Not too long ago, I asked if we were the type of team that could afford not calling a player like Guerron, same sh*t happened last Copa America, Rueda didnt have a back up so he used Arroyo on the wrong side, we all know how that Copa worked out for us. Please keep in mind we did not play a World Class opponent, yet I leave with the impression we are lucky to have tied, The one thing that surprised me the most is that I saw Quinteros completely changing his formula, he used the wings a lot just like our Colombian coaches, a big/tall #9 (Ayovi) and a quick one (Miller) we barely attacked through the middle, Our defense was a mess the second half, Mina being the most solid one, yet when Panama pushed the gas we looked completely disoriented, their defense was even worse yet our team was not able to capitalize
Maybe our guys are saving themselves for Copa America? With all these injuries happening they're not giving their all.
We don't go through the middle because it's practically empty. Who are you going to go through the middle with when Quiñonez and Lastra start? Lastra was horrible and lost the ball the most in the middle. Quiñonez was Quiñonez the whole game. Both completely lost. Noboa came in but didn't do much. Better than the other two in the midfield but nothing special. He played bad this year at his club. I don't see how that would change with the NT. He just isn't the same Noboa anymore. All we had was the left side with Martinez throughout the whole game, with one or two occasions from Gonzales on the right side. Literally the talent on the middle and the right wing disappeared. We have nothing there. Cazares comes in then we leave a huge hole in defense because Lastra/Quiñonez are inept at doing anything defensive alone. Any counter attack and we are done. Once Bagui got injured the left side was wide open. Montero had to defend and attack. His attacking today was very disappointing. Overall we have nothing much. No one in the middle worth anything. No one on the right side unless Ibarra comes. Mina the only good defender at center back. Bagui doing enough. Paredes completely stuck because he knows if he attacks we are done. Enner doing absolutely nothing. Injuries mounting up. I can go on and on how bad we have it. What I want to see if we don't have injuries is call up Hidalgo. We can call up people from the 30 list if I'm not wrong to have some depth. Line up like this against Chile: Dominguez Paredes - Mina - Achilier - Ayovi/Bagui Ibarra - Noboa - Montero Bolaños J. Avovi/Enner - Martinez Just put the best on the field. There is a big hole defensively at the middle but who cares. We need to go all out and score as much as we can. Only change to win a game or two.
I feel you man, so much potential there hopefully it doesn't go to waste. They are organized, good defensively and offensively, fast, and pueden ganar el uno contra uno. The only problem i have is that no one is feeding these kids they're to skinny same goes for all local ecuadorian soccer player.
I only caught the second half so the only conclusions i can make are that Dominguez, Mina, and Martinez must start in the Copa America. I've always liked Mina and man what a defensive performance if only we could clone him, hopefully he keeps this. Erazo, and Lastra are just not NT material anymore. Bolanos might prove to be a flop. And Quinteros, man i had high hopes and with each game they get lower and lower, I get you wanted to experiment alriight thats cool pero Ecuador estuvo muy disorganizado it should be clear that your "boys" aren't making the cut. If Vizuete was still in charge we would hve been prepared for the CA and we would've won today in good fashion. You got one more friendly and a CA to turn things around.
I've said it a million times - I'm still upset we got rid of Vizuete. I only caught a few minutes on a bad stream but I saw Panama had us against the ropes and we were wasting the ball every time we got it. Quinteros may eventually come good but it was very stupid to dismiss Vizuete who had us playing extremely well against teams much better than Panama. The only Central American team we faced was El Salvador and we ripped them 5-0. We've taken a step back, my friends.
I was excited to see the naños play but after the injuries to several keys players and this poor showing its obvious that we will not pass to the next stage. The ultimate goal is to reach the 2018 world cup and succeed in that tournament with some of the younger kids but the U17 kids might be too young for that type of pressure. listen I don't watch all the Ecuador local tournament games but my god there has to be better players playing.
