Discussion of 97’s-00’s

Discussion in 'Youth National Teams' started by ussoccer97531, Apr 17, 2021.

  1. TarHeels17

    TarHeels17 Member+

    Jan 10, 2017
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
  2. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Miles Robinson with the winning goal in the Gold Cup Final. The coach of Mexico notoriously didn't rate Robinson when he coached Atlanta United. He thought his passing wasn't good enough. Now Robinson is MOTM in the Gold Cup final against Martino. Robinson sure showed him.

    Martino is an overrated coach. He held Robinson (and others) back. Robinson was way too good for USL his first season. Martino preferred worse players. An unproven young domestic player was too big of a risk. You see the same thing in Mexico's senior team. Their starting CF in this tournament was a naturalized Argentine who wasn't good enough for Argentina's NT. Mexico had one starter younger than 26. We had two starters older than 26.

    Martino was a bad influence on MLS. He held back young domestic players, like Robinson, to prop up mediocre foreign imports. He's doing largely the same with Mexico's National Team right now. US Soccer greatly benefited from not hiring Martino. He's one of the most overrated coaches in World Football. His influence on Atlanta United was borderline disastrous, and you are seeing the byproduct of it right now with their identity crisis as a club. It will take many years for them to correct.
     
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  3. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
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  4. Labombenera

    Labombenera New Member

    Feb 4, 2020
    Holy smokes :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
     
  5. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    I gave you a chance to explain to me why I was wrong about Ochoa. Instead, you chose to be rude and make it about me.

    Now, you come up with this childish retort. You didn't address any point I made.

    I'm not sure you are convincing me or anyone about anything.
     
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  6. Brotheryoungbuck

    Jan 24, 2015
    parts unknown
    Dejuan Jones has Bundesliga interest. Pretty fascinating.
     
  7. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    #57 ussoccer97531, Aug 7, 2021
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2021
    Another GK to keep track of is Benny Diaz playing in LigaMX for Xolos. He got a run of games last season when the starter was injured, and started the first two games during this season. It’s true that the prior starter was away at the Gold Cup as a backup for Mexico, but that guy is 35 years old. Diaz is only 22 (December 98). Diaz missed the third game of the season (probably an injury), which the 35 year old Mexican keeper played in, so we’ll see if he remains the starter when he returns, but Diaz is coming very close to a starting spot (getting numerous games per season the last few seasons), if he’s not the starter.
     
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  8. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    One of my personal favorite American players. We don’t have any 6’4 players with his touch on the ball. Hopefully he gets a move soon to Europe. Still only 24.

     
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  9. dougtee

    dougtee Member+

    Feb 7, 2007
    his career choices have just been so abjectly awful for his development
     
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  10. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Two interesting developments.

    There’s a ‘99 Yank at Tromso in the first level of the Norwegian pyramid named Tomas Totland. He’s a winger and seems to be a regular starter. He’s provisionally cap-tied to Norway though after playing in the U-20 World Cup, although he only played one game and doesn’t seem to be more than a fringe player for Norway at any youth level.

    Timothy Tillman (‘99) has been regularly making the bench so far this season for Greuter Furth in the German Bundesliga. They are a newly promoted team. He’s a teammate of Julian Green. Tillman was much hyped during his time at Bayern, and is provisionally cap-tied to Germany. He’s probably not good enough right now to play for Germany, and may never be good enough to play for them. He’s not currently good enough either for our senior NT, but if he starts getting regular minutes, a German Bundesliga regular has to be in contention for a spot on the USMNT. So far this season he’s only gotten minutes in the DFB-Pokal. An added bonus would be potentially getting his (perceived) better younger brother to switch, if Timothy did. If Timothy switches, wouldn’t that help convince Malik to switch?
     
  11. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
     
  12. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Well done lad:

    1441934950358454275 is not a valid tweet id
     
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  13. Mahtzo1

    Mahtzo1 Member+

    Jan 15, 2007
    So Cal
    here are some numbers for you. I have been thinking a little recently about the number of 2nd tier talents being produced by MLS academies. This is important because it helps build the base of the pyramid and improve the depth and overall quality in MLS and the US in general.

    The following are a few basic raw stats on the "retention rates" of MLS academies based upon getting minutes in MLS as U21 or younger. I am using the U21 year for each birth year (ie 97's 2018, 98's 2019 etc). I am definining it as still playing in MLS. If a player moves retires, or moves to any other league, home or abroad, they are not playing in MLS. Also, remember that this does not count any in the birth year that are in the league now, but did not get time during the year. While I am not counting those that are out of the league, I will note those that moved abroad for context regarding the relative level of those that were retained. (ie, of those that left, 3 moved to Chelsea that would indicate that those remaining were the second level of that group, if all moved to USL that would indicate they were the best of that birth year getting minutes).

    2018: 15 97's got playing time of those, 10 are still in MLS. (Saucedo moved to Liga Mx). The only 97 in this group of real note is Miles Robinson who likely will move to Europe if he wants the move. Other than him, there are quite a few very solid "MLS lifers". Brooks Lennon, Justen Glad, Jackson Yueill, Aaron Herrera, JT Marcinkowski, Jeremy Ebobisse, Kyle Duncan, Jonathan Lewis, Handwalla Buena.

