From Bob Mackin in 24Hrs - Major League Soccer senior vice-president Dan Courtemanche said "B.C. Place renovations were key" when it awarded the Vancouver Whitecaps a 2011 expansion franchise. "Until we see or hear any definitive plans that there is going to be a change in the renovations for B.C. Place, then we're moving forward," Courtemanche said. Asked what would happen to Vancouver's entry if the project is delayed or canceled, he said: "We'll cross that bridge when we have to, but it's not something we've discussed."
The quote I read from the Vancouver Sun is more severe than that. Please pay extra attention to the bolded part: 'All of the renovations to BC Place were key in Major League Soccer awarding Vancouver an expansion team," MLS senior vice-president Dan Courtemanche said from the league's New York headquarters. "If things change, we'd have to address that. Clearly it's something that would be addressed by our commissioner and the league's board of governors," Courtemanche said.' http://www.vancouversun.com/sports/Place+roof+falls+under+cloud+uncertainty/1934266/story.html If that doesn't say Vancouver's bid is at risk, I don't know what does.
Oh good grief. This is getting kinda ridiculous. First Portland was having issues now Vancouver is having issues? I hope MLS is going to be open regarding this situation. Hate to see Vancouver loosing their bid and thus killing a natural rivalry with seattle and portland as well as Toronto.
<I>$$$. It will cost $$$ to remove the inflatable dome, and install a Seattle style cover. The lower levels would also have to be able to sustain rain (and it rains in Vancouver) and rennovations would have to be made to ensure the lower level is flood resistant. This all costs $$$. Also, there is no guarantee the BC Lions would want to play without a roof. For all we know, the BC Lions may have agreed to the original plan because they were assured they could play with a covered roof, which the retractable roof provided</I> Perhaps I wasn't clear. First the suggestion that I made about a Seattle style seating cover is basically a TARP over the upper seating so it just looks like ads rather then a mess of empty seats. That would work ether in an open air field OR the domed stadium. So if the inflated dome is still in place, it could still be used for soccer if the field is brought up to FIFA levels. Going to my point about the field being no worse situation then several other places in the league. And I firmly believe that with the level of support a Whitecaps MLS team would have, that it would be a tempory home and they would move to their own place in a few years. These other issues you have on drainage and Lions approval are bringing up some the very issues that the BC should think of before they go back on the renovation plan. The BC government should be bending over backwards to make this happen, because I see BC Place being a very empty white elephant in a few years if it remains as is.
Agreed, We should all voice our concerns and ideas to Garbers mail box and help by e-mailing to the addresses on the other thread in Vancouvers forum....................Well Go On.
B.C. wants developers to help pay for a new roof or build a new stadium at BC Place. Photograph by: Peter Battistoni, Vancouver Sun files VANCOUVER — Faced with having to spend $360 million of taxpayers’ money to put a retractable roof on BC Place Stadium, the Liberal government has begun exploring another option. Why not throw the massive redevelopment project open to the private sector, using Premier Gordon Campbell’s favourite development model — a private-public partnership deal? And as the government ponders that so-called P3 possibility, it’s now leading to even larger questions being asked behind closed doors. Why put a $360-million retractable roof on BC Place Stadium at all? If the private sector is willing to share the risks in a public-private partnership, why not revisit the idea of building a waterfront soccer stadium, with hotel and convention space? That could revive the dream of billionaire Greg Kerfoot for a waterfront soccer stadium for the Vancouver Whitecaps. That in turn opens the possibility of using BC Place Stadium, now three decades old, for other events, such as conventions. Or even tearing it down. And that provincial land around the old stadium could be used to build up office, retail and entertainment complexes that could create a brand-new entertainment district in downtown Vancouver. Nothing is firmed up yet. But what’s being blue-skied here at the top level of the Liberal government could be