Carrying on the greatest tradition of the British tabloids, the title of this thread is horrendously misleading and inflammatory. However Blatters bizarre comments do seem to target Arsenal. Read the Soccernet article here What is this guy's problem?
Total ****************!! So because i was unlucky enough to have my parents decide to move from europe, i should just stop playing soccer, because Oh my god the english youth can't keep up. If i had a bullet and an a dollar for every **************** comment he's made i'd have a plane ticket and a assault rifle to silience him. Know what, i think i'll just stop playing soccer, learn to skate, and play hockey, because you know what, being from canada automatically means that i have to conceed my place to lesser quality players. We already have to put up with racism, now he wants to implement nationalityism (lol new word you get the meaning ) Total ****************.
Hey, there are worse fates in life than becoming a hockey player.. As far as Sepp Blatter goes, he's in love with the sound of his own voice.
Teso likes ManU, therefore Teso hates Arsenal. Blatter criticizes Arsenal therefore Teso must agree. Its called Troll Logic.
I can't argue with that point. Globalisation has affected our game in so many bad ways. While there have been some good points, the overall result of foreign influence has been a negative one. I fully agree with that. Some clubs are so desperate that they will sign a young foreign player, just to get a foot into the market. Again, I agree. You lot might find it harsh, but it is true. You were nicknamed mini-France for a while and for a very good reason. To only have two English players is a joke, regardless of the team involved. Another good point. Obviously people will still be fans, but they lose the "personal" connection with the team if they are all foreign. The youngster point is a key issue. Kids used to dream of playing for their club and it would spur them on. Unfortunately, if you ask most kids today, the majority would say that they have no chance now. Hardly great, especially for youth development. Kids are lost before they even begin and most end up with an inferiority complex. Very good point. Clubs can call it searching for the best, but it is to the sole detriment of youth development in the clubs country. Let's be pefectly honest here, how many young foreign players usually make it through development to become a key player? Just look at Scotland for the perfect example. England obviously isn't as bad, but you can still see the affect on the NT. You do not have the depth and quality young players aren't good enough to force their way in, regardless of how the older players are performing. What about the left-sided problem? Downing might be a good prospect, but he is still being snubbed. Let's see: Blatter, UEFA and Teso Dos Bichos. Yes, we all hate Arsenal and love Man Utd...
I thought about responding to this point by point, but its utterly useless. Foreigners are always such a convenient scapegoat, increasingly so in England and Scotland. Why? Because every time a country produces a mediocre generation of players, or anytime a national team falls on hard times, nationalists look for excuses. England has been mediocre for so long... Scotland always so. So let's blame the foreigners for coming in and stealing away roster spots from mediocre players. Please... there's a reason no one watches the Scottish league, and why the EPL was utter crap until 10 years ago. If you can't see the benefits of foreign influence on a global game, you are living in the past. And taking your reasoning a step further, why stop at nationality? If we are talking Arsenal, I don't think the team should field anyone born more than 50 km of Highbury. That will give a "personal" feel to the team, because again the only people that should be able to support Arsenal should live within that distance. Explain to me why is it OK for a lad from Newcastle to play for Arsenal and that's OK, but if the guy happens to be born in Calais its wrong? Please explain this to me. Its not like the guy from Newcastle has the same accent as a London lad. Sepp Blatter is senile, and is staking his future on appealing to this increasing nationalism in England, Germany, and Scotland, or any other country that is looking for excuses why the quality of players they produce is bad. And its stupid too... England has the most promising generation of players its had in recent memory. I'm not trying to go after you personally Teso but this issue is a pet peeve of mine. In every other profession we stress that the best should work, regardless of where they come. Suddenly we talk football and then everyone gets nationalist. The same crap is starting in the U.S. with the NBA and its complete bull**********
