Of course its all variable, but I think in the right situation a guy is likely to improve going to Europe. But, the evidence from performances with the US team are hardly overwhelming in supporting thast conclusion. In the 2002 cup, Donovan and Beasley were both MLS guys who showed they had no trouble playing against top level competition. Beasley's time in Europe sure hasn't seemed to help his play, and he even went someplace in PSV that many on here would figure to be as close to a perfect situationn as could be hoped for. McBride stayed pretty much the same player pre and post Europe...even had a stronger cup in 2002, although younger legs and better service probably played the biggest role. In 2006, Dempsey was arguably the guy who showed up most and he is playng MLS ball. Its really funny that I've read multiple times that Dempsey is the perfect example of why our guys need to go to Europe to be successful. Well, as an MLS player, he did quite well. There's no guarentee at all that if he goes to Europe he won't end up a part time squad player and have less confidence and be less effective. Donovan had a crappy cup after four more MLS years, but then again so did Reyna, a guy who's spent his entire career in Europe. There's no way to say four years in Europe wouldn't have still seen Landon bomb in 2006. We can only judge guys as to what they have actually done, not what we assume they would have done had they followed our preferences. Convey seems to be a rare expection as a field player that has made the jump and seems to be improving, although he was playing in Europe and he was ok in the cup, but certainly didn't stand out as anything special. If he plays like anything more than a solid but unexceptional winger in the Premiership this year I'll be pleasantly surprised. Maybe some of the guys over there now like Lee and Bradley will step up and tip the scales in favor of Europe, but so far, its just really hard to point to strong examples of players who have gone there and gotten much better. Why? I don't know, but I think it really does come down to the individual situation and each individual player's mentality. If a guy can go to Europe and be happy living there and play on a team where he fits the style of play and gets plenty of minutes, he's bound to improve. Anything less is more likely to hurt him than help.
...and neither is Europe. Did you watch Watford/West Ham last week? It was the same or worse than MLS. Long ball after long ball and horrible first touches. Fulham is another team that always shows just how bad Premiership football can be. I seriously think DC could stay up in the EPL. So many advocates of European football are skewed by the elite big money Champions League teams. That is a small group. When you get past that, there isn't much of a gap between MLS. Also, there are many leagues worse than MLS. How is this a negative? Football is their job. If a player can't handle the schedule than they don't deserve to be in an elite league. If they're getting old or worn out, it's time to retire or move on. Consistently playing meaningful league and cup matches over a long season will lead to a better player than the meaningless shorter MLS season. Of course you have to throw playing time and league quality into the equation, but I don't think many European players are hoping to go to MLS because of the vacation packages (except Djorkaeff). Anyway, the simple fact is DMB needs to play. If he's going to sit at PSV, he needs to leave. If his only option is MLS, fine. As a US fan, I'm not convinced that having all our guys in Europe equals WC results. If they are good enough to start consistently, then by all means they should play at the highest level and get the most money possible.
Wow, not your usual BS analysis. Do you write professionaly? I don't know if I want to look into Convey's soul or see DMB's damp spot, though.
i'm torn on the issue and have yet to find a way to come to a conclusion: 1. the nats will be better with more players at big clubs playing in big games 2. MLS will be better with the top american players playing in the league. Because in the long run if the best American talent can play top level soccer at home I'd be all for that ... I want to see them when I watch MLS games. so, really ... I don't know. If the player's happy in MLS like Landon, I'm happy too. If he's happy in Europe like Bobby, good for him. If Bease wants to come back, I'm fine with it. It would be interesting to see if would be a Landon-like move (i.e. permanent until proven otherwise) or a Gibbs-like move (springboard to something else once his form rounds into shape)?