I give Rueda credit to what he has done with us the change was still needed tho. Vizuete can work with what ever players he has and can do a lot with them at least I know we can score and beat small team by goliadas with him. Vizuete didnt use Valencia, Montero, or Caicedo he used Plata, Canga, Cazares, Sornoza and a bunch of other young inexperienced players. He turned Mushuc Runa around and got them out of the relegation zone I hate to see Catholica, Liga de Loja, Deportivo Cuenca ect get relegated but Vizuetes doing good with them. Quinteros failed to meet a win with a generous 2+ goal margin not a high expectation you would think. Ayovi, Gonzales, Bolanos, Fidel, Mina, Lastra, Quinonez, Bagui, Mina ect are players who know this is where they need to give it their all other wise they will ride bench in Copa America. Out of all those guys only Ayovi, Fidel, Bagui, Mina had good and acceptable preformances. I still dont think Quinteros understands the need of quality players for a NT. Bolanos shouldnt start any more until he can prove him self he wasn't even dangerous this game him and Emelec are at a down slope anyways. Lastra isnt NT material and Gonzales isnt their quite yet Larrea will be of little to no use.Alex Bolanos and Guerron could have done so much for our team this game and in Copa America. Quinteros doesnt know how to deploy a proper playing style on to our team. I think these games show that neither Bolanos or Cazares are ready to be the center of the NT especially under Quinteros. None of Quintero players have dont anything on the NT yet and he hasnt given Cazares opportunities to start or use him correctly. Vizuete should have stayed at least to build a base and a new playing style for our team until some one better could have came along he would have been able to make a good transition. Quinteros once again is to inexperienced to do so he is experimenting very poorly and making us look god awful. The next game vs Panama should be: Dominguez Paredes, Mina, Achiller, Ayovi Quinonez, Noboa Ibarra/Montero, Cazares/Arroyo, Martinez Valencia Or... Dominguez Paredes, Mina, Achiller, Ayovi Ibarra, Quinonez, Noboa, Montero Valencia, Martinez
I don't see why everyones expectations are sky high for this NT? Get f*cking real people. We have a ton of injuries and a new coach who hasn't had more than 2 games prior to last nights game vs. Panama and hasn't been able to have all his starters in a single game or even in a single training session. Again, let's get f*cking real and stop complaining that we aren't playing like a machine b/c it's not going to happen over night. I said that before and I'll say it again. When was the last time anyone here saw Fidel, Gonzalez, Miller, and Yoya play together in a starting 11? Didn't think so....our players are NOT going to adapt together en un dos por tres. Especially not the subs and Fidel, Gonzalez, and Yoya are exactly that. They may be playing now b/c of all the injuries, but otherwise they are subs. Fidel and Gonzalez aren't even supposed to be on the roster b/c Antonio and Mena would've have their positions. So again, let's stop having these sky high expectations that people are pulling out of their dreams and let's all drop back down to reality where #1 It is known we have had no time and Quinteros hasn't had the full squad to assemble his main starting 11, #2 this is a completely new system of playing and we have a new coach who has had little to no time to prepare for a Copa America, and #3 Antonio, Arroyo, Mena, and possibly Renato and Yoya miss the tournament....who else am I missing b/c I know I'm missing a few other injuries if I'm not mistaken? And you guys are expecting a impressive Ecuador? C'mon....let's stop fantasizing and accept reality. Reality is we have a ton of work to do, little time, and lots of injuries. That being said, the struggle will be seen and last night was not the exception. I notice a lot of negative commentary on Miller Bolanos and I think it's ironic that although the majority of people on this forum point fingers at him, NOT a single person has notice that he was the one to pressure, intercept, and assist Fidel with his goal. Did anyone see that or is everyone in here suddenly blind? He may have missed that easy open shot last night, but I wanna know which other player besides him was even close to scoring ? Not a single one. At least Miller creates danger or puts himself in a dangerous situation which means evidently that he is a player to be on the look out for. I can't say that about the rest of our guys in the attack. I liked what Fidel did and I liked what I saw from Jaime too. It wasn't amazing, but it was better than previous games I have seen from them. Other than that, I personally think Mina was the stand out of yesterdays game. Very solid center back and his aerial game is impeccable. I've always said that about him. BUT what people have to take into consideration is that he is slow. There's a difference between playing Panama and a very fast and dynamic team like Chile where a center back like Achilier (who is all about speed) will be more suitable in the back. Achilier has had a great season in Copa and campeonato. I would say it is the most solid I've seen in Achilier's entire career. And due to the fact that he has the characteristics to counter Chile's style of playing, I have no doubt Quintero will bet his money on him over Mina. At least I would do so. Other than that I don't have much more to say. I really had my hopes up for a 4-2-3-1 with Dominguez; Paredes, Achilier, Erazo, Walter; Noboa, Pedro; Antonio, Miller, Montero; Enner but that's not happening. Quinteros is going to have a lot to struggle with before the Qualifier begins. Lots of our main guys have not had time to gel with eachother under this coach and it may stab us sooner than expected which is what I fear. It's going to be tough and everyone here needs to wake up and accept it and stop living in a false reality thinking we are going to play like Emelec 2014 in two days. Not happening. It's going to take time and like I've said before....we are going to have to suffer to get there. So accept it. For now I'd like to see 4-2-3-1 Dominguez; Paredes, Achilier, Erazo, Walter; Noboa, Pedro; Renato, Miller, Montero; Enner That's the best we can do. But i'll give props for Quinteros for trying out playing with a 9 like Yoya last game to experiment. It shows he is not close minded and wants to try out different alternatives that could be used in different games/scenarios. It's good that he is getting things clearer for himself at least for the time being. It will help him in the long run.
