It's possible that happened...Added to the fact that they presented a poor 1st group stage (possibly as a consequence of the lottery scandal)...It seems that a kind of "Nothing to loose" thought that may have strengthened them. It's not an excuse. Imo, brazilian overconfidence didn't allow the necessary carefulness, and they were not prepared to afford the high price for that italian overcome.
True. Many Brazilian fans thought that the 1994 team was too "European". I suppose with Parreira, you aren't going to get a typical Brazilian team. Christian Poulsen of Denmark would agree with you on that count.
I am one of these fans... And that's one of the reasons I can say, with a little bit of hypocrisy, that I prefer remembering Telê's Brazil in WC 82, even defeated, than to celebrate the Parreira's 1994 trophy. That team was not too 'european'...it was...few brazilian! We suffered from a lack of 'geniusy' in midfield (once Raí was not at his best). Thanks God this 'geniusy' went to attack and Romário did his part. I don't suppose... I AM SURE!!! Well, it's not too far. You just have to remember WC 06... Probably he should've had the best players ever under his command. He had the chance to do, possibly, one of the best brazilian teams ever, or even teach R. Carlos that arranging socks during the matchis not recommended...but there were too many stars in that sky...well...it's better to talk about someting different...
Nonetheless let's remember that it was Parreira who ironically took Brazil from a 24-year span without even being able to get to a final. Maybe none of you here fully lived that period (1970-1994), but no one can describe the frustration of the common Brazilian rooter with the inexistence of a single world title in that whole quarter of a century.(!) Parreira in 1994 was essential for the formation of an atipically conservative but efficient system that didn't allow risks & at the same time would let Romário & Bebeto (our ONLY offensive assets in that epoch) free to score their more than decisive goals. He was smart enough to hint his adversaries would fancy to see an openly offensive Brazilian team (as usual). And they all fell in his trap. At that time, it was more important to regain the lost prestige (with a title: whichever way it were conquered) than to play to the tribunes and keep losing. Sorry, but 2006 it was not just Parreira's fault. But mainly the player's: they were victims of the lack of preparation arbitrarilly imposed by the European calendar (the best were just available 10-15 days before the Cup!) & all the overhype they got from world press ... Parreira is a hell of a strategist, but he's not Superman ...
Me too. That would also include Brazil´s 1990 team (even worse) and their teams from the 70s, more or less. As far as 82, I think Brazil´s problem was more of not having a centre-foward (Serginho replacing future star Careca, who was injured right before the match against the U.S.S.R.) then lacking defenders and a keeper.
The European players of those teams don't have to rush to the other side of the planet in order to undergo totally different temperatures/climates & conceptions of training then rush back to Europe in order to dispute a World Cup with the obligation of winning it. Besides they don't have to go through all the stress of waiting for the Euro clubs to selfishly 'resolve' liberating them in the last minute to a competition which is much more important to them as sons of their countries & to their personal lives than a mere CL or UEFA Cup. So it's a bit weird seeing the world (specially European world) expressing its 'surprise' with Brazil's inferior performance.
Not fully, but I lived...and the frustration was bigger when we played a magic football... For sure he had merits...and that's why brazilian people expected he could do in WC 06 the same (win the WC!) he did in 94, with a better (???) team. I agree it was not just Parreira's fault... Along with previously mentioned lack of preparation (CBF...humpf), favouritism imposed by press, age and ambition of some players, etc., I think Parreira could be essential again. That's one of the points... But it is subject for an entire post... https://www.bigsoccer.com/forum/showthread.php?t=810324
Parreira was not the ideal coach for 2006. Too many spoiled stars around him (he disliked that & didn't have force enough to impose his discreet style upon them)... He specialized himself in coaching (& be listened by) minnow players of minor teams, and - against all the odds - leading them to continental success & surprising WC participations. Parreira was (& still is) adored in those countries (worked in Ghana & South Africa too). So, he is an expert in 'taking rabbits from the top hat'. It was the case of Brazil in 1994: we were completely discredited internationally (and even internally) and simply looked we couldn't find our way to a WC title anymore. In 1994, nobody believed in Brz football (specially after the 1990 failure). He was chosen 'a dedo' to sack Brazil from 'the bottom of the well' in an epoch in which our only world stars were Romário & Bebeto. Dunga, Jorginho, Mauro Silva, Márcio Santos, Branco, Leonardo, Taffarel only had full international recognizal after the victory of the team he pacient and efficiently organized. He even made a passable player like Zinho to have an essential function in that team! ... Which doesn't mean he's a mediochre coach of mediochre teams. Very much the opposite: his success with weaker teams made him the ideal person to recuperate the respect due to Brazil (even if Brz had to play 'ugly' in order to win a Cup again). Odd enough it may sound to you, but I commemorated more 1994 than 2006.
Bingo! That's the main point... Brazil had, since many years, a great list of names for that WC and even the most pessimistic believed a good campaign, if not for the team itself, but for the names ("if the team does not play well, some 'geniousy' should decide"). I agree he is a great coach, specially about strategy, but I think a brazilian coach cannot even allow himself to be overshaddowed by the stars under his command... Mee too!!! That was the first world championship I commemorated in my life and I didn't care it was 'ugly' or not...
I meant 2002 and not '2006' He's a great coach of minnow teams, and that demands a particular type of experteese. Zagallo was the type of coach who had success either with big or minor NTs (classified the Arab Emirates for the 1990 WC). I don't know if Telê Santana or Felipão though (who were great coaches of great teams) would have the same success with teams like Saudi Arabia, Arab Emirates, or even, Brazil 94... The 1st wouldn't be cautious enough, the 2nd wouldn't have the least patience with those 'cabeças-de-bagre' ...
