Since everyone seems to be creaming their pants regarding the recent 2 game run of Corey Gibbs, I figured I'd make a little point about CC. Granted, all I saw of him was a few highlights of his game last week, but I just had to lament the fact that his injury will keep him out of this WC Cycle. From the few times I've seen him with the Nats, I definitely think he is the closest thing we have to McBride. He is good in the air, he can hold up the ball, and seems to be pretty adept at dishing it off to attacking midfielders to start a move. His goal against Hertha was well taken...after the initial stop, his rebound volley was impressive. He also later broke down the wing, showing decent speed, and fed Thurk for another good chance. I saw today that Arena will name 10 alternates for the World Cup 23...I hope Conor can at least make that...because if he can get healthy, I think he would be a nice insurance policy for McBride. Moreso than Ching, and probably moreso than Twellman.
The excitement over Gibbs is that he might be back to what he was. Conor Casey on the other hand has done next to nothing in a Nats uniform. He was extremely mediocre in the Pre-hex and failed to make much of an impression in his other games save the Poland match. Comparing the two players situation is not apropos at all.
First of all, your first paragraph not only contains a disgusting metaphor, it's erroneous. Gibbs has only been back for one game, not two. But more to the point, Gibbs accomplished a heck of a lot more in his previous Nats games than most other players in our pool. So we are excited about Gibbs not ONLY based on his performance in the last game, but because he's back and is demonstrating the potential that he showed in his prior games. Casey, on the other hand, showed very little in the games he played in for the MNT before getting injured. Everyone likes to slam on Ching, and for many good reasons, but Ching at least scored a couple of goals. Casey never even got so much as an assist. Most of what I saw were ill-advised tackles on the goalkeeper which are red cards just waiting to happen. Yes, he made a few nice passes, but that's not what we need in a target forward. For the World Cup, there's no way he brings more to the table than Twellman or Wolff at this point.
You would be lamenting a fantasy -- prior to his injury, Casey was not that high on the depth chart. His failure to impress last year was already blocking him from making the squad. Of course, who knows what would have happened IF CC had never been injured. He is a talented guy who was playing in a league where good play would have been noticed. But that's pure speculation and the odds were against it.
I would take a healthy and in form Casey over Ching or Twellman. Casey has produced at the Bundesliga level when healthy and in form, which is a better indicator of international level ability for me than MLS or even some concacaf games. His ball skills are better than Ching and Twellman, and he is faster. I just don't see Twellman or CHing ever scoring at the international level (aside from a fluke) but I can see Casey doing it.
Problem is that Casey hasn't produced at the international at all regardless of his Bundesliga experience.
Sorry to disgust...wait...I mean get over it. Secondly, I was referring to his game with the Nats, and his solid game with ADO this weekend. Nowhere did I say this excitement was exclusively for his form with the Nats, otherwise, this discussion would be moot considering Casey hasn't put on the Nats uni in quite some time. I wouldn't take him over Wolff, because I think you can use Wolff in attack, and in the midfield (in a pinch.) Twellman has shown precious little against physical competition, which is what we will face in Italy and the Czechs. TT is likely not to start in those games anyway, but if I had to put money on it, I would say Casey is better equipped to deal with those sides thanks to his time in Germany. I am not necessarily saying that I would take him over TnT, due to Twellman being less of a health concern, but more that he would be a good guy to have around when push comes to shove. Probably better to have than Ching due to his club experiences...and definitely someone Bruce at least wants to put on the alternate list in case the unthinkable happens and McBride goes down. (knocks on wood)
Even more speculative - we could be having this same argument about Convey if he had been out injured all year. He was probably in similar shape to Casey in terms of his Nat-worthiness - lots of potential, no results yet. I find it hard to believe that if Clint Mathis (or any other MLS'er) goes on a tear to star the year, they should be considered for last minute inclusion...but not Casey if he closes the BL season strong. It's all hypothetical, of course... Edit: Front page BS status, and only 7 replies...2 of which are from me. This thread has officially gone over like a lead balloon.
Well Convey has always had more potential than Casey for me and even prior to this year had performed well for the USMNT at times, but it's a generally fair comparison. It could have happened for Casey, but that doesn't change the fact that you can't say injury kept him off the squad since he wasn't on it when he was injured. Actually, I think it is very unlikely that any MLSer other than Clint Mathis would be considered if he started out the season hot if they were not already at least an alternate. And Mathis is a special case as he has shown that when at the top of his game, he is a legitimate international player. Casey never has shown that. The real comparison is where you started -- with Gibbs. Gibbs is coming off injury but was called in while Casey wasn't. Why? Because Gibbs has shown the ability to be a starter and certainly contribute and Arena wanted to see where he is. Casey is different because he has never shown that kind of form for the USMNT and Arena is simply not interested in where he is now because he is too far down the depth chart. Injuries and a tear could change things, but it is a long shot.