Interesting perspective, Now, I will disagree with you on some things, first of all, being able to beat a Panama team (with a few absence of their own) would not qualify as "sky high" expectations, sure we can always turn to the "he needs more time" argument, but let us remember Vizuete's second era, he grabs the team, No Valencia, no Caicedo, no Montero, No Arroyo (similar situation) yet his results were better, a solid win against Bolivia and a bad game against Brasil yet we lost by a goal and we had a chance to tie it. Now, I admit that I wasn't too pleased with Vizuete's formula either but he also applied a new style which is also Quintero's situation, I can name a few other coaches who came in and immediately improved such team, Sampaoli comes to mind, Borghi got fired after Losing 2 in a row in October 2012, Sampaoli takes over in November, doesnt get the team 7 days before the March 2013 games, and after a loss to Peru, they defeat Uruguay 2-0 with over 8 new men in a 23 men roster. We all remember the 5-1 Loss to Paraguay in which Vizuete came in a 4 days we win by the same score against Peru with new faces (Quiroz, De Jesus, Ambrossi, Urrutia and even Montero) so some coaches are able to improve a team in a small amount of time. Now, regarding Miller, sure he pressured up top, it's Quintero's style, now are you really giving him credit for an assist? the ball clearly bounced off his leg and lucky for us it landed on Fidel, nothing more to that play, again, you mention who else had a chance to score? well, Fidel scored twice, one goal being called offside that didnt exist, now if Miller found himself in scoring position I give credit to whoever assisted him, after all he is the center of Quintero's offense, so he should be in scoring position, as of now in 3 games we have 1 goal, 6 clear chances and a missed penalty. I do not understand how we should be happy he was in position but couldn't net it, it's not as if he is an 18 year old kid, this is a mature man who should not fold in easy scoring opportunities. Regarding defense, I agree with you 100% I Like Mina, and I would love to see him in games against Paraguay, Bolivia and Venezuela who depend so much on high crosses, Mina's header game is excellent, I also like how he is not afraid to approach midfiel and lend support to our players there. Walter Ayovi, Achillier should play against Chile.
Can we please not start Erazo anymore?! Does anyone see how many times he messed up? The huge holes he leave when he makes stupid mistakes? I wish I could record the game and make a gif of just him. I noticed so many times Erazo trying to anticipate or take away the ball but be does it at the wrong time. Then you can tell he gets left behind and someone else has to fall back and fix his mistake. This past game it was Mina. I can't believe no one noticed this. No one in the media dissects the his game or something. It's terrible. This guy sucks. He doesn't even start on his club and isn't even on the bench. That's how bad he is. How are we so blind?