I disagree, the level of football in the EPL has risen in the last few years, and i feel that this has been mainly due to the influence of foreign born players and managers. Many clubs outside Europe survive on the transfer fees generated by selling their players to big clubs. I think the good outweighs the bad, and find the comment about globalization strange from a man whose job is promoting football globally. Could it be that he is threatened by the fact that his organization is losing its monopoly on exciting internationally flavored football. Blatters comments here seemed pointed at clubs like Real, which makes purchases with an eye towards the global market. But lets be real, football is a business and the teams are run in a business like way are the ones that survive and thrive. They also boost the profile of the game internationally and make more people want to play and watch the sport as a whole. I disagree, i have no problem associtating Arsenal with London, in fact i think the players in a way reflect London as an cosmopolitan, multicultural, international city. I must say I don't hear many Arsenal fans complaining about the level of play our foreign stars have brougth over. If people want to see crap football being played by local lads their are many teams in the lower divisions that would be happy to oblige them. Most fans just want their team to be the best possible, and would rather see a talented foreigner than a mediocre local lad. I'm sure that Arsenal would like to field more English players but the great ones are overpriced due to the high demand for them. And as far as the youngsters go why would they give up on their dream just because the players on their team aren't from their local areas. Haven't players like Cantona, Di Canio, and Henry inspired young players with their skill and talent. Haven't players like Owen and Rooney come through the ranks to reach stardom with their local sides, and then leave for bigger clubs. Kids with an inferiority complex are never gonna make it anyway. I don't know of any club that has given up on local talent to focus strictly on training players overseas. And I'm surprised at the comment from Blatter (not really) as i would think he would see the benefit to his organization from having better training facilities in third world countries, and these countries producing better national teams. As far as the players go i would imagine that even the ones who don't make it to Europe benefit as footballers from the resources pumped into their communities by the globalization of football. I don't know what Scotlands problem is but i doubt its foreign players. They do seem to lag in the production fo local talent, but this should be the concern of the SFA not FIFA. England, Ireland and Wales seem to be doing pretty well in the last few years though. Have players like Lampard, Terry, Campell, Ashley Cole, Owen, etc., suffered by their exposure to talented foreign players, no, they have improved by being challenged daily by the best players in the world. [/QUOTE] Yes, we know, and you all get an equal amount of intellectual respect for your well though out, intelligent ideas. But you left out the FA.
Most clubs seem to want to win Cups and Championships, therefore, try to get the best players, no matter where they were born. AW scouts young players he thinks will grow and make at difference at Arsenal. If he wanted to move into new commercial demographics, he would be going after the big name established stars. Overall, the influence of foriegn players has been good. I would love to see more English players on Arsenals side though and was sad to see Parlour go.
The problem with this whole thread is the enormous difference in perspective from the opposing sides and the fact that they're both right. It is to top-level club football's benefit as well as the benefit of "emerging" nations that there is a massive influx of foreign talent. The top club teams play a more attractive game and the emerging nations get players with better experience and development. Teso's point is also correct in that laxer labor laws result in a dearth of opportunity for local talent (unless they want to play in 3rd world countries for 3rd world wages) which means that kids look to other professions and the national team of the once-great nation suffers. There is no way to win this argument unless you can get your opponent to radically alter his interests; there is no wrong side here. Oh, and if reaching the semi-finals of the WC makes a team mediocre than I truly hope the US can achieve piss-poor status in 06.
I disagree, IMO there is always a place for talented youngsters, they just have to step it up more now than they used to. Maybe there is less opportunity at the top level, but the ones who make it will be stronger. I don't see why a less talented kid would have to go to a third world country when he could go to a third division side. The kids who can't make the grade should leave, get and education and find something they can be successful at. Why would this affect the National Team though, no team has suffered because they don't have enough mediocre players, they suffer because they don't have enough good and great players. And as far as laxer labor laws i'd be worried about alot of other jobs before i worried about the footballers. I don't see anyone bringing on a whole squad of chinese players just to save on wages.
