Copa América de 2021

Discussion in 'Brazil' started by Century's Best, Jun 8, 2021.

  1. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    A fila segue ... mais uma vítima do Tite Rei da CONMEBOL :ROFLMAO:
     
  2. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    They went to sleep on two plays... once when the ball hit the ref, and once when... well, they went to sleep on a corner.

    Brazil likes to score late.
     
  3. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    The complaints by the Colombians were based on a rule that if the football strikers the referee, it's a drop ball. But there are three conditions:

    1. The ball was going straight to the net (not applicable here)
    2. Change of possession (not applicable here)
    3. Starting a promising/potential attack (potentially applicable)

    Neymar's pass was going towards a Colombian player but came back to Paquetá.

    Néstor Pitana is no rookie referee, and he refereed the 2018 World Cup final. He knows the laws of the game and what FIFA says is mandatory and what FIFA recommends.

    In any case, Brazil won 2-1, and the Colombians completely blew the marking on Casemiro. Brazil once beat Colombia in a similar play, with a header, in a match at Morumbi 21 years ago in World Cup qualifying. However good they are in aerial offense, the Colombians are lacking in aerial defense.

    That was one of the worse first half performances by Brazil under Tite, but hopefully Tite will draw some lessons from this, both for the rest of this tournament and for WCQ. Colombia is a quality team with good players, and despite losing a WCQ match 6-1 late last year, they are definitely improving from where they were then. Ecuador is likewise blessed with physically strong, fast, and athletic players; it's best to go through these struggles now.
     
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  4. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I think he got it right. The ball went backwards so (3) is not applicable. It became a more dangerous play because Colombian players stopped for a second giving us more space. Having said that, people are saying Pitana made it look like he was going to blow the whistle which would add to the confusion. The problem here is that the rule can be subjective like anything in football and makes the situation more complicated than it needs to be.
     
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  5. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    Indeed.

    There is subjectivity in refereeing. This is often seen in Libertadores matches. There have been many times non-Brazilian players physically strike Brazilian players and knock them down (body checks) and the Brazilian player sits there with his arms outstretched awaiting a foul call.

    But the ref lets it go; styles of play vary per country. What is oftentimes deemed a foul in Brazil league play is not seen as a foul in other leagues.

    This was also historically evident at the World Cup; South America and Europe differed in certain regards.

    Even in the late 1970s, Europeans saw a two-footed challenge as fair if the football was close enough, but in South America, this was seen as a direct red-worthy foul. But what has often been "normal" in South America (the catimba, the off-the-ball tripping, elbowing, dirty play, malandragem that most South American play saw and to an extent still sees) was considered sacrilege and cynical by football teams of the Old World.

    Anyone who thinks subjectivity is not going to happen is naive and wrong. Even with VAR, there are going to be incorrect calls, but I would only hope that fans of certain clubs/national teams who allow their emotions and biases to get the best of their wisdom and reason will remember that they too have been the beneficiaries of highly questionable refereeing decisions.
     
  6. Estuardo A. Lopez

    Jul 9, 2014
    Club:
    AC Milan
    I hope Neymar is OK.
    It's really gross that a team like Colombia, that has such a limited skill set, decides to rely of violence to make up for their rather large limitations. But that's futbol.
    As others have said elsewhere, Brazil's stamina and physicality is impressive because they kept coming at the Colombians until the end. Colombia was dead after the 1 hr mark, it seemed to me.
    Brazil really does have a certain "European" physical quality about them.
     
  7. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    I think this is an excellent point about Colombia tiring out. I am not so sure it was Tite's changes that had an effect as much as stamina coming into play.
     
  8. IVO !

    IVO ! Member

    Feb 25, 2009
    RIO AND CHICAGO
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Well how about the FDP Columbian taking out Neymar in the quarters of the 2014 WC ? Still sick over that.
     
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  9. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Douglas Luiz will start tomorrow. Speculation that Renan Lodi, Emerson and Vini Jr. may also start but the line-up isn't clear based on today's training. In training Douglas Luiz lined up with Fabinho in midfield. I like the idea of him getting more starts.
     