If the USSF ever hires a coach who won't play his out of form favorites, then you will see the results. In other words, a stinking Donovan is no different than a stinking Beasley. There are bad players to be found anywhere.
i think people who get angry or w/e because players want to come back to mls to play infront of and be with their family are very cold hearted and its sadthat players cant play were ever they want without critisism. i hope beasly does come just to piss those people off
I'd have played Dempsey on the right and Mapp or Convey on the left; Reyna and Lewis as deep central mids; Ching, Casey or Wolff with McBride on top; 4-4-2 Box with Wings formation.
absolutely. the problem with dmb isn't psv, or holland, or the euro experience. he moved in, proved he could handle the pace, the game, etc. For a solid year+ he did very well. and for half a season last year, he was mostly fine. He broke down for some reason. Maybe this wouldn't have happened in MLS, but I doubt it. He was not being spit out by the euro machine during his entire time with psv. And moving from chicago is not what caused his performance in this past cup. No idea why, but this happens, often, to players. the great ones work through bad spells, slumps and become better players. the rest bounce around, hoping to catch lightning again. some actually do.
Beasley didn't play in today's match. Culina started a head of him, and then Beerens, an 18 year old, came on as a sub.
He played one great game ... vs. Panama ... in his natural position. How he plays out of position is irrelevant.
Um, isn't the burden of proof on you? You'll need to come up with someting a little more convincing than a single game against Panama. If we only played Panama, Eddie Johnson would have 40 NT goals by now. Mapp is a classic case of UPS--Unproven Prospect Syndrome. We haven't actually seen him fail utterly, so we for some reason assume he couldn't.
I don't know if going to Europe really makes a US player that much better, but it sure wouldn't hurt. I would love to see a US star in Europe that is mention along the likes of Henry and Ronaldinho, but then again our best international players have been MLS players. I think being in the MLS keeps them in that "earn my respect" mode and that's why they play better come world cup time. However, if guys who want to earn more money and play in bigger leagues want to go, the MLS should let them go, and if they "want to come back" then receive them with open arms. I think the most important thing is keeping your players happy.
Well, let me put it this way - when Mapp is playing left wing, he is a much better player than Clint Dempsey or Freddy Adu as a right wing (in MLS). And when I said that I'd start him on the left, I didn't think I had to add that I'd have given him a run-out prior to the Cup.
I wouldn't call Mapp's typical performance as "bad." I might suggest that he's "absent" or "non-contributory" for long stretches. But comparing two players that have already proven their mettle for both club and country in the past to an unproven sleepwalker is silly. [This, despite their more recent struggles in Germany.] I will, however, laud Mapp for having made some contributions of late for his club. Having said this, he's still light-years away from even being worthy of a national team camp invite, IMO.
This would be a huge mistake by Beasley. It is tempting to come back where everything is familiar, the games are easy and everyone likes you. Considering that Donovan is his best friend on the National team it is not surprising that Beazer is giving this some serious thought. But he'll never get much better by taking a step down in competition at 24, he needs to be looking to establish himself in a major league, not heading the other direction. It will also hurt the credibility of Yanks in Holland, heading home when the going gets tough. His success helped pave the way not just for Lee Nguyen; but also Michael Bradley and Robbie Rogers, as Dutch clubs began to see young Yanks as value for the money addition. Getting flushed out of PSV for cheap will not help this valuation. If things have soured at PSV, then he probably needs to find a new team, ala Tim Howard; but giving up completely is not the answer.
Just for the record - LD is not Bease's best friend on the national team. DaMarcus has stated that Cory Gibbs is his best friend. Kind of rains a little on your aspersions. Believe it or not, these players do have minds of their own.
I wonder how much of this is tied to his broken leg from a while back. He's never seemed to have recovered his form since the injury... First Waldo Then Joe-Max Now Bease? Sachin
Spare me the patronizing. No doubt Beasley got to know Cory Gibbs during the time they were both in Holland. But it is a stretch to say that they are still friends to the same degree. Beasely has known Donovan a lot longer, at least 8 years and they are friends. To say that Donovan's experience doesn't have some influence on his thinking is patently ridiculous.
The way I hear it, LD doesn't really have any friends on the national team, mostly by his own choosing.