraging them to speak about what they saw, just to get it out, hoping that speaking will start internal healing.

I think that was a product of Vietnam. Iraq is not Vietnam. But the nature of the conflict, regarding civilian casualties from direct engagements, is more similar to Vietnam than any other US miltary action in many years.
Panama was minor - not many troops, no widespread devastation.
Grenada - see above
Afghanistan - not many troops in direct action, not many civilians got killed.
Somalia - not many troops, no widespread devastation.
Serbia - no ground troops

Iraq - soldiers killing enemy and civilains directly. A lot of them probably will feel OK about killing the enemy - but there are a lot of soldiers running checkpoints that probably don't feel so good about innocent civilians whose cars had bad brakes.

What happens to those guys when they come back?

Well, another difference from Vietnam is that the country is pretty united in support of the troops - when made, the babykiller accusations are levelled at politicians, not soldiers. That should also make a big difference.

Because if not, I'd hate to see a repeat of what happened in the postal service after Vietnam. The postal service preferentially hired many veterans from that conflict. Years later, multiple shootings inside the post office by unbalanced workers has created the term "going postal", and I don't think it was barking dogs that drove those mailmen over the edge.

 

To be honest, I think that's a site that people should look at. Being far from the war distances us, not just physically, but emotionally as well. You can hear newscaster after newscaster say what a horrible thing war is, but till you see pictures like those you really don't truly get it.

 

A lot of them will eventually end up in the streets, homeless...
(very sad, that)...

http://www.nchv.org/background.cfm

"How many homeless veterans are there?

Although accurate numbers are impossible to come by ... no one keeps national records on homeless veterans ... the VA estimates that more than 299,321 veterans are homeless on any given night. And, more than half a million experience homelessness over the course of a year. Conservatively, one out of every four homeless males who is sleeping in a doorway, alley, or box in our cities and rural communities has put on a uniform and served our country ... now they need America to remember them.


Demographics of homeless veterans
"The Forgotten Americans-Homelessness: Programs and the People They Serve" -- released Dec. 8, 1999, by the Interagency Council on the Homeless -- is the National Survey of Homeless Assistance Providers and Clients (NSHAPC), which was completed in 1996 and updated three years later. You can visit www.huduser.org and download the NSHAPC reports from there.

Veteran Specific Highlights:
23% of homeless population are veterans
33% of male homeless population are veterans
47% Vietnam Era
17% post Vietnam
15% pre Vietnam
67% served three or more years
33% stationed in war zone
25% have used VA Homeless Services
85% completed high school/GED compared to 56% of non-veterans
89% received Honorable Discharge
79% reside in central cities
16% reside in suburban areas
5% reside in rural areas
76% experience alcohol, drug, or mental health problems
46% white males compared to 34% non-veterans
46% age 45 or older compared to 20% non-veterans
Service needs:
45% help finding job
37% finding housing"





http://www.bellaonline.com/articles/art24611.asp
"The survey of more than 1,200 veterans was conducted in late October, 1997 by 58 Rescue missions around the nation. The veterans survey was part of IUGM's annual survey of America's homeless. Missions interviewed more than 11,000 men; of these, 32 percent were found to be veterans"

http://www.mcjonline.com/news/00b/20010102e.htm
"The findings "destroy the idea all the homeless are old and it's a chronic thing," Tony Cooper, executive director of the Jimmie Hale Mission in Birmingham, Ala., told "The Birmingham News." A third of the homeless were veterans, and almost half, in turn, had served in Vietnam"

 

Aid workers in Fallujah report on hundreds of wounded children and elderly people as well as mothers who can't nurse their babies because they haven't had anything to drink or eat for days. How are people like that supposed to find options? Is compassion an alien concept to you altogether?

 

Why am I not surprised that it's you who found and posted those pictures.

Does that website have any beheading videos?

 

Interesting. I did not know that.

 

Indeed. GW Bush should be forced to see a picture of every soldier, Iraqi or otherwise, and every civilian that is killed or injured in this war. Pictures of the dead and injured children should be blown up poster-sized and taped to the walls of the oval office.

I really doubt he understands - viscerally - the results of his decisions.

 

I get it. I've always gotten it. I don't need to see pictures to reinforce what I already know. It's the people who are gung-ho in support of this war who need to see the pictures.

 

What about the families of the insurgents who wanted to go but their fathers would not let them go.

 

If we did not totally support Israel the soldiers would all be home now. The Jews were smart enough to run for office when they arrived in the US. They have the powel in israel as well as in the US. Would the WTC still be here if we did not suppoet Israel?

 

What has any of that spewage got to do with pictures from the Iraq war?

 

Compassion?

Do you have any compassion for the mothers of the children who were blown up while eating ice cream by jihadist car bombers who got their succor and support in Fallujah?

Do you have any compassion for the families of the 45+ Iraqi security men who were slain excution style on the roadside? By the way, how many there were even wounded? Any word on that one?

Do you have any compassion for the innocent hostages who had their heads sawn off by a rusty knife, in Fallujah slaughter-rooms, and filmed for all to see and download?

Do you have any compassion for the families of the men who were disembowled and strung up on wire on the Fallujah bridge?

Look, I apologize for being a bit over the top on this, but it simply frosts me to no end when so many around here engage in what amounts to US bashing and fashionable terrorist chic.

We did everthing we possible could to warn civiilians and give them ample time to leave, EVEN if it led to some of the leadership escaping (a fact which many around here think is somehow evidence of more failure on our part, as opposed to a necessary tradeoff to get the job done).

Many many civilians took advantage of our approach, and got out. That some didn't or couldn't -- perhaps we will never know the real answer as to which -- is, frankly, a tragic unavoidability when you're trying to bring a city of 300,000 back from the death-causing abyss of jihadist fascistic sadistic fundamentalist fanatacism.

 

Tough talk coming from a soft white guy sitting on his ass in middle class American suburbia.

 

Fûck you, you gutless püssy.

 

Absolutely. That little worm really, really has no place here. This thread seems to be his coming out party and it's time for him to go if you ask me.

 

Just like the saying goes - those Jews, off the boats and right into elections!

 

So rather than deal with the thoughts and ideas, you would rather descend to the personal and the ad hominen?

I am shocked, shocked!!

By the way, this is one reason, amongst many others too obvious to enumerate, that you and other liberals/leftists like you are receding into marginality.

How does it feel??

 

How is 48% of the voter turn out marginal? The states that drive this countries economy are blue and always will be. After all, somebody's tax dollars have to support all the glorified welfare states that make up this beautiful land of ours.

 

Why isn't Loney barred from posting here any more? Attacking a poster for a post? The moderators here should dom they jobs.

Moderator if it is okay to post foul language to posters I would be more then happy to do this in the future.

If I see that guy still posting here I will do what he did 10 times more over.

 

You're confusing ad hominem attacks with confirmed facts.