D.C. United Makes Moves On Contracts :: Goff, W. Post

Discussion in 'D.C. United' started by MattMathai, Dec 13, 2005.

  1. JRstriker12

    JRstriker12 New Member

    Jan 27, 2002
    Falls Church, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I really can't see Adu plaing on the wing, even with Dema gone.

    How about playing Ben on the wing with Adu at forward. Ben and Adu have combined nicely in the past. Also, Tino is much better on the wing than Adu, so I'd reather play Adu up front at forward.

    How about :


    Wilson - Boz- Erpen- Namoff (or Preadoux)

    Olsen- Gomez - Carol -Tino

    Adu - Moreno
     
  2. jackdaniels

    jackdaniels New Member

    Mar 21, 2005
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Probably the only true thing you said of Filomeno in your post.
     
  3. onefineesq

    onefineesq Member+

    Sep 16, 2003
    Laurel, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: DCU Contract News

    And this is the quandary. Do we continue to force a team that IMO has the personnel of a 442, into a 352 again? If this team played a 442, I think this team would be very dangerous. However, the resigning of Olsen at a fairly high salary would seem to mitigate against that happening. We're obviously keeping BrianC, so there is no way that we pay Olsen that money and then sit him on the bench. I guess he "could" play RW in a 442, but somehow I find it very unlikely that it would happen.
     
  4. onefineesq

    onefineesq Member+

    Sep 16, 2003
    Laurel, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Great post and thoughtfulness, even if I don't agree with you 100%. As much as I seemingly defend Adu here, I am of the belief that he will not succeed in the 352 as the left mid. He just isn't the type of player who I see as running back and forth down the left wing, and if he does, we are wasting his offensive game. As much as we want to avoid saying it, Adu is simply a more skillful player/passer/dribbler than Beasley, and it would be a shame to have him chasing back to his own corner flag 20 times a game.

    However, if we were in a 442, I believe it would make perfect sense for him to play out there, as he would have cover behind him, and it would free him up to do more creating on the offensive side of the ball. I included what I think would be a nice sample lineup based upon our current crop of guys. Of course, it's not going to happen though, so I should just stop dreaming now. Anyway, you are duly repped for your post.

    --------------Esky ----------------Moreno -----------

    ------------------------Gomez ----------------------

    ----Adu ------------------------------------- Q--------

    ----------------------BC/BO/CS-------------------------

    ---Wilson--------Boswell--------Erpen-------Namoff-----

    PS Let me add that GoDC's 4222 lineup in post 17 is also an excellent one. JoeW's comments about Catolica are right on the money. Teams that have players who are adept at wing play will eat up the 352. Lucky for DC, MLS has a shortage of good wingers, so we (and other teams) have been able to get away with it for the most part. Catolica (and Pumas) ate it up in the end, and unfortunately Nowak did not adjust. I said it then, and I'll say it again .......... the sub to bring Walker off for Gros(?) at halftime of that game was dumb. I had hoped that Dema would come off for Boswell, to get 4 in the back. Skip is right. If we don't see a little bit more variation this year, I think we are going to have to revisit how Nowak is viewed.
     
  5. John_Harkes_6

    John_Harkes_6 New Member

    Mar 29, 2000
    Baltimore, MD.
    Re: DCU Contract News

    At the point of possible blasphemy - why not a 4-5-1?

    Use Mr. Adu and Quaranta as wingbacks with full rights to push all the way up field and essentially the formation can then quickly shift to a 4-3-3. Jaime certainly has the holding abilities as well as passing abilities to spring Q or Adu on runs into the box. You lessen up the defensive responsibilities for both Adu and Q.

    I think everyone associates a 4-5-1 with a lone striker hanging out up top but with Adu and Q I think the attack would be very strong in this set-up. It also accomplishes the goal of getting all our best players on the field at one time.
     
  6. SteveWWJ

    SteveWWJ Member

    Jan 28, 2003
    Reston, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    As far as Dema is concerned, I really like the guy alot, but I think going into the new season, DC won't be successful putting out the same starting 11 from last season, so there's gonna have to be some sort of shake-up. In fact, I can see Kovolenko being more valuable to a less veteran team like RSL than to us since we have no lack of veteran players. What we do need though, is room on the field for younger guys (see: Adu, Freddy) to develop to their full potential. In fact, there's alot to be said for giving Freddy a shot at playing on the left wing... he's one of our best crossers, he can get to the endline to actually get the cross off (a key weakness last year) and has the skill and talent to keep opposing defenders wide at all times.

