Alert: Covid-19 and our favorite team

Discussion in 'San Jose Earthquakes' started by TyffaneeSue, Mar 11, 2020.

  1. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nope. The data show that his solution has been working! When you see the sobering numbers -- 1/4 of people diagnosed with Covid end up in the hospital in our local counties -- you realize how lethal this virus would be, unchecked.

    You ever take antibiotics for an infection? Usually you're prescribed a 7-10 day course of the amoxy or whatever. You're going to be feeling much better after two days and tempted to stop taking the drugs, but the bacteria are still there, and will resurge (maybe in an antibiotic resistant form) if you quit too soon. That's where we are with SIP (and yes, I know Covid is a virus, just making an analogy)

    Sounds as though you don't mind the SIP as much as you mind the lack of an end date. Do you feel better about the Bay Area SIP that keeps getting extended? I don't like giving anyone false hope, and think Newsom is doing a better job managing expectations. One step at a time, and only when it's safe to take that step.
     
  2. DotMPP

    DotMPP 'Quakes fan in Stumptown

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jun 29, 2004
    SE Portland, OR
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Clapper does admit in his book that the IC was wrong about that. Allowing themselves to be driven by policy makers who were looking for WMDs to be a threat
     
  3. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    The original three week Santa Clara Health Dept. order passed constitutional muster, even though I personally felt it was bad policy, so if I were the judge presiding over a challenge to it I would have upheld it. It is not the place of the courts to substitute their policy preferences. But courts can and do (sometimes) enforce the law..

    However, the 30-day extension of the County order without stated justification (maybe I missed its justification statement) does not satisfy the constitutional standard. So, again, if I were a judge presiding over a challenge to the 30-day extension, I would strike it down without any adequate evidentiary showing of its narrowly-tailored necessity.

    Again, to comply with the federal constitution, these orders need to be narrowly tailored to achieve their ends, and the justification needs to be presented and strictly scrutinized. "Trust us" as a statement from any level of government is not adequate evidentiary justification.
     
  4. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    And you're ok with the president removing oversight from $2 trillion? Without any justification (or reason to believe that it will go to anyone but his cronies)?
     
  5. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    #1880 don gagliardi, Apr 7, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2020
    A couple points: (1) gratuitously bringing Trump into the discussion takes up the temperature in this thread, needlessly. I deliberately refrained from responding earlier so as to maintain the newfound decorum.

    (2) In deference to your second insistent request that I offer an opinion, I will do so with the caveat I am not interested in debating the matter. I'll gladly stipulate for sake of discussion on this board that Trump--is-the-worst-person-ever, if it allows us to get beyond him and actually analyze things of importance with clear eyes.

    That said, my opinion (while refraining from further comment on the matter because Trump is a third rail for any discussion):

    Your assertion that "the president [is] removing oversight from the $2 trillion" is misleading and inflammatory, and does not appear to me to present any immediate constitutional issues. He appears to be replacing personnel in the over-sight role. It may be a dumb move, or not, I don't know, but it no more presents a constitutional issue than Matias Almeyda subbing Shea Salinas for Vako. It's his prerogative.

    . . . Trump on Monday nominated Jason Abend, a senior policy adviser at U.S. Customs and Border Protection, for that stimulus oversight role after replacing Fine . . .

    https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/tru...or-general-named-oversee-2t/story?id=70024680
     
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  6. Quakes05

    Quakes05 Member+

    Oct 1, 2005
    birthplace of MLS
    :eek: good lord what a catastrophic mis-read of the situation, if true.
     
  7. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    "If true"? You think the tweet is fake?
     
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  8. Quakes05

    Quakes05 Member+

    Oct 1, 2005
    birthplace of MLS
    Stranger things have happened.

    I’ll accept it as true and yes, he should’ve known better by then. NYers are paying a dear price for his failure to recognize what was coming.
     
  9. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
  10. jeff_adams

    jeff_adams Member+

    Dec 16, 1999
    Monterey, Ca
    It seems it’s much worse then what is being reported. According to this article, NYC typically sees anywhere from 20-25 deaths a day at home. The number is now 200. They aren’t being counted in the COVID-19 numbers.


    https://gothamist.com/news/surge-nu...ls-suspect-undercount-covid-19-related-deaths
     
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  11. DotMPP

    DotMPP 'Quakes fan in Stumptown

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jun 29, 2004
    SE Portland, OR
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Maybe just a short explanation of how SIP reduces R? ;)
     
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  12. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
     
  13. TyffaneeSue

    TyffaneeSue moderator
    Staff Member

    Nov 15, 2003
    Upstairs
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    To be fair, I think everyone's radar triggered on different dates. Seems like every other year we hear about a deadly new virus outside the United States, and 100 monkeys or 1000 chickens are killed and the threat vanishes. Initially it seemed that covid-19 might be contained in one region in China, but at that point we didn't understand the combustible nature of the virus (the lengthy asymptomatic prodromal period). There were even a few people arguing that the virus wouldn't make it outside Asia due to differences in lung receptors.

    Just about everyone was slow to react, so you can't blame the mayor of NYC for promoting the arts on March 3 -- our second home game was played after that. How many of you went to that?
     