Then why are the people who live in the affected areas saying differently? Shouldn't they be able to judge the situation better than someone reading about it in San Diego or Providence? I was being sarcastic about the 3rd world country thing just to show that it's a one-way street. As for kids finding other things to do with their lives, well, they are and that's what the complaint is about. Noone really knows how good a 14-year-old could potentially be (Jordan was cut from his h.s. basketball team) so by weeding the crop that early you have to assume that you are losing potential geniuses as well as potential bench-warmers. Sorry, but you're dead wrong here. Even a cursory look through WC history will expose dozens of squads of mediocre players who, through proper management, were able to achieve greater things than they should've. Besides, we're not talking about just the mediocre players, we're talking about potential great ones as well. This statement misses the whole point of the thread. That discussion belongs on bigchemists or bigmcdonalds or bigsomethingotherthansoccer. Just to clarify my position, I love the influx of foreigners. It makes Arsenal more fun to watch and it has greatly benefitted the USMNT which is the team nearest my heart. I think I'd have a much different attitude, however, if I lived abroad. Both sides of this argument are valid and I just don't think it's wise to dismiss Blatter's point simply because he and Teso are unpopular on this board. That and I think it's really funny that a bunch of Americans (and a Canadian) are talking about how the English should view their situation.
Maybe some of them are whiny trolls who are jealous that other teams are successful with imported players. Have you seen anyone in America crying about the kids who will never live their dream of playing in the NBA because some johnny foreigner? No, because its bull. However, I would like to hear the input from more people in the UK. I understood your sarcasm but i was serious. I really don't know do many 14 year olds plan on playing for a premiership side immediately so why would foreign players be keeping them out. Are foreign players filling out the ranks of local and lower division sides? If so then the influx of foreigners has gone too far. You're point about Jordan was a good one, he was cut by his team and trained hard to improve himself and come back stronger and better. He wasn't the best because his innate natural talent suddenly blossomed, he trained himself throughout his career to improve and become the best. He lost his spot on the team and took it to the playground, couldn't kids over there do the same. Maybe if he'd made the team the first time he would have never learned the lesson of hard work. Players that become great and stay great do it through hard work and competiveness, as well as talent. I assume only that the kids who give up don't have the talent the desire and work ethic to make it. This is a matter of perspective, how many of those players were really mediocre? Can a team culled from best of the top 1% of players in an entire nation really be mediocre, or are they really very good players who only seem poorer by comparison to their international bretheren. I'm saying that no national team really has any mediocre players as these are the ones who never make the team, or even contend for it. Wait, i thought that Blatter was talking about globalization, all i was trying to say i don't think that its really a problem for football especially in comparison with its effects on other injuries. I agree with your main position. But why would your view be different if you lived abroad?, there is plenty of immigration right here in America. Just look at the NBA, NHL, College Athletics, there are plenty of foriegners taking up spots that used to go to American kids. Does that bother you? What is the difference? Don't you think the MLS would benefit from more international players. Just asking. And as far as Teso and Blatters views, i didn't dismiss them, i thought about what they were saying and i simply disagreed with them. If i question something you write, don't take it personally, this is a discussion board and people can still have a discussion without agreeing on everything, no matter what you see on TV. As for your final point,I think that the fact Americans and Canadians are discussing these things shows how much globalization has changed world and the game already.
The England team now is better and has so much more potential than it has for years. The only area really lacking is in goal. Defence - Cole, Bridge, Campbell, Ferdinand, Terry, Woodgate, Johnson, Neville, Upson, King... quality players Midfield - Cole, Beckham, Gerrard, Lampard, Wright-Phillips, maybe even the likes of Downing for the future Attack - Rooney, Owen, Smith, Defoe, plus several other promising youngsters like Carlton Cole (don't laugh!)
So the teams are to suffer because the english youth can't make the grade? Hardly good for football anywhere. If you want to play for your local club, maybe you should start waking up at 6:00 am in the morning to run before school, and make sure you get an hour's worth of practive in each day. To say that the youth in other countries who work harder, shouldn't get on the team before some lazy ass kid in England, whos only admrible trait is that he was born in england is wrong, onesided and biased, for no reason what so ever. There is a youth national team and youth leagues, compete there, if you work hard you'll make it, if someone works harder they'll make it. End of story. Does Spain have a problem, how about Italy, how about Brazil? No because their youth work hard, because they are going to make sure, not african, or american is going to get on the team before them. Simply put, the english youth don't have the same drive. I was there this summer playing, and they don't even have the drive to compete with Canadiens!!! and we have what 3 players outside of a 1st division team.