I agree Erazo makes a handful of foolish mistakes, but name me one person with his experience in the country or on this roster. Not a single one. Mina is good, but we can't just make a rushed decision based on the little he has played. At this point it will be very difficult for anyone to bench Erazo. If anything Mina is battling Achilier for the starting spot and IMO Achilier is the player to start against Chile and also based on the moment he's in. Erazo starts every game or just about every game in Gremio. I don't know what you're talking about. I'm not sure if you were aware, but he's not benched in Flamengo anymore. He switched teams and he's a regular in Gremio now. In reality we are screwed with the center back options to be honest. Way more screwed than we were 4 years ago, but at least then we had viable options that at least were promising. Eduardo Morante, Jairo Campos, Frickson Erazo, and Gabriel Achilier. Now we have an Erazo that isn't as solid as he was 4 years back, Morante disappeared, Campos injury screwed his career over, and Achilier (surprisingly) is honestly the player that's in his best moment out of all the center backs. The only promising option is Mina, who isn't consolidated but it is still too early to get a full conclusion on him. We'd have to see him against a tougher opponent which hasn't been the case yet.
What I personally look at when playing any friendly (especially when a new coach comes in) is how WE are playing, not so much the opponent. The key thing FIRST is for the coach to get his idea across to our guys on how he wants them to play. Results in friendlies are secondary IMO. I don't care if we tied, lost, or defeat Panama, but what I want to see is our players being able to adapt to this new system of playing which unfortunately we have not been able to do. If anything our best games have been the first two we played b/c at least Quinteros had close to what we would consider a "full squad". There was an improvement from the first game our NT had with Quinteros and the second game, but unfortunately due to the high number of injuries, that process is being stalled. The whole point is for him to continue from where he last left off, but now he doesn't have all the tools (players) to continue building from there. And what surprises me is that some people here expect our guys to play like Emelec 2014 when Fidel, Jaime, Gonzalez, and Miller have NEVER in their life had a game together. Freakin Fidel and Gonzalez aren't even supposed to be on this final roster for God sakes! Do people not get that? On a normal basis these two players would be option C on a roster. In other words, they wouldn't even be on the freakin roster. So that being said, do people still expect Quinteros to make these guys play good ball? Hell to the freakin no!! Quinteros never planned to have these guys even on the bench, let alone as starters. The plan was Antonio-Miller-Montero; Enner....and Jaime as Enner's back up. Mena as Montero's back up, Renato as Antonio's back up. Do you guys not get that his ENTIRE plans basically changed and that he's a new coach barely getting his third game in and about to play a big international cup?? That's why I said, let's get real. Don't expect Ecuador be Emelec 2014 from one day to the next. As far as your comment about Sampaoli, he grabbed a squad that had a solid 4 years plus playing with each other PLUS his U de Chile men and consolidated a strong squad. And that's what I mean when I say Fidel, Miller, Gonzalez, and Enner have NEVER played together. We are down 5 men in the attack. That's not easy to deal with. If we would not have had all these injuries and been playing like we did against Panama, then I would say, you're right....something is just not syncing in correctly. But Quinteros has more to deal with than what he planned on. About your comment regarding Vizuete....there's a BIG difference in moments. Vizuete didn't have Antonio, Montero, or Caicedo, but he damn sure had a Joao Plata in his best moment of his career and who was one of the best players in the MLS, he had a Junior Sornoza who was the 2nd top goal scorer of the campeonato, and he had a Cristian Penilla who was one of the best players of the campeonato 2014 and BSC's most fundamental player. What does Quinteros have? An ok Fidel Martinez who is usually option C on this NT. A Jonathan Gonzalez that had a mediocre season and is far from his 2014 form. And then add onto that all the injuries he's had to deal with- Mena, Yoya, Renato, Antonio, Arroyo. Definitely different situations. At least Vizuete's back up options (the new blood) were in great moments at that point in time. Even Enner was fresh out the WC having a good season in West Ham at that time in the year. The only player who was in a funk was Renato Ibarra, but in the second semester of the year he got out of it. If anything, Vizuete's situation was easy to deal with than Quinteros. Vizuete had time and wasn't in a rush to get a team assembled before a Copa America. The squad had less stress to deal with.