  14. DotMPP

    DotMPP 'Quakes fan in Stumptown

    San Jose Earthquakes
    United States
    Jun 29, 2004
    SE Portland, OR
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Mandatory mask use
     
  15. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I don't doubt that the death counts are imprecise, as I've previously speculated. There's also likely over-counting among those who die in the hospital (akin to what was seen in Italy, where everyone who died in hospitals was listed as a victim of the virus). Notably, from the Gothamist article:

    . . . Dr. Irwin Redlener, the director of Columbia University's National Center for Disaster Preparedness, called the discrepancy “a subset of the whole testing fiasco.” He said the city should be testing dead bodies and reporting the results.

    “This difference between the [Medical Examiner] and the Health Department, that’s something that needs to be resolved urgently, that’s not okay,” Redlener said. “They have to be on the same page.”

    Redlener said the city should also be tracking other deaths that occur as collateral damage.

    [People] may be dying because of reduced care for other non-COVID diseases” like diabetes, heart attacks or other chronic conditions, Redlener said. “Those to me, should be somehow tallied as we’re looking at the death toll of COVID.” . . . [Emphasis added]


    I've read elsewhere there have been a reduction of heart attack admissions to hospitals nationwide, which doesn't make sense unless people are scared to go to the hospital lest they become infected. So, they die at home instead. Are these "collateral damage" deaths really "coronavirus deaths"?
     
  16. markmcf8

    markmcf8 Member+

    Oct 18, 1999
    Vancouver, WA, USA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Sure, but there are other states not doing SIP and we have no domestic travel limitations. Thus, this contagion will continue to spread. It won't be the end of May, maybe the end of June before we even try to go back to normal, but this is dependent on what happens in other states. Any or Arkasas, Iowa, or Utah could be in the grip of a bad outbreak at the end of May, or even June.
     
  17. jeff_adams

    jeff_adams Member+

    Dec 16, 1999
    Monterey, Ca
    I know this is not going to happen, but what really needs to be done is test everyone who dies for COVID-19. We also need to test everyone for antibodies in herd immunity, but that’s going to create a national DNA database that will be a massive invasion of privacy. Last but not least everyone should be tested to see who has it now.
     
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  18. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    I went to the game on March 7. As I recall, MJ Lee said she would not be attending because of the virus.

    We discussed this on this board soberly in advance of the game while de Blasio was gas-lighting his constituents.

    I'm not aware of anyone having contracted the virus at the Quakes game, and if they had we would expect to see far higher death tallies in Santa Clara County right now. There were Sharks games on March 5 and March 7, as well, as I previously observed. I was at the Sharks game on March 5, too.

    It's criminally negligent that I cannot be tested. But I feel fine and, as far as I know, a month later I'm still not dead.
     
  19. Earthshaker

    Earthshaker BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 12, 2005
    The hills above town
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Well, again, access to test kits has been a big issue in reporting deaths properly. Coroners wanting test kits are being told they are being prioritized for the living. And even though they strongly suspect a person has died of the virus some are hesitant to categorize it as a covid-19 death without doing the test.
    https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/06/health/coronavirus-coroners-uncounted-deaths-invs/index.html
     
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  20. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    There are always "reasons" why data is unreliable. But you can certainly rely on the fact it will be unreliable. :)

    I was far too trusting initially of the death stats as "hard" numbers, unlike the absurd "cases" numbers in the absence of testing.

    I think the surfeit of available hospital beds and ventilators every day on the Santa Clara Health dashboard are the most reliable indicator we have right now. That and Gavin Newsom offering up ventilators to other states. Tells me we're in a good situation here right now.
     
  21. Earthshaker

    Earthshaker BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 12, 2005
    The hills above town
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    I can't believe you can't get one. As of March 6th tests were available for anyone that needed one, and millions of tests were being made, and they're beautiful and perfect. Maybe you need to park yourself on a ship, (preferably a monster ship) in San Francisco harbor.:D
     
  22. don gagliardi

    don gagliardi Member+

    San Jose Earthquakes
    Feb 28, 2004
    san jose
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Do you think Emperor Newsom would let me go on a cruise? :)
     
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  23. Earthshaker

    Earthshaker BigSoccer Supporter

    Sep 12, 2005
    The hills above town
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Remember, it's Kommandant Newsom, since we are in a Stalag.:)
     
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  24. Quakes05

    Quakes05 Member+

    Oct 1, 2005
    birthplace of MLS
    I fully expect we will soon need to find suitable day on the calendar for Gavin Newsom Day during which we come together (somewhat) to celebrate the quick thinking and life saving measures taken by the good governor thereby saving countless lives and making sure that in CA we let science drive the decision making. Hip hip hooray!
     
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  25. Smurfquake

    Smurfquake Moderator
    Staff Member

    Aug 8, 2000
    San Carlos, CA
    Club:
    San Jose Earthquakes
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    So, the latest from San Mateo County - they're now saying that anyone diagnosed with the disease has to quarantine themselves for 14 days, and anyone in close contact with those people has to quarantine themselves for 14 days. This sounds to me like they're getting ready to lighten up the restrictions on the rest of us - I think - if they're making rules for people with the disease and people in close contact with those people, they are maybe moving to the test / track / isolate model instead of the everyone stay at home model - or am I reading too much into this?

    The orders can be found at https://www.smchealth.org/post/health-officer-statements-and-orders - the ones dated April 6.

    They also said that schools will be closed through the end of the school year, which isn't surprising, because schools are a pretty good place for viruses to get it on and transfer from one household to possibly many others.
     

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