the largest urban land development project in Vancouver since the buildup of False Creek after Expo 86. It’s also reminiscent of how major stadiums are built and financed in the United States. And why not? It may not all pan out, but the thinking is bold. The 2010 Olympics offers another moment, like Expo 86, for Vancouver to transform itself. After Expo 86, the False Creek lands were built into a residential development that energized the city and helped the city win international recognition. The redevelopment of the underutilized waterfront north of Gastown and land around BC Place would do the same thing. Such big ideas aren’t without risks, of course. In P3s, the government ultimately backstops the deal if it goes sour. There would have to be some serious modeling here. But the Liberals believe in P3s, the models used to improve the Sea to Sky Highway to Whistler and the Canada Line connecting Vancouver to Richmond and the international airport. Moreover, many members of the provincial government would love to keep massive redevelopments such as a retractable roof off the government’s books and out of the hands of its Crown corporations. Many still remember the Vancouver convention centre expansion, which was built by a Crown Corporation and cost almost $900 million, double the original budget. So far, the Campbell government’s P3 projects have come in on budget and on time. Oddly, the debate about offering the redevelopment of BC Place Stadium and other lands to the private sector has come out of the government’s current budgetary crisis. How, the cabinet asked itself, can the government possibly justify a massive, $360-million splurge on a roof when its revenues are tumbling by the billions, services are being cut and the HST is being leveled on consumers? That led to the idea of considering BC Place’s new retractable roof as a P3. In turn, that has led to exploratory discussions whether Kerfoot, the owner of the Whitecaps, or other investors, may be interested in taking a major stake in a major development. In return, investors would take a share of revenues from the stadium as well as surrounding real estate developments. It’s unclear to what extent some property might be privatized or whether the government would retain shares in some or all of the property. The provincial government is also hoping that a major corporation may buy the rights to put its name on a completed stadium, whether it be BC Place or a new soccer stadium. Such a branding opportunity could be worth $25 million or more. This is a huge, still fuzzy idea, of course. But the government believes that a private-sector proposal roughing out what is possible could be sketched out in a matter of weeks or months. Without private-sector proposals for a P3, some key cabinet ministers say the retractable roof for BC Place will have to be delayed or cancelled. Not everyone loves P3s, of course. But if this idea— or even a part of it — is realized it may be good politics for Premier Gordon Campbell, who is watching his popularity drop like a rock. First, it would create thousands of jobs. It’s estimated the construction of a retractable roof, for example, would create 1,500 person years of jobs on-site and another 1,500 in spinoffs. The construction of buildings of residential, real estate and office buildings surrounding BC Place is expected to generate 5,500 person years of jobs. The construction would get underway shortly after the end of the Olympics next winter. That would give a much needed boost to the sagging B.C. economy that would stretch into 2013. Guess what’s scheduled for then? Yes, the provincial election, in which the premier said Thursday he will be seeking a fourth term. Will there be private-sector buyers for this idea during the Great Recession? Hard to say. Recessions do end, though. And with the 2010 Olympics only five months away, there’s one thing for sure. The provincial government has a singular moment to blue-sky this deal for the world to buy. mcernetig@vancouversun.com
not a big fan of P3's. Having said that, if it means that the Whitecaps will be playing in a new waterfront soccer specific stadium with a grass pitch, I'd be more than happy to live with it. Clearly it wouldn't be ready for 2011 should they choose to go that route. Hopefully MLS would be cool with a couple (few) years of playing at BC Place. Wonder where the BC Lions would play if they do tear down BC Place. I'm not in favour of a Whitecaps/Lions partnership. That would probably equal field turf instead of a natural pitch. This story gets more interesting by the minute!