Honestly, I don't care how much experience Erazo has. If you want the previous game, it doesn't matter at all. Doesn't help him one bit. He left huge holes because of his terrible decisions. We are going to get owned anyways in CA, and I wouldn't be surprised if we tied Bolivia or lose to them. I rather give Mina a chance to show what he has. He has played more games than Erazo and played Libertadores/Sudamericana recently, again, more than Erazo has. Also, in Erazo's current team he only plays when the guy ahead of him is injured. He didn't play for a while until recently because the guy ahead of him got injured. When he plays he makes stupid mistakes like he did recently for his team and cost the game. He flat out sucks. He is slow and his decisions has cost us games as well. He needs to be benched. Watch him today and let's see how he plays since he is going to be a started. Everyone pay attention to him. You'll all see how bad he leaves us open and his teammates have to work twice as hard to cover his mistakes. I can bet you he will ******** up more than who ever is his partner at CB.
Mina out and we are terrible in the air. o__O Lol that stadium is empty. Not many people supporting this team. F**king Lastra missing passes again. Who left wide open that forward from Pan to shoot right at Dominguez?! *cough Erazo cough* Who had to hustle and try to save the shot?! *cough Achilier cough* Martinez playing really good again. Needs to be more decisive but doing good. Achilier playing well and covering Erazo's mistakes. Montero showing up today! Great assist! Beautiful! Finally. Bolaños scored. I almost thought he would miss it there hehe.
Montero again. Great breakaway and pass. Martinez two goals now. Showing up again. Can't believe he wasn't a starter. Great heart. Wtf is Dominguez doing? Why is he doing stupid mistakes? Just kick the damn ball. If Chile catches you like that they will make us pay. Bagui is warming up. Seems like Quinteros sees that Ayovi's defending is poor.
Didn't catch the game but from what i saw in the highlights we played very well. This line up is not bad it was actually a line-up that Quinteros said will most likely start against Chile. Overall i think Quinteros got style of play across not 100% but 60-75%. Montero was an absolute beast today as well as Fidel Martinez. Who do you guys like as a CB pairing, Mina-Achilier, Mina-Erazo, or Achilier-Erazo. I think we have enough to get out of the group as 2nd which by my expectation will mean we face Colombia next round.
I, also like our chances of getting out of the group. If Ecuador plays like they did today, and Chile plays like Panama did today we can beat them. Chile"s NT will be under pressure to win the first game. And some of their star players from Juventus and Barcelona: Vidal, Isla, Bravo are barely getting back to their NT. Chile's 23 players Arqueros *Claudio Bravo - Barcelona, España Johnny Herrera - U. de Chile Paulo Garcés - Colo Colo Defensas Eugenio Mena - Cruzeiro, Brasil Miiko Albornoz - Hannover 96, Alemania *Mauricio Isla - Juventus, Italia José Rojas - U. de Chile *Gary Medel - Inter Milán, Italia Gonzalo Jara - Mainz 05, Alemania Volantes David Pizarro - Fiorentina, Italia Carlos Carmona - Atalanta, Italia *Arturo Vidal - Juventus, Italia Jorge Valdivia - Palmeiras, Brasil Matías Fernández - Fiorentina, Italia Jean Beausejour - Colo Colo Felipe Gutiérrez - FC Twente, Holanda Charles Aránguiz - Inter de Porto Alegre, Brasil Marcelo Díaz - Hamburgo, Alemania Delanteros *Alexis Sánchez - Arsenal, Inglaterra Mauricio Pinilla - Atalanta, Italia Eduardo Vargas - Napoli, Italia Edson Puch - Huracán, Argentina Ángelo Henríquez - Dínamo de Zagreb, Croacia
Isla doesn't play in Juventus. He plays in QPR and is Eduardo Vargas' teammate. Anyway, IMO seeing how Chile is a team that goes all into the attack, if we play 'a lo Quinteros', it will very much be a back & forth game throughout 90 mins. The question is if our guys can assimilate what Quinteros is trying to sync into them. Right now it's too early for us to expect our guys to be 100% in-tune with the style of playing that Quinteros wants, but there was a HUGE change in the game yesterday vs. Panama where the high pressure was seen as we intercepted a handful of plays in their territory, where our quick one touch and wall passing was used continuously, and where we'd see Fidel-Miller-Montero trident being very strong which takes a lot of Enner's shoulders. All these guys had chemistry and that trident up front is KEY for the attack to work. Yesterday that was the case and that is a very positive note. I am surprised with Fidel Martinez to be quite honest. But there's lots of merit that should go