    I mean, can you imagine the talent this lineup would have (assuming Esky can come back to form and Erpen could be moved to the wing):

    Moreno Esky
    Adu Gomez Quaranta
    Carroll Olsen
    Erpen Boswell Namoff

    The backline is, of course, the big conundrum, I need to see Boz/Erpen/Namoff on the field because I think they have the most talent/potential of all our defenders. So it makes sense to me to stick Bobby in the middle and let Brian and Facundo spend the entire pre-season figuring out which one plays better on the left because I think either would be fine on the right. If you think about it, Bobby has to play the middle and has too much potential to sit on the bench behind Erpen (whom I like there). But both Erpen and Namoff would be an upgrade over Prideaux/Wilson/Talon on the left, so why not make the switch?

    Ya, I know this leaves Gros off the field, but he's certainly not better than either Quaranta or Adu at this point, so why not let he and Simms be used as the first guys off the bench. Also, how would keeping Kovelenko put a better squad than the above on the field?
     
  7. nobletea

    nobletea Moderator
    Staff Member

    Sep 29, 2004
    HarCo
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Instead of repeating what I assume is an oft repeated line of his apologists, take this from a fellow doubter-- he is only 26. He stands to only get better. Of course, not taller or bigger, but at least better. His judgement and timing should improve. Theoretically, he could be a serviceable MLS keeper for another 10 years.

    Doubter mode: of course MLS standard, and international cup standard are two different things.

    Anyway, just wanted to point out his perhaps overlooked upside.
     
  8. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Why not John Wilson for left fullback? Is he gone? To me, he's the obvious choice.

    GoDC, a box midfield means the fullbacks really need to be able to get forward and create dangerous width. I don't see Namoff and Wilson doing that to an MLS Cup contender level. But you could drop Olsen as a starter, move Adu to left wing, Gros at right wing (or maybe Olsen, altho I think he'd be too slow.)
     
  9. owendylan

    owendylan Member

    May 30, 2001
    Virginia
    Club:
    DC United
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I would think that between the draft and any other signings/trades we will find an outside mid that is better than NVS.
     
  10. SteveWWJ

    SteveWWJ Member

    Jan 28, 2003
    Reston, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Reflecting on my own post above, alot of people would like to have 4 in the back instead of three (e.g. Wilson, Boswell, Erpen, Namoff), now I don't have a problem with that back line at all, but that would mean either Carroll or Olsen sit, and in that scenario, I don't think Wilson brings as much to the field than either of those two, so I'd still stick with this lineup:

    Moreno Esky
    Adu Gomez Quaranta
    Carroll Olsen
    Erpen Boswell Namoff
    Rimando

    Edit: Yeah, I know, I know, it's not always about getting the most talented people on the field, but I see no reason why those guys couldn't perform as the best 11, in addition to being the most talented 11.
     
  11. superdave

    superdave Member+

    Jul 14, 1999
    VB, VA
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I'm confused by your use of "wingback." The way Brazil plays the 4-4-2, their outside backs can be called wingbacks. But for everyone else, WBs are primarily defensive players, but midfielders. They are tasked with providing width in the attack, and defensively with shutting down the opp. winger. Think Lewis and Reyna vs. Mexico, or Lewis and Hejduk vs. Germany.

    So do you mean that Adu and Q are Brazil-like "defenders," making marauding runs from deep, providing width behind 3 central mids and two central attacking mids? Or do you imagine them marking opp. wingers when necessary, playing behind 3 central mids, and getting all the way up to make a 4-3-3 in the attack? Neither makes any sense.

    Did you get confused and misunderstand what a wingback is, and you mean "wing?" I mean, are you envisioning them playing like Robben and Duff did last year when Chelsea was running its 4-5-1/4-3-3?
     
  12. spidergoose

    spidergoose Member

    Nov 2, 2004
    Annapolis
    Club:
    DC United
    Re: DCU Contract News

    In a 4-man backline, Wilson would indeed be outstanding playing on the left. IMO, that's his natural position as he can go forward (one of his strengths) more than one should in a 3-man line.


    Wilson--Erpen--Boswell--Namoff

    I like it. If Nowak is at one of these offseason happy hours try to talk him into it once he's had a couple of drinks in him. :)
     
  13. yabo

    yabo Member+

    Jun 1, 2000
    Poolesville, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I maintain that Gros has a good chance of ending up on the backline. I'm not sure he has the subtlety to provide an upgrade on the wing. Bennie in his prime could dribble past, cross and shoot. Gros is not bad making runs and shooting on goal. Ideally he is a wing back in a 4-4-2, but I could see him displacing Namoff in your lineup above.

    Yabo
     
  14. BudWiser

    BudWiser New Member

    Jul 17, 2000
    Falls Church, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I don't want to see Dema gone, for Jessica's sake and also because he's a very good player.