  10. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Here's today's alternative line-up:

    Allisson; Emerson, Militão, Marquinhos, Renan Lodi; Fabinho, Douglas Luiz, Paquetá, Everton Cebolinha; Gabigol, Firmino
     
  11. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    1x0 Militão with a nice header from a free-kick.

    Slow game, some good signs from the full-backs and Paquetá but nothing really exciting yet.

    If the current results hold, Ecuador are out. Hopefully that opens things up a little.
     
  12. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Ecuador puts some pressure on and gets a goal on a corner that Brazil couldn't clear.

    This will probably make this game slow down again.
     
  13. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    *Yawn*
    So, tomorrow we find out who we play on Friday. Either Uruguay or Chile.
     
  14. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    I noticed that posters from other countries have written several posts about what has to happen to make sure what team ends on which side of the bracket so that their team ensures they avoid playing Brazil. The fear they have of Brazil is palpable.

    Personally I don't care who it is Brazil has to face. Brazil did its duty and ended the group stage undefeated and as group winner. Whoever it is, let the chips fall where they may.
     
    Estuardo A. Lopez repped this.
  15. Mengão86

    Mengão86 Moderator
    Staff Member

    Flamengo
    Brazil
    Nov 16, 2005
    Maryland, RJ/ES/PE
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Paquetá!!!!!
     
  16. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    What a stupid decision by Gabriel Jesus to go after that ball. No business doing that.
     
  17. Kaka10725

    Kaka10725 Member+

    Jun 1, 2007
    Very stupid
     
  18. StrokingMonkeys

    Oct 4, 2009
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    G.Jesus seems to like showing up at the end of tournaments, not at the beginnings... sigh...
     
  19. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Showing up in the worst way this time.

    It strikes me as him just not being in the game and that's why he was able to do that and not realize he was about to kick someone in the face.

    As good as he is in Tite's system on the right side, he deserves to be benched for that.
     
  20. onefineesq

    onefineesq Member+

    Sep 16, 2003
    Laurel, MD
    Club:
    DC United
    Nat'l Team:
    United States
    Is it possible he gets a 2nd game for that and would be out for the potential final?
     
  21. Ombak

    Ombak Moderator
    Staff Member

    Apr 19, 1999
    Irvine, CA
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Possible? Yes, but I find it difficult to imagine more than a one-game suspension because of how he behaved, it was clearly not intentional, he knew what he had done right away and the result wasn't bad (though it could have been).

    Unless there's an automatic element to that kind of red card becoming a 2-game suspension, I don't see it happening.

    On another note, one thing to consider is how much work Brazil is doing to make up for being a man down. The next match, if we close this out, is Monday, only 2 days rest.
     
  22. StrokingMonkeys

    Oct 4, 2009
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Oh la laaaa, Brasil could have ended this right there!
     
  23. StrokingMonkeys

    Oct 4, 2009
    Club:
    Flamengo Rio Janeiro
    Anyway, a win is a win :D
     
  24. celito

    celito Member+

    Palmeiras
    Brazil
    Feb 28, 2005
    USA
    Club:
    Palmeiras Sao Paulo
    Nat'l Team:
    Brazil
    Achei o lance do Jesus pra amarelo ….
     
  25. Century's Best

    Century's Best Member+

    Jul 29, 2003
    USA
    #100 Century's Best, Jul 2, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 2, 2021
    Brazil hangs in there and survives being down to 10 men thanks to Gabriel Jesus' karate kick. We're fortunate for Lucas Paquetá's goal, which resulted from a great series of quick passes.

    Credit to the team for adjusting given the formation Chile sent its starting XI with made Brazil's playmaking difficult and which gave the visitors an advantage of ball possession in the first half.

    This may be the final showing for the handful of Chileans who lifted the trophy 6 years ago in Santiago and who played Brazil tonight. It was a historic run for a team that won two Copas América within a bit more than a 1-year period. I never thought this Chile would have been left out of the 2018 World Cup - I wonder how well this generation would have done.

    Peru up next - a team which Brazil faced twice in the 2019 tournament and which is only one of three teams which defeated Brazil during the Tite era, and which showed today it's got plenty of fighting spirit (as did Paraguay, but the Peruvians were better from the penalty spot).
     
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