When I jumped into the argument I knew it was a bad idea because I knew I wasn't going to be bothered to find a bunch of old links but Teso and Sepp aren't the people I was referring to. I've seen more than a few pundits and columnists bemoan the situation. IIRC several have been ex-pros who are still in the biz and should know what they're talking about. I'll try to remember to post links to this thread if I come across any more in the near future. Why aren't Americans complaining about johnny foreigner taking NBA jobs? Because Americans are perfectly OK with less talented white Europeans taking those extremely high-paying jobs away from inner-city African-Americans who don't "deserve" all the bling-bling and Hummers with spinners. Hell, from the way people talk about our "national" basketball team we don't want any of those showboat-type players anyway when we could be boring and win instead. I agree that I'd like to see more UK posters chime in. Huh? It's OK to have tons of foreigners playing in the EPL to get the best possible product but lower division teams shouldn't be allowed to maximize their potential as well? Wouldn't that negate the priniciple behind promotion/relegation by making it virtually impossible for smaller teams to compete? 14 y/o's don't need to plan on starting immediately to be bumped out when foreigners are in youth and reserve squads as well. Also, if they're smart enough to read a paper and see the relative dearth of their countrymen playing at the highest level in their own country more and more of them won't bother trying, which goes back to my Jordan example. As someone who works with kids I can tell you that that's a dangerous assumption and as an Arsenal fan you only need to look to Thierry Henry and Paddy Viera. Have you ever seen how they felt at Juve and Milan? They were ready to throw out the cleats and start flipping burgers. Do they lack talent, desire and work ethic? No, they needed a mentor who gave a sh1t about them. Youth development isn't just about skill training and physical strength, it's character building and ego strenghtening. The world would be a wonderful place if we all had MJ's drive and confidence, but that's an unrealistic expectaion for the vast majority of people. If kids don't see opportunity and encouragement they tend to fail, which in terms of national team football could have long-standing effects. Remember, we're not talking about an adult trying to feed his family, we're talking about kids who have talent but might see more security in a computer or financial adviser career. I didn't think this was the spin your original argument was taking but that's ok. So if you're seeing everything as relative than you can say that no national team has players who are mediocre relative to their own population but they can have player that are mediocre relative to other populations, right? Well, if you're eliminating the youth development for any reason then clearly you will eventually be mediocre next to other populations, especially if you're giving those populations access to your best training methods. So sure, you may be the best you can be on your (self-limited) population but doesn't it suck to see your neighbor beat you after he was trained in your town in the program your season-ticket money built and he took away the spot your kid was going for? He's talking about it in terms of football though. I agree that it's not as big a problem in football as it is in industries that have material influences on people's lives other than entertainment because, in the end, football doesn't really matter. However, we're on bigsoccer, so that's the context we're discussing it in. If I lived abroad and saw my national team declining while previously inferior teams were skyrocketing, at the same time as my local players are being frozen out of teams by players from those same previously inferior teams, I'd be pissed. Honestly, I don't pay enough attention to NBA/NHL/NCAA to have an understanding of how foreign players have influenced them. MLS is a fantastic example. Just look at how far our national team has progressed since it's inception! Limiting the number of foreigners has allowed for greater opportunity for mediocre Americans to be developed into much better players, which has led to far more of them going to Europe and becoming even better players while opening spots in MLS for sub-mediocre players to get that development! Hell, I wish I thought to bring up MLS in my first post! Would more foreigners make MLS better? The games might be more artistic/entertaining but our national team wouldn't have progressed as far as it has. IIRC this has been stated by league officials as one of the main principals behind the cap on foreigners. Sorry, I didn't mean to direct that at you personally but rather the thread as a whole. I rarely take much personally, especially on internet messageboards. Like I said in my initial post, I don't think the 2 sides of this argument will ever agree because both are so clearly right according to their own perspectives/desires. Anyways, it's been fun and I look forward to your reply (although I'm not sure if I have another 1000 words in me for this subject)!