the waterfront stadium is dead for a least 7 years-- get over it! the P3 will be the answer because its saleable to the public-- and it allows the caps, and maybe the lions, to revenue share, which is what i said would happen from the beginning 2 retractable roofs in bc's climate and the flexibility of seating from 20 000 to 60 000 is a winner IMO who the hell wants to be in a waterfront stadium in april and october when the winds are howling, the rain is pelting and the temps are hovering around 60 F? only the most die-hard fans, like me, will be there bc place stadium, when renovated, will be a great site-- and it gives revenue sharing to the caps-- did i say BIG teams visiting like man united and barcelona, the womens world cup 2015, MLS cup, etc and kerfoot gets to keep his expensive land on the waterfront and develop or trade it its the best we are going to get IMO-- its all a game being played out-- this-- a P3/revenue sharing- has been decided a long time ago
Friends of Soccer has weighed in: http://friendsofsoccer.blogspot.com/2009/08/friends-of-soccer-requests-clarity-and.html In light of the speculation in the past week over the future of BC Place, Friends of Soccer has sent the following letter to Premier Campbell and the entire Liberal caucus to seek clear answers and a solution to the issue: _______ Dear Premier Campbell, Almost four months ago, your government was re-elected on a platform based on building opportunities for economic growth, bringing long term benefits for the people of British Columbia. The renovation of BC Place stadium was one of the projects designed to create jobs now, and to drive millions of dollars of economic activity in a time when all of our core industries are struggling. It was a promise your party proclaimed dozens of times to the electorate, and your party took every opportunity during the campaign to slam your opponents when they showed uncertainty about the project. The confusing statements and lack of clarity regarding the future of BC Place over this past week has been damaging to the industries that are trying to plan for B.C.'s post-Olympic future. It has raised questions over the future viability of major professional sporting events, concerts and trade shows in B.C. It has caused grave uncertainty in the construction industry, who need jobs now, and has handcuffed the tourism and hospitality industries' ability to plan for the future. We urge you, for the sake of B.C.'s economy, to find solutions to complete this project, and to make a clear statement that your government is committed to completing it. Throughout the world, governments are battling the recession through strategic investments in capital infrastructure, and it's working. We know from the history of past recessions and the Great Depression that cutbacks to infrastructure spending only increases unemployment and keeps the economy stagnated in recession for longer periods of time. Future generations are also robbed of the net benefits of improved infrastructure. A fully renovated B.C. Place Stadium will be a net contributor to the economy. Those are the types of projects this province needs right now. Hundreds of construction jobs would be created immediately. Hundreds of long-term permanent jobs would be directly created through the operation of BC Place. The growth in the number and quality of events that could be held at BC Place would create renewed prosperity for our tourism and hospitality sector. In 2011, Major League Soccer is scheduled to come to Vancouver. As we have seen recently in Seattle and Toronto, the impact this will have on Vancouver and the province will be surprising and profound. Thousands travel across the continent every season to follow their team. Millions watch around the world as the games are beamed onto TV screens across Europe, Asia and South America. Recently, the City of Portland predicted the arrival of MLS in their city will generate up to $50 million a year in economic activity. Portland is one of the U.S. cities hit hardest by the recession, yet they see the wisdom in making infrastructure investments that allow them to grow in the future. It would be shortsighted to jeopardize that future now in B.C.. On top of this, the economic benefits of the major concerts, trade shows and sporting events (such as the 2011 Grey Cup) are well documented. Without a fully renovated BC Place stadium, these events fall into question as well. Four months ago, Friends of Soccer chastised your opponents on this issue and reminded them that citizens expect governments to be able to address a host of issues. We expect government to provide sustainable services, while providing the opportunities for economic growth and the freedom to provide a good quality of life for our families. To say we must choose between them in our society is a false choice. We are writing to remind you of that today. We urge your government to be clear and upfront on your intentions regarding the BC Place renovations, and work with all stakeholders involved to find solutions to the issue. Sincerely yours, Bill Currie Friends of Soccer www.friendsofsoccer.org
How so? The Waterfront stadium, proposed by Kerfoot, was going to be paid entirely by the Whitecaps. That's only one "P" : private funds.
I love how you think all these twists and turns are some grand conspiracy planned out 3 years ago; and you are the man with the inside knowledge.
IMO your the kind of supporter who gets pissed if any1 is able to think outside the box-- it should not take a genius like you to figure out that the waterfront stadium will NOT go ahead-- by 2016, i will have 12 years of being right about waterfront stadium-- so go home and sulk in your cornflakes-- bc place will be a great stadium and the idea of P3 does not surprise me-- i've been saying for almost 1 year that the caps would have revenue sharing at the stadium somehow-- and that is all i have said supporters like u can not handle a difference of opinion, a debate of ideas without getting personal go down to the waterfront stadium in late march/april and sit there for several hours and pretend there is a game going on-- that's 1 reason why the stadium at the waterfront is a bad idea after 2016, who knows? maybe false creek flats or they will stay at bc place
FYI-- i've been a supporter of the caps/86'ers/caps since the early 1970's-- yah i know-- an old fart-- held season tickets for all but 5 years since the beginning to now-- traveling outside the country-- they have my deposits for 2011-- i wear the shirt as much as any1