towards Quinteros b/c I just saw an interview he had and he said something along the lines of "A Fidel se lo aprovecha al maximo cuando juega de mediapunta" and I've said that all the time. He's not a wing, he's not an enganche, but he's a mediapunta. You can even play him as a false 9, but Fidel will be most useful playing as a mediapunta. Rueda and even Vizuete would play him in the total wrong positions which is why he was always ghost when playing on the NT. Por fin tenemos un tecnico con cerebro. Where are the people that like talking about Miller? Scored one and was involved in the play for one of Fidel's goals yesterday. Yeah, thought so. And for those who ask for Juan Cazares, he is not better than Miller and it's evident. Cazares has played probably just as much and hasn't had the impact Miller has. What did Cazares do when he came in yesterday? That's why I always said, he isn't better than Miller and won't bench him. Le queda largo para ser del nivel de Bolanos. The more time Miller gets, the more important he will become on this NT. The Qualifiers will be proof of it. He isn't moving anywhere from the starting 11. And didn't somebody on here say Erazo should be out of the starting 11 and Mina should start? Did anyone see what Mina did in like 10 minutes yesterday? RED CARD. And you don't think experience plays a factor? That's something that Achilier would do in his worst moments. Doesn't guarantee us anything. Imagine Mina doing that in Copa America. There's no way he will handle the chilean attack if he pulls that crap he did yesterday. No thanks! I'll stick with Erazo and Achilier is much more suitable for an opponent like Chile b/c he's our fastest defender. My starting 11 for this cup: Dominguez; Paredes, Achilier, Erazo, Walter; Noboa, Pedro(Lastra); Renato (Fidel), Miller, Montero; Enner I think vs. Chile, Renato will be more useful than Fidel. Against Panama I noticed Fidel had more freedom on the field than Miller did at times, but vs. Chile we need to have speed on the wings and Fidel doesn't have the speed and explosiveness that Renato has which I think will be crucial on the counter, especially when it comes to going back and forth. I just hope Renato is healthy enough by then b/c there's bound to be lots of running and desgaste in that game. And also I see Pedro being more suitable than Lastra vs. Chile. He's faster y tiene mejor pie. The only thing that worries me about Pedro is his fouling. I hope he can keep it clean if he starts. Other than that, the other 9 players son fijos 100% throughout the entire tournament.
I can understand the optimism, Best game under Quinteros' yet, couple of things to keep in mind. Panama: Let's be honest about our rival...They did not come to play this game, gave us ridiculous space, their defense was non existent and their lack of speed made it super easy for our players to do as they pleased. Our offense: I hope everyone noticed something, Quinteros changed his offense drastically changed this game and we saw a glimpse in the last game, we are relying heavily on the wings again and in my opinion this is a wise decision from his part, use our strengths, Walter and Montero were phenomenal on the left, Fidel was a good choice for right wing even if he played out of position, this took some weight off Bolanos (who I insist is not the superstar many claim to be) but we saw a huge difference on his game, he was a piece of the offense not the main resource, I was happy he didnt take any shots on goal but instead looked for Montero, Enner or Fidel, speaking of the latter,Quinteros recently said that Martinez gives him many options regarding where to put him, to think that some people wanted him out of the NT. right now Martinez is a starter to me. The Result: Guys, Rueda, Vizuete, Suarez, Bolillo, all of them have been able to score 4-5 goals to CONCACAF teams, so let us be cautious towards Thursday's game, fortunately Chile,Bolivia nor Mexico have looked really good, Chile took a lot of crap from their press about that 1-0 victory over El Salvador and Bolivia looked horrid against Argentina, Mexico's B team didnt impress against Peru nor Against Brasil (without Neymar). Defense Eso es lo que hay, I would have liked Luis Romero to get a chance but I cant say he would make a difference, Erazo whatever he is, speed wise, height wise he is still our best prospect, Quinteros is trying to get him some confidence, he even wore the captain band in Panama. Mina let me down big time and Achillier is what it is, solid defender with the tendency to at least make one big mistake in each game. Dominguez is looking his best at the moment I hope he can transfer some of that strength in our defense.