    2019: 13 98's got playing time, of those, 7 are still in MLS. (Cannon moved to Portugal).
    This group isn't as well established in MLS as the 97's but they are a year younger and will probably have similar career paths. Auston Trusty, Djorde Mihailovic, Marco Farfan, Mason Toye, Brandon Vazquez, Matt Freese, Ethan Zubak.

    2020: 11 99's got playing time. 6 are still in the league. (Vines, McKenzie moved to Europe, Adams, not counted in the 11, moved in 2018)
    The notable name, of course if Pomykal. Injuries have been the story of his career and will likely define it going forward. The other names are Matthew Real, Anthony Fontana, Griffen Dorsey, Brandon Servania, Omir Fernandez Moso.


    So far, in 2021 season, 16 00's have gotten playing time. The most notable 00 that has already moved is Aaronson but Durkin has also moved prior to this season.
    I also took a quick glance at the numbers of players, by birth year, that have received minutes. I found something that seems to mostly corroborate what we all seem to believe, but is still extremely interesting imo:


    .......................2018.................2019.................2020.................2021 (to date)

    U21’s...........97’s: 15...........98’s: 13................99’s: 11 ...............00’s: 16

    U20’s..........98’s 10.............99’s: 11................00’s: 13...............01’s: 16

    U19’s.........99’s:7................00’s: 9..................01’s: 15...............03’s: 15

    U18’s........00’s: 8................01’s: 6..................02’s: 9...............03’s: 17

    Totals: ...........40.....................39.........................48.........................64

    I find it interesting that the U21 age group has grown the least. my guess is that part is due to attrition (injury and or MLS clubs making the decision for the players) and part due to a few of the best prospects moving before their U21 year. I also find the consistency of the top to bottom numbers (four birth years separated only by 2 for players with appearances) for this year rather amazing. It really says a lot about the quality of our players getting younger.
     
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  14. ChuckMe92

    ChuckMe92 Member+

    Jun 23, 2016
    Columbus, OH
    Club:
    Columbus Crew
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    '99 winger who's been doing well in the Spanish Segunda, the top attacker of an upper-table club. His agent seems to indicate interest in the USMNT. Born in England to an American-born father. Also eligible for Venezuela through his mother.

     
  15. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    This may be a Joe Gyau situation, but he’s still only 22 and this is a big accomplishment.

     
  16. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    If Maloney turns out to be Bundesliga quality, Dortmund or no, he's found money as far as the U.S. program is concerned.
     
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  17. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    Omir Fernandez (NYRB '99) had a lively substitute shift against Nashville today. Didn't crack 1000 league minutes this season; turns 23 in February. He seems like the kind of guy who might take a step forward if someone gives him the minutes.
     
  18. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Timothy Tillman (‘99) has 3 assists in 310 minutes for a Bundesliga team this season. He’s more likely to help the USMNT than his club teammate Green IMO.
     
  19. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    If Brian White can explode at 25 in the right set up, Omir should be able to as well. I think he's got more tools than White.
     
  20. butters59

    butters59 Member+

    Feb 22, 2013
    Hard to tell. As players they have absolutely nothing in common. White looks like better Will Bruin, or might be Wondo. Fernandez so far looks like higher potential Jose Villareal.
     
  21. Clint Eastwood

    Clint Eastwood Member+

    Dec 23, 2003
    Somerville, MA
    Club:
    FC Dallas
    I'll need to see more from Brian White.
    Is he one of these guys that pops up every year on the goal scoring charts or a legitimate option moving forward.

    12 goals in 26 games is darn good.

    Am I watching Corey Baird (who has 4 USMNT caps) that happened to bang a few more in? Or something more?
     
  22. gogorath

    gogorath Member+

    None
    United States
    May 12, 2019
    Oh, I don't think Brian White is a USMNT guy, but he's taken a step to have a nice career.
     
  23. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    I mean, what exactly is the question here? I doubt anyone is thinking he deserves more than a look at this point. You could certainly argue he earned one on the field. I can't imagine he would ask for much more. (But sure, if you're someone saying he should start the next game, stand up and be counted!)
     
  24. ussoccer97531

    ussoccer97531 Member+

    Oct 12, 2012
    Club:
    --other--
    Looks like Romero is now gone. You can’t fault him. He waited it out for a US call up and probably still could, but he lost his starting spot at LAFC and is probably still a year or two at the earliest from any US call up and a few seasons at the earliest from a regular spot with the US. With El Salvador, he could walk into the starting XI for a team with a real chance to make the World Cup this cycle (and even better chance in 2026).

     
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  25. Dave Marino-Nachison

    Jun 9, 1999
    These callups are for El Salvador friendlies and it looks like the ES program is characterizing this as letting Gonzalez play important club matches. Of course, that might be only partly true and I honestly have no idea. But would playing in a senior friendly lock Romero in? If not, there seems like little downside for Romero here.

    I don't see what would've changed about Romero's positioning in the ES pool otherwise as he could've started the cycle as the #2. Perhaps someone more familiar with the program can explain. If Romero wanted a shot with the U.S. he surely could not have expected more than a winter callup.
     
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