Twellman's a great finisher and a selfless player in the box. if he gets service he'll score or setup goals. A much better choice than Ching. Take Casey instead of Wolff IMO. Casey played well for the Nats up to a certain point and then went invisible his next time out (forget which game it was). I don't remember seeing him after that.
With how lackluster Wolff's play has been, and how inexperienced TT & EJ are, if Mathis or Casey can ratchet it up soon, one of them should be in and Wolff should be out without even a second thought.
He played decently against Poland in a friendly. After that, he played to little effect 1) in friendlies against Mexico, Honduras andEngland, 2) in World Cup Qualifiers against Grenada, El Salvador and Panama AND 3) in the Gold Cup against Cuba.
Is that you Steve Sampson? And please tell me, coach, that you dont believe that CC is faster than those two. Not to be an ass, coach, but CC may very well be the slowest player the NATS have ever played, sans Alexi Lalas and Balboa.
Hell yea, I'd love to see Mathis get back out there. He needs an awesome start to the MLS season though to have a chance. Wolff would be best used as an alternate... or as a cheerleader.
True. When healthy, Gibbs has potential to start next to Gooch, which is why we need to ensure that he gets as many minutes as possible. I certainly don't think Casey should start, my whole reason for starting this thread is to lament that he has virtually no shot this cycle, because I think he is more McBride like than either Ching or Twellman. Slotting him in would hopefully cause less turmoil, if starting him became necessary. Most likely, if there's no McBride, you would probably see EJ and Wolff, and hope our Mids put some in the nets...
Just in response, according to ussoccerplayers.com Casey did have an assist in 2004 in qualifying. Also, those saying he was not a factor in the USMNT prior to injury are delusional. In 2004, prior to injury, he played 3 qualifiers in a row. He might not have been a starter, but Arena was just as interested in him as Twellman or Ching. This can be demonstrated by his call up to the Gold Cup. Unfortunately, he tore his ACL is the macth versus Cuba, or else he would have been just as involved in the later matches as those two. Then add to the fact that in 2004, he was playing very well at the time and Mainz claims that 10 Bundesliga clubs showed legitmiate interest in him. Additionally, Arena was signaling him out for pariase as far back as 2004. Prior to injury in teh Gold Cup, he was a factor in the USMNT and was a potential if not probable member of the World Cup squad.
No, Ching is just as much a power player as Casey and has outperformed him. Well since Twellman, Wolff and EJ have far superior scoring records compared to Casey's ZERO USMNT goals, I don't see how Casey would address this issue.
No, Casey played in three early round qualifiers in late 2004 and based on his play, was dropped for the Hex qualifiers in 2005, while Ching started in several Hex qualifiers (and scored in one). Ching was injured for the Gold Cup. The bottom line is that the last time both of them were healthy and available for important matches, Ching was strongly preferred. Casey's poor showing against Cuba before his injury certainly gave no indication that that was going to change, though anything is possible. With respect to Twellman, he arrived on the scene later than Casey, so it is harder to compare. Twellman was just coming off injury when the Gold Cup started, so picking Casey over Twellman for that tournament demonstrates nothing. Twellman then started playing in qualifiers, something I suspect would have happened anyway given Casey's poor play against Cuba.
You appear to be basing this on international play...I know Ching has probably scored a few goals in that respect. My argument is predicated on the idea that perhaps CC's club performance (if consistent over the last part of the BL) should trump Ching's goals from last year's qualifiers...or Wolff's pen against Scotland, etc. Wolff, as we all know, hasn't had much of a Nats scoring touch since the run up to WC02. Still, his unique set of skills as a striker, combined with experience, will likely land him on the team. I somewhat feel this way about Casey vs. Ching - Of course, Ching and Casey would probably be competing for last man out anyway.
Club play gets you in the door, nothing more. If you don't perform internationally you are out -- which is where Casey was when he got injured. It is too bad that he didn't get a chance to redeem himself and perform decently at the international stage since he is a talented guy and Twellman, though also a very talented guy, does struggle against big European defenders.
been out of the states a long time. didn't realize that this phrase was still used. i like gibbs. but i am cautiously optimistic. maybe the creaming part will come in june.
Casey has not produced at the 1. Bundesliga level. You are apparently thinking of his play in the 2. Bundesliga. Bit of a difference between the two. You should watch more of the USMNT games. They've both scored in multiple games for the USMNT. You will have to use your imagination for Casey, since he has never scored a goal for the USMNT.
ya for real if mean if we went by scott's criteria for the USNATS lord knows donovan wouldn't even be in the player pool