I agree... But now, with the milk already spilled, it's difficult to say who could be the 'ideal' coach. Zagallo would be a good option, if he was 15 years younger... The fact is that Brazil needed a coach a with little bit more courage and attitude (To face CBF, media press and the stars of the team).
That's true. Felipão would have been the natural choice after 2002, but CBF 'dormiu no ponto'. CBF itself had to be harsher with the UEFA teams in terms of the liberation of its players with more time for preparation before the Cup. They got to Germany tired & still thinking of the millions earned in the Euro season. There was no enough time & psychological atmosphere to appropriately prepare them to a competition that so much critically involves the prestige of a country (in their case, Brazil). Even a Felipão would have a much harder time in 2006 motivating the players to be as alert as in 2002. In 2002 a 'mordido' Brazil was coming from a tragic defeat in 98. In 2006 they were champions and 9-10 favourites. Players naturally relax.
Felipão overcame the challenge of 2002... By 2006, he wanted another (together with a little bit more $$$ ) Althugh for brazilian players tiredness is of great influence due to geographical positions, I still think it happens to ALL teams. It's true brazilian players, in particular the first-eleven, didn't have the same ambition of 2002, due to many reasons... Many of them have aleady won 'everything' they wanted, they were the champions and were considered the likely next champions, so they naturally relax. But it's not normal to a coach allow trainings like that... That was like a 'Big Brother'! Players were worried about smiling to TV instead of working hard to win a WC... That's the real truth: they ALL were not living a WC athmosphere...
I disagree with the assessment that Parreira wasn't ideal for the 2006 team. His 2004-05 team was simply spectacular, one of the best Brazil teams since 1982. The 2005 Conferations Cup demolition of Argentina was really something to behold. Many players just got lazy and lost the hunger (Scary- they might have still won the 2006 WC if it weren't for the RC sock-pulling-up episode). On the topic of this thread, the Brazilian defense is UNQUESTIONABLY underrated. During Brazil's unprecedented 11 game WIN streak in the WC over 2002-06, the defense kept clean sheets in most games. The defense just fell short (1 Japan goal) of Italy's record of 5 straight clean sheets, which Italy set in the dismal 1990 WC, the lowest scoring WC in history, and one in which they played at home. If that isn't defensive dominance I don't know what could possibly qualify- and remember, Brazil (unfortunately) wasn't playing a 1982-style possession game. Lucio is one of the all-time Brazil greats, IMO.
Why use those big names when they are not hungry enough to perform in the biggest stage? That IMO is the coach's fault, although those players shouldn't have these kinds of attitudes in the first place. And I may get flamed for saying this, but I think the competition in 2002 and 2006 is less than in 90 because of the expansion of World Cup. There's really nothing to brag about keeping clean sheet against the likes of China. (Trust me I am Chinese) Moreover, Croatia and Australia were not known for playing attacking football, and Brazil also conceded against Costa Rica and Japan; but they kept clean sheet when it mattered the most (Germany). Overall I do think Brazil's defense is underrated because of their technical abilities. They defend well when it matter most, but they will lose concentration against lesser opponents.
Yes..the team in 2004-05 was great, when playing against Peru and Chile (for WC Qualifying, two examples I remember the press exalted the 'magic box') and a modified Argentina in that Confederations Cup, where Brazil almost didn't qualify for the semis. I wonder why that team didn't play that good one year after... Please, don't go too far...Actually, that team filled brazilians fans' hearts with the hope that the magic of Brazil'82 would be repeated. But it was not more than a simple hope... That's the purpose of the thread: to break that paradigm (how pretentious! )... How can brazilian defense be usually underestimated with that historical numbers? By the way, that's a good example to understand the subject of the thread...In numbers, as you said, the 02-06 WC brazilian defense was great, almost compared to one of the best ever (Italy'90). But when I think of pathetic moments in that WC's, I rememer RC's sock and (your great ) Lucio's mess against England. Maybe these few goals conceeded are enough to justify brazilian this defense underrating...
Yeah...but again these are just classic examples of not being fully concentrated in the games. When Ronaldinho was out with a red card against England, Brazil defended the rest of the match very well. It just shows that when they want to they are a good defensive team. (Although you also have to credit England for being so awful offensively.)
I agree. My point is exactly that: maybe lack of concentration lets brazilian defense conceed that 'awful' goals... But even when defense is playing well, we brazilian are always afraid of a 'blackout', due to its inconsistence.
That will always happens to a team whose historical vocation is the attack (even if in a particular moment its attack is not so mortal as in 1970 or 1982). Nilton Santos, Carlos Alberto, Marinho Chagas, Leandro, Josimar, Junior, Branco & more recently, R. Carlos, Cafu, Daniel Alves, Juan, Maicon, Maxwell, etc etc scoring important goals in capital in CA, CC & WC games make part of a big Brz tradition of 'defending strikers'. Even working 'back there' their eyes are always fixed on the adversary's nets and sometimes they forget their own ...
Yes, I totally agree. Bad for us, who must be used to be always frightened ("Ohmy God!! There goes Lucio again!!!")...
In Brazil goalies and defenders are all frustrated strikers ... The worst offense to any child here is to tell him: "Stay in defense', or 'Go to the goal!' ...
It would have taken a lot of luck to win that WC. It's not like we were playing well and RC's sock incident screwed us over. I think our first shot on target that game came in the last 15 mins. We had a good first 10 mins in that game and then we completely shut down. Honestly, the game against Ghana already showed us how unbalanced and disconnected that team was. I wouldn't even blame the defense in 06. It was mostly our midfield that did us in.
I agree, and I'd say more...It was not only the game agaist Ghana...ALL the games showed that disconnection (except, for instances, the unvaluable match against Japan). The defense was not the only responsable, as has been said, but that's too much to say (maybe a theme for another thread)...