    But if it happens (or even if it doesn't) I do like trying out Adu on the wing. I know he has defensive problems but there are major advantages to trying him at wing as opposed to a-mid. Some of the reasons include:

    -There is only one a-mid spot, where Gomez is a lock as a starter, and Moreno can play a-mid. There are 2 wing spots
    -What the wing has in abundance is tons of space to work with, which Freddy can use for his dribbling magic
    -Freddy has the speed to play wing (and of course you HAVE to have speed to play wing)

    If it was me, I'd get Freddy to learn the simple things first, wing. Someday he may play a-mid consistently, but he'll be gone to Europe in a year or two.

    Again, a-mid is a MUCH more complicated and difficult position than wing. A-mid was a position that Freddy struggled with (you have to know where you are, what you're doing, why you're doing it at ALL times).

    Sure Freddy can play a-mid in the U-20s, but that's U-20s, it takes depth of knowledge and experience to play a-mid in the pro ranks.

    I don't see where you have to go to 4 backs, because we have enough midfielders to play 5 midfielders. Plus why change the system.

    Also, you can say wing requires defense. Of course it does. Believe it or not, so does a-mid. At one point or another, Freddy HAS to learn defense, and at wing it's more clear to him when and where he needs to play defense, so he can more easily learn what defense is all about.

    That said, I expect him to play forward and a-mid, but would like to see United try him at wing.
     
  15. MattMathai

    MattMathai BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 28, 2004
    Annapolis
    Re: DCU Contract News

    The move to a four-back system is not being suggested because of a lack of midfielders. It's an attempt to shore up the middle of our back line by getting Erpen and Boswell on the field at the same time. They bring different, and complementary, skills to the table.

    And why change the system? To get better. It might not work, but why not try it?
     
  16. CHICO13

    CHICO13 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 4, 2001
    SECTION 135
    Club:
    The Strongest La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Definately, especially since it seems teams have figured out our 5 man midfield.
     
  17. BudWiser

    BudWiser New Member

    Jul 17, 2000
    Falls Church, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I hate to say it, but the way I see it either Bozilla or Erpen has to sit.

    The midfield has to help out the defense under Nowak's system. And the center defender has to be very good. Of course, that didn't happen in the last playoff game. But I don't see a need YET to overreact and go to a 4-back system. I'd keep it on the table though as the season progressed.
     
  18. CHICO13

    CHICO13 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 4, 2001
    SECTION 135
    Club:
    The Strongest La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I don't see why. Offseason aquisitions, trades, contracts will have a lot to do with what Nowak has to work with in Bradenton. I think he HAS to try a four man back line in camp. If I get down there, that'll be the first thing I ask him.
     
  19. rtiemens

    rtiemens Member

    Aug 16, 1999
    Virginia
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I agree. Maybe I did not see enough games, but the times I saw Freddy on the wing, he was ineffective. Freddy may have shortcomings as a-mid, but I have seen him make an impact from the a-mid position whereas I do not remember him ever making similar impact when I've seen him play wing.

    I've seen him score goals and make assists from a-mid and forward, and I have seen him get marked out of matches or disappear from matches on the wing. Again, I realize it may be that I just have not seen enough games to make an accurate judgment.
     
  20. MattMathai

    MattMathai BigSoccer Supporter

    Jun 28, 2004
    Annapolis
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I wonder how much of our playoff performance can be attributed to other coaches figuring out our lineup and tactics, and how much to injuries and fatigue.

    I just don't think Sarachan suddenly became a genius in October. Physical disruption is a pretty well-known tactic (of the less talented, I'd point out.)
    I'd suggest that our success earlier in the year was due to us being able to deal w/ the physical challenges. In the playoffs, we didn't (and maybe couldn't)
     
  21. BudWiser

    BudWiser New Member

    Jul 17, 2000
    Falls Church, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    I've got your answer right now. I'm fairly certain he'll respond by saying it's not the lineup, it's where the players are on the field

    How do I know this? I asked him a lineup question some time back, and he said it's not about formations it's about where you are on the field and what you're doing within the framework of the team and what effort you're putting in
     
  22. spidergoose

    spidergoose Member

    Nov 2, 2004
    Annapolis
    Club:
    DC United
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Man I love that our league is still small enough that fans can reasonably expect to have the opportunity to discuss tactics with the coach in person. :)
     
  23. SteveWWJ

    SteveWWJ Member

    Jan 28, 2003
    Reston, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Absolutely agree here... I'd love to see Gros converted to a defender, it might take awhile but it's cetainly conceivable he could displace Namoff at right back.
     
  24. BudWiser

    BudWiser New Member

    Jul 17, 2000
    Falls Church, VA
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Believe it or not....
     
  25. CHICO13

    CHICO13 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Oct 4, 2001
    SECTION 135
    Club:
    The Strongest La Paz
    Nat'l Team:
    Bolivia
    Re: DCU Contract News

    Well then I'll ask him what part of the field he envisions having Wilson, Boz, Erpen and Namoff on. :D
     

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